mr. jaffer, how would you add to this? >> mr. johnson, i think you're absolutely right to be worried about the way that these powers will be used. if you look at the way that similar powers were used before fisa was enacted and there were all kinds of abuses and members of congress that were wiretapped and journalists who were wiretapped and supreme court justices who were wiretapped and there was a member of congress who nsa sought to wiretap in 2006 and 2007 and in the same "new york times" story, and history shows us that these kinds of broad surveillance powers will be abused and that's part of the reason why you need to set up limits now to make sure that doesn't happen. >> the gentleman's time has expired and the gentleman from tennessee, mr. corn. >> thank you, sir. i want to follow up with an article. i must have missed that one. they had been listening in on the conversations of judges? >> the church committee report goes into some detail about that, but that was back in '70s. >> that's right. that's right. >> we don't h

mr. jaffer, do you have a problem with the fisa court's competence in reviewing on an annual basis the procedures that are used by the intelligence community to conduct these programs, that is the programs have an annual review? >> i don't think the question is one of competence. i think it's one of the court's jurisdiction and the court's mandate. the question is, has the court been given the authority to actually ask the government why it's engaged in this kind of surveillance and who its targets are. >> your question is you don't know whether that's the case or you believe that's not the case? >> i don't think there is enough public information to know anything. the court has acted. >> your statement that there's a failure to have an auditing process of the procedures they use, that then leads you to talk about this being a dragnet is based on lack of sufficient information in the public domain make that judgment? >> there two things. the statute itself which authorizes the dragnet surveillance and the obama administration has not disagreed with that. >> they didn't call it dragnet but go ahea