you shot of the mrna, and you should be good with the mrna second shot. >> andrea wants to about having moderna vaccine's, then a j&j booster? with that work the same way, the concept of mixing and matching? >> the concept is there, except for the fact the mix-and-match did not show that you necessarily got higher antibodies with mrnas followed by johnson & johnson. there is something about priming , the first one went johnson & johnson and the second one that works better. you can do it if you are concerned about anything else. but there is nothing that is better. >> and some folks want to know if you can tell them about super immunity, whether that's really a thing from being infected with covid, than getting a vaccine? >> it is a thing, it's called hyper immunity. it's called hybrid immunity. and it really is your antibodies, if you have been infected, then you get a vaccine , they are super antibodies. it works the other way, getting vaccinated, then getting a mild infection afterwards, like colin powell's wife, that will boost your immunity and get into this hybrid immunity situati

this particular hub focuses on mrna platform.uild the skills and capacity, transfer that knowledge to different spokes across the country to ensure we build sufficient capacity to produce for future pandemics but in the medium and long term also vaccines for the comfort -- continent. there is no manufacturing capacity for covid-19 vaccines in low in middle income countries. we have to change that and part of this model is to do exactly that. host: thank you so much for joining us from south africa. we go to afghanistan now where u.s. officials warn an offshoot of islamic state could launch attacks abroad six months from now. the taliban insist they will not let that happen. two groups of rivals, much smaller than the taliban and accusing them of not being hardline enough. a bloody conflict is escalated between the two sides in the east. reporting from jalalabad. correspondent: a new chapter in the beginning of this conflict. we have come to its frontline. the taliban novel the country. here in jalalabad, everything, a daily strea

somewhat higher antibody levels when windows was in mrna vaccine versus two johnson & johnson vaccines. this is only antibodies. there's more than one way to look, but antibodies are the easiest way. fire data has shown that johnson & johnson antibody levels are remarkably stable over time, whereas antibody levels after mrna vaccines, while they are hired to begin with, declined somewhat. unfortunately, there were no safety concerns in that smaller study. >> the wall street journal is reporting the fda is delaying and that decision on authorizing moderna's vaccine for children. the risk of a rare heart inflammatory addition, can you explain more about that and how concerned parents should be? >> there has been a small number of cases of heart muscle inflammation after mrna vaccinations muckalt myocarditis. mostly it is in young adult males, and essentially it results in a few days. it usually doesn't have any, doesn't require hospitalization for the most part. there have only been a few for it, and generally it resolves within a few days. because of this, the fda is probably taking ext

>> yeah, if we're talking about mrna vaccines, yes. if you got pfizer, get pfizer, if you got moderna, get moderna. however, they also authorized being able to switch out to an mrna vaccine, meaning either moderna or pfizer, for people who got j&j the first time, and also authorized an extra dose of j&j. but if you look at the studies, the boosting that goes on is substantially higher, i moon substantially higher, when people who got an o.j. dose of j&j got either moderna or pfizer. so i think this is going to play out over the next week or so, but that's currently what the recommendations are. the fda is agnostic, doesn't care if you got j&j, whether you get j&j, pfizer, or moderna, but the data would suggest that you want to get a moderna or pfizer booster. >> all right. stay with the same brand. >> yeah. >> all right, dr. rutherford, thank you so much again. >> you bet. my pleasure, take care. bye-bye. >>> sonoma county could be the next to ease their indoor mask mandate. the county is considering allowing fully vaccinated residents

not negative on the potential for the mrna platform to have other indications other than covid.forever with moderna, less than pfizer the ability to use annual boosters for the foreseeable future we think probably isn't a realistic scenario but that's what the value tells you. >> meg hinted at the commercial battle between they companies to be the booster of choice how important is that to the company? >> we haven't even talked about johnson & johnson, novavax or others, the ability to take share going forward is going to be important i would say the two mrna vaccines are more alike than different. the moderna vaccine did not typically hit the end point and pfizer's did although i do expect the fda and recommendations for boosters for at-risk people to not really differentiate between the two. but it is clear going forward from a commercial perspective, the booster is going to be key >> getting it to this $5 billion of perpetual sales figure doesn't add up i wanted to ask you about the biden administration, where the chief scientific officer says about moderna, we expect them to

