the one piece of information that i got from john is that -- mr. haley, is that if we did not use this level of overtime we would not provide the 98% of service we are providing, it would sink to 96 pk or below level service. the bottom line is, if we don't use overtime, you are impacting service delivery. >> one additional fact i want to point out if a statistical standpoint, scheduled overtime, built into the skell jewels, built off the contract an scheduling capabilities but built off the work rules and policies in our contracts, is approximately 80% of the overtime that you're seeing here. there's actually the remain 20g% is kind of what you call management discretion or unscheduled overtime that we do have some clear day-to-day responsibility in terms of controlling. as we go through these contract negotiations, once we hopefully have a negotiated contract or arbitrated contract, that will change the rules of the game in some way in terms of overtime usage, sick leave usage, all those things that we have discussed with you as a board. >> so the mess