mr. reinford. i know there's lots of divestitures over in europe, in germany, we're doing some in my area, but there's still only about 200 in the country. what do you see -- when you talk to other farmers, what's been the big road block for livestock operations to put in die ves churs? >> is that's a good question. the number one thing is for us farmers educating us. i'm throwing some of the pioneer work that's going to different places and educating farmers. and in some of the seminars, we actually sold some of -- just by seeing the efficiency of digestion. in germany, there's 6,800 digest churs, they have 100 count dairies, they're telling us now we need 800 cows we can go with smaller farms with smaller digest churs. >> what would you think would be an initial capital investment for a small digester, how many cars would make it feasible? what you would have to have? >> well, that's a good question. if you allow us to put food waste in there, we can go down as much as 200, 300 cows. that's the t

mr. steve reinford, owner and operator of reinford farms. mr. jerry taylor, president and chief executive officer mfa oil company, co-founder mfa oil biomass llc in columbia, missouri. and mr. gary haer, chairman of the national biodiesel board in washington, d.c. so welcome, gentlemen, and thank you for bringing your expertise and experience to this subcommittee hearing. congressman greenwood, please begin when you're ready. >> chairman thompson, ranking member -- [ no audio ] >> jim, you're out of practice. >> i'm out of practice. i usually have somebody do that for me. so chairman thompson and ranking member holden and distinguished members of the subcommittee, i thank you and appreciate the opportunity to be with you today. my name is jim greenwood. i am the president and ceo of the biotechnology industry organization. we have more than 1,100 members worldwide. with its broad membership, innovative biotechgy companies, we are developing new feed stocks, catalysts for advanced biofuels and bio-based products. because these food stocks are bas

mr. reinford, we'll make sure the folks in washington who need to plug in their volt there is a place in pennsylvania where they can get that done. >> mr. haer. >> thank you for the opportunity to testify on the entitlement program, the bio -- bcap it's called. >> in 2008 we began writing the next chapter, biomass. in 2011 betook a major step forward to form mfa biomass, with the mission of leading the cooperative into this new renewable energy field. for more information about our innovation, please refer to my written testimony. when usda issued the final bcap rule they said, quote, b-cap will address a classic chicken-and-egg challenge. if they're to have sufficient feed stocks established -- [ no audio ] . >> it allowed to us leverage other resources to develop a four-row planter, plant propagation acres and lower the cost of planting. to that end b-cap was essential to bridging the gap with our producers to take that leap of faith. today 225 family farmers have dedicated acres to the new energy crop and we anticipate this number will grow to over 2,000 as our combined projects scale

mr. reinford. i come from wisconsin which is the second largest dairy producer in the united states. would you mind sharing with the panel if you're willing what type of capital expense you had to invest to put a digester technology at your farm? >> yeah. there we go. yes, our digester cost $1.1 million. >> how much of that was subsidized through a federal program? not a loan but a pure subsidy grant. >> we had 50% grant money, that was through energy harvest grand. >> 50%? >> 50% and the rest was low interest money. >> so ruffly about $550,000? >> yes. >> how long will it take to pay it back. >> two years. >> am i safe to say that without this subsidy it would have taken four years to pay it back? >> this past year we had an extremely good year. simply from bringing food waste in from other sources and that's a tipping fee. and so that gives us about a third of percent of our income from our tipping fees, so for farmers who don't have access to that, you're going to be looking down the road, five, six, seven years. my scientist is going through the process who's actually replacing a

mr. steve reinford, honoring operator of wrightwood farms. mr. jerry taylor, chief executive operator mfa oil company, oil biomass loc in columbia, missouri and mr. jerry haer, bio diesel toward washington d.c. thank you for being here and bring expertise and experience to set committee hearing. congressman greenwood, please begin when you're ready. [inaudible] >> general tommy out of this. >> i usually have somebody do that for me. >> mr. chairman thompson in breaking member hold an undistinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you i appreciate the opportunity to be here today. i'm the president and ceo of the biotechnology industry organization. bio is the world's largest biotechnology organization with an 1100 members worldwide. with its broad membership qaeda innovative industrial and agricultural biotechnology companies are developing new feedstocks and biological catalysts that production of advanced biofuels, renewable chemicals and bio-based products. because these feedstocks manufacturing methods and products based on plants and bio

mr. reinford, proceed with your testimony, please. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i wasn't aware until i actually got your invitation that you are one of my neighbors, so is a joy to be here with one other pennsylvanian. this is my first time ever doing something like this and i feel privileged and honored to be here. i'm not quite sure how to turn it about, but i don't have a preparation time. i too think the time for sharing my experience in this business for eight years. 80 or sharing my experience on renewable energy. and thanks so much for the incentives i got from usda and some of my bank guys helping me. we actually put up a new system. so i'm going to share the thought of that story. one of the main reasons i did it was because the reduction in pennsylvania i did have a job and then move entire area here. a police officer in his complaint was i went to work and we actually put together this system. i guess a lot of people are looking at what i'm doing and that's one of the reasons i'm here to share and hope they promote this technology to move forward in th