mr. norquist now really be pushed aside by the party? >> grover norquist is a survivor. he has a business, $7 million budget. spent $25 million in campaigns this cycles. he doesn't want to be seen as a dead-ender. he doesn't want his power to melt away bite by bite win the views like that. what we saw today was him providing a little path for republicans and, yeah, that very colorful point about the murder weapon, but he went on to say that republicans need to push for reform which speaker boehner has been doing, and to be clear about it, and he said the deal needs to be able to pass the laugh test back home. and he says it needs to be done in public. he wants it done on cnbc or on c-span the way some people wanted the health care deal done. so his argument is that if republicans are up front about what they want and what they're pushing for, they'll be able to survive whatever deal they ultimately have to go along with. >> you say mr. norquist wants to see it done in public. isn't that what we are seeing to a certain extent right now? we had speaker boehner out making h

mr. norquist for a stalemate that is coming up. they are all putting their markers down. what are you hearing about what is going to happen over the next couple of weeks? >> it seems like there is a little bit of room on the middle on taxes. we just are talking about tax policy. the president has said he wants the wealthy to pay more. john boehner has said they will not increase tax rates on anyone. they will put revenue on the table. maybe there is a middle ground for they cannot have their rates go up. >> you're seeing that shift in town right now of republicans talking about this in terms of the loophole closings and that kind of thing. the question is when you do that, do you do that at the end of the year as part of this fiscal cliff package? two-part to do it next year as part of the tax reform deal? that is where the rub is going to be right now. i do not think anybody has figured out when you do these revenue increases. >> we have only heard from the leaders. speaker john boehner had mixed success on getting the rank and file republicans. do we know what they're r

mr. grover norquist from americans for tax reform. i know alan simpson has never been a big fan of yours, but what do you think about what he that had to say yesterday, especially after the election? >> well, he's left similar rambling statements on our voicemail at the office. alan simpson ranting is not news. the proposal that he put together and that people like paul ryan rejected back in 2010 would take taxes as a percentage of gdp from 18.5% during full employment, the average over the last 30 years, to 21%. that's a 2.5% of gdp tax increase or $5 trillion tax increase over the next decade. he tends not to mention that. add to that $1 trillion in limiting deductions -- >> okay, you're deep in the weeds here, grover. first of all, did alan simpson really leave a message on your voicemail? >> oh, several. rambling and long and inane. yes. >> all right. now, even john boehner and mitch mcconnell came out of that meeting in the white house and used the word revenue. it's on want table. they are acknowledging they will raise revenue.

american voter i go to the taxpayers look and vote republican yes our republican voters and even if mr norquist didn't stand up a dear friend of mine and say by the way i want to remind people this is an important issue those voters would mr chambliss isn't afraid of what grover is going to do to him he's afraid of what georgia republican voters are going to do they have and if we want to understand what's going on in the washington fight today we need to understand we really are red and blue states and america where republicans predominate they have different views or democrats are going to have are both states. you know because of winner take all we we end up with these majority. you know parliamentary because it hurts all because of the bruises but yeah i you know i do a radio show for three hours every day it's on dish network direct t.v. sirius x.m. i get so many calls from from liberals in red states and from conservatives and blue states i mean it we're a purple nation it's what you know the the states regardless of whether we're a purple nation or not the states where one party dominate

mr. norquist. he's playing the bad cop and other republicans are playing the good cop saying, look, violate the almighty grover norquist pledge. we won't raise the rates and they're doing a trick where the democrats give us entitlement spending cuts instead. who is head of the republican party. a lot of people think it's john boehner. is it this guy right here? [ buzzer ] not him. a lot of people think it's grover norquist. is it grover? no not him either. [ buzzer ] so who is it? you got to understand, the politicians take their orders from their donors. and grover norquist is not the mr. donor himself.se. he he f fnels the donor money. who is actually in charge? these guys. this is lloyd blankfine and david coast, they're also on this thing called the ceo fiscal leadership council. what is that? that's a bunch of ceos who got together and said, all right no more being zealot, increases or any kind of revenue increases fine. but obama is offering an awesome deal. let's take it, it's over. they're s