it did not get quite the same efficacy as the mrna vaccines.indicates if you had j&j you might want to think about being boosted with one of the mrna vaccines because it might give you a higher level of antibodies. anchor: is there not a concern that johnson & johnson is not as effective as the other vaccines and it needs moderna to make it work as a booster? >> if it were not for the fact that the mrna vaccines were so fantastic johnson & johnson it be correct right now because they still have a good vaccine that is saved a lot of lives. it is a vaccine that works with windows and something that does not require the kind of gold chain that would make it difficult to distribute in places like south sudan, so i have i hopes the johnson & johnson vaccine will be a mainstay of what we need to do for the world. it is still a very good vaccine. anchor: dr. collins, thank you so much for being with us. >> like to join you. anchor: in no way a bow and arrow attack as left five people dead, and the police are treating the incident as terrorism. suspect

the mrna hub with support from who is an end and in plan where it included proponents of training staponents of making sure the regulatory landscape was set for these vaccines. it had a longer-term vision as well. that is the process we need to look toward. that is the process that has the future in mind, rather than something that is fully controlled by pharmaceutical companies. they have a specific mandate. that mandate is to serve their shareholders and to commercialize the extent possible their products. i think it is notable, but we need a lot more. particular notable two vaginal has set up this tech transfer hub and yet none of these originator companies have volunteered to come forward and participate. amy: dr. monica gandhi come your thoughts on the merck story single share the formula for its cover 19 drug molnupiravir with part countries, allowing manufacturers to produce the cheap generic? >> i am excited about merck making the announcement. molnupiravir is a treatmen prention is alwa better than treatmt. vaccine availability would be beer than treatment,ut this is an examp

this day pharmaceutical companies fro sharing their technology with the world health organization mrnab and other capable manufacturers around the world? >> good morning. thank you for talking on this important issue. as dr. gandhi just said very clearly, right now we're in a global crisis not only of moral and ethical magnitude, but just of a scientific rationale emerging from this pandemic. everyone around the world wants to emerge from this endemic. global leaders have not decided to take the route most scientifically sound to do that, which is equitably sharing vaccines around the world. from the start of the pandemic, although there were very lofty claims and platitudes about future cover 19 vaccine at that time, of course there were not available at that time but there were global leaders that came together from the european union with the leadership of who to say the future covid 19 vaccines would be considered global public goods and would be shared equitably around the world and we would not repeat mistakes of the past. unfortunately, those decorations were made and high incom

the one dose unlike the mrna vaccines where a single dose did not induce immunological memory, whichs the part of your immune response that protects you from serious disease. one dose of the j&j did that. you had 85% protection against serious illness, that was excellent. we've gone from excellent to much better with that second dose and i think the cdc likely will recommend this as a two-dose vaccine. >> you discuss there in the panel discussion, was this idea of mixing and matching vaccines, for example, if you originally got j&j, you could perhaps get a booster of pfizer or moderna. you didn't vote on this, but could that be next here? >> definitely. i think we need those kind of data. there was a study recently that came out of sweden that was hep journal of medicine, they looked at people who got astrazeneca's vaccine, similar to johnson & johnson. and then they divided them in half. half got a second dose of astrazeneca and the other half moderna. with the boost of the mrna vaccine was much better. >> if that is the case, some people who got the j&j vaccine might say why get a

j&j is different than the pfizer and the moderna mrna, you know, technologies, so you really can mixhas been a question that's been out there for some time with some people saying, well, if you come at this at protecting with a totally different technology does it actually give you better protection because you're coming at it two different ways, and a study from the national institutes of health that was presented first to the fda and then to cdc does suggest that you can give an mrna vaccine to someone who received the j&j vaccine and they will get a bigger boost in terms of their antibody levels than if you gave them a j&j vaccine for their second dose. like wise, they found that if you give someone who got the pfizer vaccine and moderna vaccine and the moderna and pfizer vaccine you, get a good level of protection. the one thing to recognize is that the companies didn't do these studies. there's not as much data on this kind of mixing and matching, but for people who want to go with a different product and in terms of ease and logistics, it's quite safe, it's quite effective to g

