mr. pittinger. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and i can see, doctor, you wanted to go ahead and make a comment on that last question, so go ahead. >> well, i think, frankly, this body has an important role to play because in the absence of strong government intervention on this issue, i'm sure many of you have seen the rise of certain companies that are now advertising as part of their services that they themselves will engage in aggressive defensive measures, shall we say, or even hackback on behalf of companies in the absence of the perception that the u.s. government isn't going to do anything to help them. when i testified before the huntsman/blair commission, we had a lengthy discussion about some of the outdated features of the 1986 computer fraud and abuse act and the fact that, frankly, many companies right now are looking to congress for clarification on just exactly -- and, frankly, the department of justice, as to where the legal boundaries are on this issue about hackback and being able to aggressively go after your o

mr. pittinger? >> thank you, mr. chairman. mr. wen, thank you for europe testimony. i would like to got -- for your testimony. i would like to get some idea of the penalties that are enforced against the chinese citizens in their efforts to expose human rights and how they are targeted in china. [speaking chinese] [speaking chinese] >> translator: the internet hacking, cybersecurity is only one problem they face. in real life their real problem is in real life their security, their physical security. they could be disappeared, their internet ability could be invaded, and their telephones monitored and so on and so fort. so forth. >> are these penalties -- thank you. are these penalties pervasive throughout the country? does it matter where in china? [speaking chinese] [speaking chinese] >> translator: the internet attack probably the most, the more prominent dissidents, activists are suffering more. but e-mail like phishing, it's very, very common, very widespread. as for disappearance and detention, there might be little difference in some provinces. it might be lit