mr. norquist can give some ground. robert reich, did you ever expect that we would be reading an editorial where the "wall street journal" is telling grover norquist that he's got to give ground on the tax increase? >> no, i didn't. election day does magical things to the "wall street journal" and to a lot of the republican right. they are sounding difsht than before. some of them actually learned a lesson. another aspect of the leverage the president has and this is the republican nightmare, that on january 2nd, democrats come back with legislation that says we are going to have a tax cut for the middle class and then, what do republicans do? at that particular point in time, have got to vote for this or else they look like they are essentially which is what they are, shows for the rich and grover norquist is going to have to say you must vote for this. this is a tax cut. this is the republican nightmare and it is coming. they see it coming and they don't dare use their old threat to put against a raising the debt ceil

mr. norquist but i'm not hearing leading republicans in the house say this. is it that important and isn't that where the battle is going to be fought? >> absolutely. and that has been the problem in the past. i mean, because the conventional wisdom is that this senate is more conciliatory and has to compromise more because one guy can filibuster forever. the house districts are getting more and more partisan. whether it's through gerrymandering, the conservatives is more conservative. and that does not leave a lot of room in the middle for good, buy part son negotiations. the current kind of blood sport makes it all the harder. >> jared bernanke stestein and cottle, thank you for your time this evening. >> thank you, rev. >>> coming up, fox news keeps saying that the libya scandal is a scandal. and the truth came out on air today. we'll show you the bizarre ending to an interview today. >>> and big news tonight. ambassador susan rice will meet face-to-face with john mccain tomorrow. >>> plus, he's the wrong with everything wrong with politics in america and

mr. norquist and his infamous pledge may be up against the ropes. that and much more right after the break. at cepacol we've heard people are going to extremes to relieve their sore throats. oh, okay, you don't need to do that. but i don't want any more of the usual lozenges and i want new cooling relief! ugh. how do you feel? now i'm cold. hmm. this is a better choice. new cepacol sensations cools instantly, and has an active ingredient that stays with you long after the lozenge is gone. ahhh. not just a sensation sensational relief. [ voice of dennis ] ...safe driving bonus check? every six months without an accident, allstate sends a check. ok. [ voice of dennis ] silence. are you in good hands? where you don't back down from a challenge. this is the age of knowing how to make things happen. so, why let erectile dysfunction get in your way? talk to your doctor about viagra. 20 million men already have. ask your doctor if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take viagra if you take nitrates for chest pain; it may cause an unsafe drop in bl

mr. norquist on the show e to explain why his pledge will hold, but he declined. so joining me now are two folks who have experience watching the pledge distort american politics and scotch many a deal. robert riech and now the president of the center for american progress, thank you both for joining me tonight. >> great to be with you. >> i want to begin with you, robert. does this feel different to you? pretty much the the first thing you guys did was propose a budget to reduce the deficit and it included a lot of tax increases and you didn't get one republican vote because of them. do you think republicans are cracking now? do you feel something different in the air? >> undoubtedly something different is in the air. it's called an election victory. but i will believe when i see it that republicans beginning to agree to a tax increase. grover norquist's pledge, the idea that somehow these republicans owe more of an allegiance to grover norquist than to the constitution or the american people, that is becoming difficult for a lot of republicans to sustain. the ot

mr. norquist, a powerful lobbyist, has long had a lock on nearly every republican in congress.that keeps reminding us george h.w. bush lost the election after violating his read my lips, no new taxes pledge. >> if you want to go to the v t voters -- >> still, democrats are heartened by the new grover is over mini movement. although they shouldn't do the happy dance just yet. republicans will want payback, as in medicare, medicaid and social security. so for all of you who want tax hikes for the wealthy, what are you willing to give up in return? on social security? raising the retirement age to 70? on medicare, a total revamp is in instead of the government paying your medicare bills, you pay them with help from the government? you tell me. talk back question this morning, what should republicans expect in return for new taxes? facebook.com/carolcnn. facebook.com/carolcnn. your comments later this hour. >>> more republican lawmakers -- well, as i just said, they're willing to break that no new tax pledge. we'll talk about that with our political panel, next. we use this board t