so looking at people who got an mrna and then boosted with like a vectored virus or different mrna vaccinesle in each group which are really too small to make a recommendation. so we didn't vote on that today but i suspect we will be voting on that and then the cdc will make clear recommendations about how best to mix and match. >> i want to ask about the recommendation for the moderna booster that you all voted unanimously for that yesterday. one of your fellow committee members, dr. patrick moore said, it was a more gut feeling rather than based on really truly serious data. the data itself is not strong but it's certainly going in the direction that is supportive of this vote, unquote. a gut feeling on such an important decision? >> well, it is hard. so for example, when pfizer submitted their vaccine for two-dose vaccine, that was a 40,000-person trial. when they submitted the three-dose vaccine, that was about 306 people. so you see what their immune response was with a third dose. same with moderna. a 30,000 two-dose. the third dose was 170 people. when making decisions based on what'

fauci gave was relevant for the mrna vaccine.cine, there's no particular reason to switch to a different vaccine unless there's something very specific, for example, you had a severe allergic reaction or you had myocarditis with the mrna vaccine, then you might consider switching to the johnson & johnson for your boosters do. on the other hand, if you got the j&j for your first dose, first of all, it's rally important you get the booster now if it's been at least two months. this is different from the mrna vaccines, which are the boosters recommended only for individuals in higher risk categories. now we know that j&j recipients, they probably did not get as much protection as the two doses of the mrna vaccine. so they really should be getting a booster dose, but the cdc very specifically yesterday in the recommendation did not say that people who got the j&j should then get the j&j second dose, that that's preferred. in fact, for women under the age of 50, they should really consider getting an mrna second dose instead of a seco

months, and ash mrna advancements, and also because there does -- mrna advancements, and also becauses seem to be more money available for vaccines. this is been traditionally a dearth of investment. dr. afeyan: remarkably, the most effective from a suitable company, historically we have no real access to being able to use it on our behalf, so occasionally, people develop vaccines over decades of work, and that is why it has been the backwaters of the industry. and blood people can see proof of concept of what vaccines can do. they are innately powerful if you know how to control them. so i think money is not just following the short-term opportunity, but recognizing a real shift in what is possible and how effective our immune system can be. should also say another phenomenon is driving the capital. that has to do with a shift in this industry from the shots on goal, we call it, where you bet on a lot and maybe one or two out of 50 make it, versus a gradually more deterministic activity. i don't mean that every thing we do works, but we should expect anything to work. it is a questio

the mrna vaccines work better. anybody two months after the first shot is to get a booster, either a johnson & johnson vaccine or they could get an mrna vaccine. >> they voted to recommend an additional one half of a dose of the moderna vaccine for seniors and those with high- risk health condition six months after the second dose. covid-19 claimed the life of an american leader . having died of complications from covid-19 is general colin powell he was vaccinated but he also had underlying conditions of parkinson's disease and cancer and he died at walter reed national military center. colin powell served presidents on both sides of the aisle. skyler henry reports he was a consistent voice for unity. >> reporter: president biden order the united states like to be flown at half staff in honor one of the most famous statesmen. >> a heartbreaking tragedy for the country. >> reporter: president obama and president bush called colin powell a friend . he endorsed president obama in his first run for the white house and

so those are all reasons, mrna, stick with the category, j&j, i would advocate the mrna. >> here's writatching us this morning >> many of whom have mandated the vaccine at their company once boosters are approved, at what point would you recommend that they mandate the booster, not just the original vaccine but the booster recognizing that it appears that the diminishing efficacy of the original vaccine is real? >> yes andrew, i also talked to some of these small and large business owners and my advice to them is the same do not start to count a booster a as part of a mandated series for return to employment criteria simply because of what becky and i were discussing, there are criteria all people are not eligible. you do not want to create a strange incentives as employers start to put into near pass cards a requirement timed from that data, the second dose it could be that people are not eligible for that dose i do think until we see broader approval and broader recommendation for any eligible adult. which i think we will get to, it will take several months it feels we rhea snail's pa

