mr. gamvroulas. i regret the clock has run down. i yield back. >> the chair will recognize the gentleman from illinois, mr. gutierrez. >> thank you for calling this hearing. i would like to ask miss tulli, why is the error rate for naturalized u.s. citizens, what is it according to a naturalized u.s. citizens in the e-verify system what is the error rate? >> there are a lot of facts and figures and contain more in my testimony, naturalized u.s. citizens are 30 times more likely to experience an error and we estimate based on statistical model included in the last batch that if this were to go to scale, 1.2 million americans and legally authorized workers are going to experience an error. >> why do you think so? that is pretty high. >> that is a lot of workers. >> a lot of people. >> we are here suggesting the error rate needs to be as close to perfect as possible. when a government error can stand between an american citizen and their ability to work, that is a problem. as we consider making this program mandatory as part of immigrat

mr. chris gamvroulas is president of ivy development, the land act acquisition and affiliate in salt lake city, utah. chris joined in 1993 and was appointed president in 1996. since that time he has overseen the land acquisition of hundreds of acres of commercial properties totaling nearly $1 billion in real estate assets. he attended harvard business school advanced management program and holds a bachelor's of science degree in political science from the university of utah. mr. randall k. johnson, pending before congress and the federal agencies. before joining u.s. chamber, he served as u.s. counselor to the u.s. house of representatives committee on education and the work force. mr. johnson is a graduate of the university of maryland school of law and earned his magser of laws and -- master of laws and labor relations from georgetown. and finally ms. emily tully is policy attorney for the national immigration haw center. her advocacy focuses on maintaining and expanding the rights of low-wage worker, and she analyzes -- [inaudible] she holds a jd from the college of william and mary in