mr. kneedler, what are the limitations? >> six years, i think it would be. >> has there been any reserves created in the last six years? >> i think the last one was 2009, 2010. i wanted to correct one fact. >> explain to me why the market for raisins is inelastic? people won't buy more raisins if they are cheaper? >> that's exactly correct. it's just the quality of raisins and there's a limited set of outlets. raisins are primarily used as food ingredients in raisin bran and stuff like that and the price doesn't affect demand. and, therefore, if you put a great surplus on the domestic market the prices will crater. this has a very sensible approach. >> mr. kneedler, you don't have to convince us that this is a sensible program for you to prevail, do you? >> no. >> because we could think that this is a ridiculous program, correct? >> but it's one that's been around since 1949 and petition's argument means that every argument since 1949 has had a per sake takings. >> it would help that your case is ridiculous. you acknowledge