can they get a second johnson or the single johnson & johnson and then one of the two mrna vaccines, but theoretically if you got a pfizer or moderna originally you can then turn around and get one of the other ones. pfizer for your first two jabs get the madarna booster or vice versa that study that the fda panel looked at today did come to the conclusion that mits and imagining the vaccines leads to similar immune. responses, so some really interesting facts there to consider going forward. yeah, really very interesting. okay tim. thanks very much. bart employees will be required to get fully vaccinated. the new policy goes into effect in mid-december, but what's unclear is whether there will be a testing option and what will happen to those who refuse to get the shots abc 7 news reporter laura anthony has a closer look at the decision. bard is now going the way of many other public agencies and private companies with a decision to require its nearly 4,000 employees to get vaccinated as it is now about 80% of bart employees are fully vaccinated, but that leaves 833 who are not or t

it looks— do well with an mrna booster. it looks like — do well with an mrna booster. easier and easier to get that booster no matter what your— easier to get that booster no matter what your first shot was.— what your first shot was. doctor jarvis, what your first shot was. doctor jarvis. what _ what your first shot was. doctor jarvis. what do _ what your first shot was. doctor jarvis, what do you _ what your first shot was. doctor jarvis, what do you expect - what your first shot was. doctor i jarvis, what do you expect winter what your first shot was. doctor - jarvis, what do you expect winter to be like for gps and patients? i jarvis, what do you expect winter to be like for gps and patients?- be like for gps and patients? i have a real concern _ be like for gps and patients? i have a real concern that _ be like for gps and patients? i have a real concern that we _ be like for gps and patients? i have a real concern that we could - be like for gps and patients? i have a real concern that we could end . be like for gps and patients? i have a real concern that we cou

the pfizer vaccine and the moderna vaccines are both so-called mrna vaccines.at doesn't harm you but gets your body to reacted like it was facing a serious infection. as you know, charles, i'm on the board for johnson & johnson. all three vaccines have in common that they're effective. the pfizer and moderna two doses is more effective than j&j. and what we know from all the evidence, they can help people who have already been fully vaccinated get stronger long-term responses. so if you have gotten the pfizer and moderna mrna vaccine and over 65 or under 65 and have a health condition and being around a lot of people with covid, you can get any of the boosters. if you have the johnson & johnson one-shot vaccine, it's a good idea to get a booster. we're still getting more evidence, but what we have learned from other vaccines and what seems to be playing out so far is that mixing vaccines actually may help you. doesn't seem to hurt. it's been at least six months for pfizer, moderna, two months for j&j, up to six months or longer. good time to consider getting an

the mrna, the boost of that regiment as you can see brings the tighter up 76 fold. if you go down to the next level and look at j&j 2600 boost itself, it brings it up 4.2 fold and across the nine-point grid, you can see as mentioned on the prior slide both homologous and arata work well from the laboratory view. now let's look at what the clinical effect of boosters are. shown on the slide, data from israel, namely the absolute right of confirmed infection for 100,000 risk days. striking in this slide is if you look at the confirmed infections in yellow of people who have not been boosted across multiple age groups, you see a dramatic infection in green to those who were boost. this is a confirmed infection. when you look at severe illness, qc similar data, 12 or more days after a third shot boost of the bio entech, almost 19 fold low incidence of severe disease in people older than 60 years old and more than 22 fold lower in incident of severe disease in younger people from 40 to 60 years old. then finally bringing to your attention the announcement made yesterday

it was all about mrna and these types of vaccines. crosstalk.of vaccines aren't there, is that the case or is it that they are just not in the right place? some countries are approaching a position where they can give third doses. the world has the vaccines, theyjust aren't in the right place — in the poor and middle income countries. that is my premise, that it isn't right. that, for instance, even if the united states and g7 countries were to donate all of their vaccine supply tomorrow, it still would only be part of the way there. we don't — we do not have an inventory of 9 billion doses of vaccines. we could have if we had balance the portfolio more not only focusing on mrna, but scaling up low—cost recombinant proteins vaccines which work just as well, if not even better in some cases. that was the mistake that we were so focused on speed and rapidly immunising populations, small populations that we didn't give enough consideration to what we would need downstream. so who has the power to change this, then, to set things on a better track?