mr. norquist's political acumen post election? entlemen, i'm blushing from your phrase but the truth is grover norquist make this is extremely easy. he's a one-trick pony. i knew exactly what he's going to say because it's the exact same thing he was saying before the election when he predicted with confidence that mitt romney would win, republicans would take the senate, we would almost instantly have the paul ryan budget implemented with all of the entitlement reforms. now he's carrying right on saying, in fact, the republicans are in a stronger position today and government is on the run more than ever before. look, he has to do this to kind of keep his troops in line. his troops largely being the house republicans. but i heard from republicans on the senate side who are saying, you know, grover is really no longer speaking for the party here. something really has changed and i think this is a rear guard action he's doing to just kind of slow down the pace of the retreat. >> the thing about it is i have never blamed grover by hi

mr. norquist are part of the problem. interesting calling out those republicans by the wall street editorial. norquist is a bit of a media creation. remember this. he's an easily digestible symbol of ideological purity. the people who actually police that purity are groups like the anti-tax, pro economic growth club for growth. it's barely been three weeks since senate republicans wrapped up another losing cycle where thanks to candidates like missouri's todd akin or indiana's richard mourdocks they failed to knock off a single democratic incumbent and already it's deja vu all over again. shelly capito is experienced, popular, deep roots in her home state. and before the democratic incumbent jay rockefeller had time to criticize her, barely an hour after her news conference, it was conservative groups who began to attack her. helped richard mourdock take down indiana republican senator richard lugar, the first with a press release saying her candidacy will undoubtedly be cheered by the g 0 op establishment. congresswoman c

mr. norquist doesn't have such power. the voters do. he had the wit to channel the electorate's limited government beliefs into a single issue enforcement mechanism. long-time ally of norquist, jack abramoff who joins me in a moment said simply, news of grover's demise is premature. but in recent interviews, norquist has begun to sound like a petulant leader on the way out. >> the pledge is not for l.i.e. everybody who signed the pledge including peter king, who tried to weasel out of it, shame on him as the new york sun said today, i hope his wife understands that commitments last a little longer than two years or something. >> eliot: warren buffett continued to be the pragmatic voice of the majority. >> i think there is a general feeling among the american public certainly and even among many in congress that the rich like me have been getting away with low tax rates and it is time to make the tax rates more progressive. >> eliot: for more on the fiscal cliff negotiations, i'm joined by congressman peter welch, democrat from vermont. t

mr. norquist himself expressed this morning in somewhat colorful language. >> no pledge taker has voted for tax increase. we've had some people discussing impure thoughts on national television. we would certainly highlight who has kept their commitment and who hasn't. >> yet, so far those impure thoughts have not crossed into taboo territory of raising tax rates on the wealthy. rather, these so-called reasonable republicans have expressed a willingness to close loopholes and cap deductions. sound familiar? yes, thus far congressional republicans' biggest concession is to embrace the tax plan of the losing presidential candidate, mitt romney. and if mr. romney's recent trouncing at the polls wasn't enough evidence, a new survey shows a majority of americans support a balanced approach. two-thirds say that any agreement should include a mix of spending cuts and tax increases with just under one in three saying a deal should only include spending cuts. of course, only 28% say that those in washington will act like responsible adults in this matter with 67% saying they'll behave like spoiled c

mr. norquist, if peter king changes his mind in order to help the very people you just described that willamerican economy, then he's more likely to commit adultery? is that what he's saying? >> his wife should be far more ashamed of peter if he were to let himself be bullied by this guy grover. i mean, grover seems to be a mild-tempered guy but he employs these bullying intimidation tactics. the republican party should say, look, i'm bigging than that, i answer to my quaeconstituents. who are you to tell me how i can best served the needs of this country. grover norquist couldn't get elected to anything, dog catcher even. yet he's out there intimidating all these folks that some of whom really want to do the right thing and now is the time when they have to do the right thing, when they have to be patriots and that's what this is about. are you going to put the interests of your country and your constituents above special interests that grover norquist has and the threat that he holds of pouring millions of dollars into your campaign? if that's the only way you're going to get re-elected,

mr. norquist. of the need to compromise with president obama the journal counseled -- quote -- "this is where mr. norquist can give some ground. if taxes are going up anyway because the bush rates expire and republicans scan canada stop them from going up as much as they otherwise would, pledge takers deserve some credit for that." we disagree with the forms of revenues most republicans have in mind. many of the republicans expressing openness to revenues want to pursue them only through tax reform next year and even then they're only willing to consider limits of deductions as opposed to rate increases on the ver wealthiest. democrats, on the other hand, believe that even if republicans want to kick tax reform into 2013, a significant downpayment on revenues must be enacted before january 1. and we further believe that the fairest, most straightforward way to make that down payment on revenues is by decoupleling the bush tax cuts for the wealthy, limiting deductions is a necessary raising revenue