hopefully an mrna based on the data, and then for those who received the mrna vaccines, if they're overo 64 with preexisting medical condition or high exposure, which, by the way, that's about 60% of the population in the ages of 18 to 64. that's a very large number of people who will soon be eligible for boosters hopefully as early as this weekend. >> i want to tell you something we've discussed before on the show. this mysterious covid-related inflammation in kids. multisystem inflammatory syndrome. doctors still searching for a cause. so far more than 5200 kids have been diagnosed with it. we've seen it in kids with the hospital about a month after they were infected with covid. how dangerous is it and why is it so hard to figure out what's causing it? >> this is a very dangerous phenomenon. like you mentioned, 5,000 children out of 6 million who have been infected with covid have gotten this multisystem syndrome. so it's a very low number. less than 1% of children get inflicted with this. of that less than 1%, 80% need icu level care including mechanical ventilation. this is a conun

if you got two doses of mrna containing vaccines, you are protected.mmuno logical memory cells, which are long lived. those should be reassured by that. . >> i want to ask you about something happening in society. it seems the anti vax rhetoric in regard to covid is spreading to all vaccines. you have jim jordan of ohio writing, ohio should ban all vaccine mandates. of course that would mean the requirements that have existed in schools for generations for things like measles, rubella, vaccines shown to work there. what's the impact of this? >> i think it would be tremendous and awful. we have had school mandates since the 1970s. they were borne of measles in places like los angeles and detroit. they work. what we found is because of school vaccine mandates, we basically eliminated measles from this country by 2000. we basically eliminated rubella, or german measles, by 2005. if we roll back the mandates, we will take a giant step backward in time. there is probably no better example how they work than the state of mississippi. mississippi has one of t

if you haven't had any issues with your first do doses of an mrna vaccine, stick with the mrna. >> the mrna is pfizer and moderna. >> pfizer and moderna. >> if you've had pfizer, get a pfizer booster. you've had moderna, get the moderna booster which is actually a reduced dose. it's half dose. if you've had j&j, i think most people would benefit from getting mrna booster, not the j&j booster, particularly women under the age of 50 where we saw that rare but serious complication of cerebral venus thrombosis. to keep it simple, if you've had one dose of the j&j, get either the pfizer or moderna vaccine as a booster. >> most importantly, talk to your doctor if you've had any sort of side effect one way or the other. >> probably the first thing to do is talk to your doctor. >> you heard alexandra mention this study that shows a quarter of patients had brain fog. a quarter. worse for people who had been hospitalized with covid but also happened in people who were not hospitalized with covid. what causes this brain fog and is there any treatment for brain fog as a long haul covid symptom? >>

i think ultimately they will be getting an mrna vaccine.rned from that mix and match data is that although the j&j boost increases the level of neutralizing antibodies about fourfold, which is good, the addition of an mrna vaccine increases it either 35fold or over 70fold. so my guess is that we will be boosting most of these folks with an mrna vaccine, and the committee will make a statement about this at the end of this week. so i do think it's worth waiting for. >> doctor, thank you for that expertise. we appreciate it. >>> coming up next, transportation secretary pete buttigieg is defending his decision to take paternitiy leave after being mocked by fox news. >> pete buttigieg has been on leave from his job since august trying to figure out how to breastfeed. no word on how that went. >> buttigieg's response, next. you're live in the "cnn newsroom." from puerto rico when he was 17. with ancestry, being able to put the pieces of the puzzle together... ...it's amazing. it's honestly amazing. regina approaches the all-electric cadillac lyr

or if you get a second dose that is an mrna vaccine. not saying that it doesn't work, but rather that you get additional protection with an additional dose of the vaccine. >> and that's what you chose to do. you chose to get a dose of a mrna vaccine of pfizer? >> that's right. and so i knew that i would need to get a second dose because the j&j vaccine probably should have been a two-dose vaccine. we didn't know that at the time when it was first being studied. now we know that probably get a second dose. i chose to get an mrna vaccine, because the j&j vaccine is associated with a very rare but very serious side effect of a blood clotting disorder that is predominantly seen in women under the age of 50. as a person in this category, i decided that the mrna vaccines do not have this potential side effect and i would rather do that. now, i realize that the cdc has not yet weighed in on this, they're weighing in on their meeting today, but i would expect they will also be allowing for this level of patient preference when it comes to mix a