mr. norquist mr.hlt would you say he is doom and gloom or a realist that is taking a very clear look at the dire straits of the economy without -- and how he sees it? >> there's a forward looking and backward looking component. i think in the backward looking component, i think that when you have a decent cries like this you cannot compare it to 1982. you cannot compare this to ronald reagan. you have to look at really deep, systemic financial crisis around the world that the u.s. has had. and then the recovery is still tepid, but not compared to those. it's much better than a lot of countries have been doing since 2007 and it's better than earlier united states recoveries when you look at unemployment when we've had deep banking crises. that said, nobody is happy with this. we would like to have a path to faster growth going forward. >> ken rogoff. let's get right to ali velshi. i want to ask you a question. under the establishment survey data, we start break out the actual jobs, nonfarm payment, hea

mr. norquist's picture. several months ago i said look, there are two options. option for after the election. after the election if iran is elected with republicans, if he was elected he would have republicans and it go along with republican house, what would happen if they would pass the ryan plan taking corporate and individual taxes for 25% top rate, having a territorial tax system rather than a worldwide tax system. and on the spending side the ryan plan which is in time reform, all the means tested programs would be blocked granted and the medicare would be premium support, and this would, drops from obama's spending plan about $6 trillion over the next decade, which on track toward a balanced budget. that's still the republican plan for winning of the house, senate, presidency. but they did can either the white house or the senate in this election. so that option moves off into the have a different president and a different senate. where are we now? now we have divided them to get republican house, give democrats, obama reelected and the senate with the de

mr. norquist said no for promoting his no new taxes pledge to gop lawmakers. politico's chief white house correspondent mike allen will lead off the discussion with issues of questions. we expected to get underway in just a moment like you on c-span2. -- live here on c-span2. [inaudible conversations] >> thanks for coming out. this is two weeks in a row. [inaudible] we appreciate your being here. we are excited to have grover norquist, president of americans for tax reform. welcome all. [inaudible] people who are following us on twitter, tweet us at hash tag -- [inaudible] we will take questions. we want to thank bank of america supporting these series, these issues. those that matter most to us. today we're going to talk about a very important issue -- [inaudible] we appreciate bank of america. [inaudible] we would love to take your questions. i would love to bring up grover norquist. good morning, grover. [applause] >> thank you very much. thank you very much for coming out. [inaudible] look, here's the challenge. group the republican party, the party that w

. >> have you grover norquist. >> mr. anti tax himself. grover norquist. >> the president elected on the basis he was not romney and romney was a poopy head. >> poopy head. >> he actually said that. >> grover norquist or grover from "sesame street?" >> the fiscal cliff. >> move into high gear this week. >> taxes on the table. >> that's a given. >> some could be splintering. >> we know there has to be revenues. >> they really won't i don't think. >> i think that's a given. >> that suggests compromise. >> republicans might blink on this. >> you don't have to compromise values to come to the table. >> if there was a mandate, it was a mandate to work together. >> america has clearly said they have had enough. >> newton malloy gingrich has been in politics 40 years. 40 long years. and finally -- finally -- newt realizes he doesn't understand america. >> i was wrong last week, as was virtually every major republican analyst. you have to stop and say to yourself, if i was that far off, what do i need to learn to better understand america? >> forme

mr. norquist, versus a tax increase from i think at this point illogical and irrational tax cuts into the indefinite future. so i call on our friends in the house of representatives to pass that bill and give the vast majority of americans relief from whatever uncertainty there might be about going beyond the january 1 deadline. the second thing i wanted to address was to respond briefly to my friend from arizona, senator kyl, who spoke about the filibuster and the rules changes that are being discussed in this chamber. he spoke this morning and i had the chance to watch a good part of his remarks on the television, and i wanted to respond in a couple of ways. first of all i have the highest regard for senator kyl. we work closely together trying to get a cybersecurity compromise, we worked together years ago on the immigration compromise, i've seen him in action on this senate floor, he is very able, and when he has reached an agreement with his colleagues he is unshakeable and his word is good and i really think very highly of him although we don't agree politically on a great number of

mr. norquist says it violates his pledge to eliminate deductions without lowering rates but at the currentc and political moment it is also a service if republicans prevent tax rates from going up. providing some cover there. have republicans effectively caved on the idea of raising revenue? >> i don't think republicans have caved on anything related to taxes. we do have to remember that it is possible to bring in more revenue without raising taxes. any time you stimulate economic growth that's going to bring in more revenue. i want more revenue because i want more economic growth. that's the best way to bring in more revenue, to fund government programs. >> i guess senator ron brownstein from national journal. what is your leverage if there is a stalemate? all of the bush tax cuts expire and rates go up for everyone, what is your leverage to prevent an increase in rates at least for those at the very top as president and all democrats are demanding? >> that's one of the problems that we have. one of the reasons we're calling this the fiscal cliff. if we do nothing then we go off that clif

mr. norquist.ther folks hog feel like yeah, i generally don't want higher taxes but i got to make sure i'm taking care of constituents and doing the right thing for the country may be able to move in a way that feels totally right with their conscience. money does matter in elections but it's not the only thing that matters. a lot of people spent a lot of money to try to unelect people and didn't always win. >> his relevance is about over because you know, i think that the american people have spoken. the american people have said they want what the president had been talking about, fairness. that's what's important, not just taking a stand idea logically and saying it's going to be my way or the highway and you sign this pledge and we're not going to do what's in the best interests of this country. that's not what made this country. it's fairness. that was the president's message. we're going to make sure democrats -- we want democrats and republicans to work together. we're tired of washington an

mr. norquist and his bunch came in saying it's a $2 trillion tax increase. that was crap. then on the other side, we are eviscerating, taking away medicare and social security. that's false. as long as people are willing to look at on a tax side that we can raise revenue without soaking rich people and making them pay 50% of their income, on the sniment side if we recognize when social security was founded the life expectancy in this country was 63. today it's 79. you're not driving a 1935 automobile, neither am i, and to look at these programs in the light of 2012 isn't cutting people. it's saying we got to figure out a better way. the political calculation some of these folks make is that senior citizens are greedy. senior citizens are not greedy. but they want to receive what they paid into. they would also buy into the argument that their grandchildren should be protected. they love their grandchildren just as much as they love themselves. host: hear from patricia, democratic caller joining us from harvey, louisiana. go ahead. chris: yes. my concern is i was wondering

mr. norquist. >> several months ago i said there are two options for after the election. after the election, if romney was elected, he would have republican senate to go along with the house. they would pass the ryan plan, taking corporate and individual taxes to a 25% top rate, and having a territorial tax system rather than a worldwide tax system. on the spending side, do the ryan plan -- have entitlement reform, the means tested programs would be block granted. and the medicare would be premium support. this would drop from obama's spending plans about $6 trillion over the next decade. puts you on track towards a balanced budget. that is still the republican plan for when they have the house and senate and the presidency, but they did not get the white house or the senate in this election. that option moves off until you have a different president and senate. now we have a divided government. republican house, obama reelected, and a democrat majority in the senate enough republican votes to have -- to filibuster. we got the status quo. obama sometimes talks as if the s

mr. capehart, you're a real smart guy. do you think grover norquistas a mandate among republicans anymore? >> right now, no. but as time goes along, he very well might. leave aside grover norquist's very eloquent political analysis even though it's wrong. like i said before, the american people went into the voting booth on november 6th knowing exactly what president obama wanted to do in terms of taxing the wealthy. they support what he wants to do in terms of taxing the wealthy, and, you know, with the president leaving the white house and going out and trying to sell the american people, bring the american people along to put pressure on congress, he's taking a page out of his old playbook with the payroll tax cut. that's what he did to bring the republicans to heel on that issue and he's going to have to do it again and he is going to do it again on this issue. he has to. >> all right. >> you know, michael -- >> julian, this is a kobe buzzer beater. you have to get it in ten seconds. >> well, look, i just think the president has to play a much tou

it sounds like norquist better watch out for mrs. king. >> the fact that he brought my wife into it, i think he never met me, he certainly hasn't met my wife. he better hope he doesn't. she'll knock his head off. >> all right, president obama wants supporters to go on twitter as washington takes on the fiscal cliff. he's asking people to use the #my2k to explain what they would do with the $2,000 that could be lost to a middle class tax hike. one user talks about buying a mac book. the other talks about the child they're expecting and making the mortgage. but the president is also finding some critics. one of whom wants details on spending cuts. tennessee republican congresswoman marcia blackburn is not thrilled with the fact that all the chair manships voted on yesterday, 19 out of 21, none of them went to women. she says women should be elevated any time there's an opportunity. >>> mitt romney isn't just having lunch with president obama today. he's also seeing running mate paul ryan for the first time since the election. finally,

mr. norquist is known for promoting his tax increase pledge to the gop lawmakers.is man for rum is hosted by the center for national interests. >> there may be some breaches we will do the next time. >> he talked about taxes, about u.s. economic policy, but it was about taxes in the electoral campaign. we had elections in the tax center for very important political debate and at the center of the negotiations between the obama administration and the congress particularly the republican controlled house of representatives. and as i watched the president during his recent press conference as the recent leaders of the house i think everybody agrees that it would be highly desirable to each to compromise and they also agree buddy elections provided a mandate. but the president seems to think he is the one who got the mandate and that the republicans are saying well, yes, mr. president and how do you reconcile the two mandates? and how do you reach an agreement and what are the consequences of failing to do so? this is one of the most important issues facing the adminis

mr. grover norquist. >> several months ago i said there are two options.er the election, it bond is like it -- if romney was elected, he would have republican senate to go along with the house. it would pass the ryan plan and have a territorial tax system rather than a worldwide tax system. on the spending side, do that and have a reform, the means tested programs would be block granted. and the medicare would be premium support. this would drop from obama's spending plans about $6 children over the next decade. put you on track towards a balanced budget. that is still the republican plan for when they have the house and senate but they did not get the white house or the senate in this election. that option mustafa -- moves off until you have a different president and senate. now we have a divided government. republican house, obama reelected, and a democrat majority in the senate enough republican votes to have -- to filibuster. we got the status quo. obama sometimes talks as if the status quo he got was the 2008 one. he won by several points against a wa

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national cable satellite corp. 2012] >> next, "washington journal" than grover norquist and live at 11:00 a.m., president and mrs. obama take part in veterans day ceremonies at arlington national cemetery. >> i need some help over here -- >> where is sergeant robert gates today? >> we ended up following him after his plane ride for many months. he ended up entering himself into an innovative program at walter reed where they ended up using acupuncture and using meditation and using other techniques to wean them off of all the drugs he was on. through this program, he was able to walk out of walter reed on his own two feet. i really commend the military for two things -- for allowing us to tell this story both of the good and the bad but for recognizing this problem. they recognize there is a problem of over-medication and they're looking for outside the box ideas and how to fix it. that is sort of poll thesis of the film. the metaphor is that the status quo is not working any to start looking for outside the box ideas. >> more on this piece -- tonight at 8:00 tonight"q &a." >> this morning, tv and radio talk sho

mr. reed's spewing of vitriol, of variable stream. we are joined by grover norquist president of americans for tax reform. i have to ask you. how does it feel to be a bully of lawmakers? i like this part especially, anti-tax sell at. the logical extremists. to find yourself is really being pointed that as the problem, not part of the solution here suddenly. how do you feel that? >> well, look. harry reid had a plan. he and obama and nancy pelosi were going to spend a great deal of money, and then they were going to turn to the republicans and say, okay. why don't you be responsible and raise taxes, put your finger prints on a tax increase to pay for our bigger government. republicans said no. harry reid has had a hissy fit for four years now, i'm happy the republicans would not raise taxes to pay for is bigger government. the problem is the american people don't want their taxes raised. lou: what i asked was how you feel? >> i am pleased as punch. harry reid, at having a hissy fit at me, he's really mad at the american people for not wanting to raise taxes. he person

norquist, rush limbaugh, governor? is this because they feel they have an undue influence on their base, especially mr. limbaugh? >> yeah, there's no question. look, every rational thinking in mrk, no matter what side they are on, they know that they have got to do something about the debt and it's got to include revenue. if you get rid of a tax loophole, that's raising taxes. he sent a letter to tom cobuln and said you can't do that because when you eliminate a tax loophole that's eliminating taxes and tom coburn sent a letter back sending him to pound sand and we need -- and i think representative ellison knows this better than i do. there are good republicans out there. >> no doubt. >> who i believe are not going to take the lead of this delaying and ofiscating leadership. you can name some of the house i'm sure, keith. so we've got to be willing to move this country ahead and know that that means entitlement cuts, spending cuts, and increasing revenues. >> they are not only good republicans, they are good politicians because when you look at grover's losers, candidates who sign, there's no type of pledge. so

norquist's tax pledge. he's also retiring at the end of this term. gentlemen, good to have both of you with us. mr. welch, i'll begin with you. i'm sure you've noticed, hopefully you've been watching cnbc and see all these pins that we are wearing that say "rise above" calling for you and your colleagues there to get something done on the fiscal cliff. why are you so unwilling to be able to do that? >> well, i am willing to do it. in fact, i work with steve, who you're going to hear from shortly, to advocate for a balanced deal. the real challenge here is practical. do we want to have a bad deal that beats the january 1 deadline, or are we willing to hold out for a more balanced deal, even if that requires us to go into january? >> does that include entitlements? does that mean reforming entitlemen entitlements, particularly medicare? >> absolutely. we have to have health care costs come under control. we can reform them. those of us who are strong supporters of medicare have to be advocates for system reform, not benefit cuts. >> so hand in hand with taxes, you can do them both at the same time? >

mr. president, waiting for you to stand up and show leadership. bob, haven't heard a thing. crickets. >> eric: i think you heard things. there is movement going on here. >> bob: i'm glad they're breaking away from norquist there is a need for revenue. i think whether that comes in form of limiting deductions to $50,000 for people making over $250,000 or -- >> eric: i can say. we will get to all of that. we'll get to the deals that may go on. where is obama's deal or his idea? his proposed, i don't know. the medicare, medicaid, reform to get the tax cuts. >> bob: there will be form of entitlement of increasing the age of retirement age for social security, or taxing people. there are things in the works here. they won't let it happen at one time. you are doing this to protect people making moment. >> eric: a number came out, if you go ahead and let the bush tax cuts expire you raise eight or nine days of government. >> dana: the failure of the super committee is the reason we're here. they were supposed to get to a deal. they couldn't get to one. president obama and congress kicked it to this year. now we lead up to this moment. last february, john boehner speaker of the house sent a leletter saying this

norquist really isn't the issue here. let's take it a step further. today we had mr.orts talk about all the behavior that is changing because of the fiscal cliff. patty dom writes a great piece picked up by everybody about how companies are actually going to the capital markets to get money to give it away on a dividend before december 31st. mr. buffet, i ask you, does that sound like a behavioral change to you? i think it does. now, let's go to a line that mr. buffett had in his op-ed piece. put it on the screen. i will read it. this is in the context of tax reform, which is what this hit's about. but the reform of such complexities should not promote delay in our correcting simple and expensive inequities. we can't let those who want to protect the privileged get away with insisting that we do nothing until we can do everything. i agree. dodd/frank in two weeks is going to be two years old. the volcker rule continues to be unwritten. jamie dimon said a third of the entire thing is written. two-thirds aren't. my issue here is, if people are going to break their promi

mr. president, i said "both sides." clinging to the kind of ideological purity that grover norquist peddles is easy.cooperating with those you disagree with is hard. legislating is hard. as we approach the fiscal cliff, democrats are ready to make those tough choices. i hope my republican freandzs, theespecially those who claim ty put mo claim before their pledge can say the same. mr. mcconnell: mr. president? the presiding officer: the republican leader. mr. mcconnell: yesterday i came to the floor to discuss what's known as the fiscal cliff, a mix of automatic tax hikes and defense cuts that are set to hit at the end of the year jeopardizing our security as well as our economy. my message was pretty simple. a solution is possible. republicans have been reasonable and president needs to lead. he is the only one who can get us to a solution. if that's what he wants, we'll succeed. so it was with some concern that i read this morning that the president plans to hit the road next week to drum up support for his own personal approach to the short- and long-term fiscal challenges we face. in other words