research that shows antibody levels from the vaccine were substantially lower compared to the two mrnacines. the u.s. health regulator is also considering whether to lower the age range for the booster shots. joining me now is the dean of brown university school of public health. thank you so much for being with us. before we get into the recommendations, how concerned are you with the fact that the country is trying to get more vaccinated, but the guidance keeps changing and people are more confused than ever? >> thank you for having me back. i am concerned that the communication around vaccines and boters has not been as clear as it eds to be. if you are unvaccinated in america, you need to get vaccinated. the delta variant is dangerous and unvaccinated people need to get the first shot. that doesn't mean we shouldn't also be talking about boosters. boosters are an important tool for particularly high risk people. >> i want to focus on the j&j vaccine. new research is showing that real world efficacy is 50% to 68%. if you're trying to decide which vaccine to get, is j&j the least des

we know that especially for people who have got an mrna vaccine, this addresses people who are over 65, people in high-risk settings, and people with underlying disease. and for people who got a johnson & johnson, any over 18 years old is eligible for a booster shot. >> so doctor, the booster shot for johnson & johnson, first of all, it should be two months after receiving that johnson & johnson shot, right? which is very unusual. the other ones were saying six months or more. so if i got the j&j vaccine, right, and that was after -- you know, much after two months ago -- >> months ago. >> where do i go get it? what booster do i get? >> right. and so that's the issue. the fda has not given any clear guidance on which vaccine -- and the reason why is because there's really not enough data yet. we have preliminary data showing that if you mix and match the johnson & johnson with mrna vaccine, you get a higher antibody response. but we know that the immune system is more complicates than that. so essentially they're saying, you can get any booster. if you received johnson & johnson, you c

what the data is showing is particularly for johnson & johnson is getting one of the mrna vaccines mrnanother johnson & johnson vaccine. if you're at a high risk or myocarditis, especially men, maybe getting a johnson & johnson is better for you. those are individual decisions. the data is showing that if you got johnson & johnson, getting that mrna vaccine, pfizer or moderna seems to be able to help you a little bit more. >> points well taken thank you so much. >>> they're small and powerful and in short supply. how that scarcity is creating a potential economic nightmare here in the u.s. and just being sustainable isn't enough. our future depends on regeneration. that's why we're working to not only protect our planet, but restore, renew, and replenish it. so we can all live better tomorrow. ♪♪ (burke) i've seen this movie before. (woman) you have? (burke) sure, this is the part where all is lost and the hero searches for hope. then, a mysterious figure reminds her that she has the farmers home policy perk, guaranteed replacement cost. and that her home will be rebuilt, regardless of

if i were carol, i would get an mrna vaccine. it is easier to get. the data from the nih shows a remarkable antibody response. if she decided to get another j&j, that would be fine, as well. kristen: if you got pfizer before and it did not get your booster already, which would you get? dr. chin-hong: i would get either pfizer or moderna. to me it is the same vaccine, different companies. the only reason moderna looked better is that there was a four week interval. length of time between shots is better for immune response rather than the company who made the vaccine. the other thing about moderna, it was a higher dose initially, but the booster will be a half dose. nevertheless, either would suffice. kristen: you may have answered my question, if you got moderna before, would you get another shot of moderna, or does the benefit of mixing outweigh the benefit of moderna's greater effectiveness for some people? dr. chin-hong: i would say you should get any that is available. i know moderna is the darling of many people. if you like moderna, stick with

kristen: are we hearing of any allergies who got the mrna that would encounter that with j&j? >> there's just the issue of myocarditis, which is one in a million. an immediate anaphylaxis, there are a handful, but apart from that, nothing really. kristen: vaccine advisors declined to recommend expanding who should get boosters. i know a lot of people in the bay area cannot wait to get there booster, even if they are younger than 65 and don't belong to those current categories. what do you say to those folks? >> i would say that it seems that almost everyone falls into a category, because of the additional medical risk factor or -- if at risk for continued exposure, you would be covered in getting it. it's all like on the honor system anyway. kristen: is there a danger to that, for folks who are considering that due to their own circumstances, is there a danger in going out in going out and getting a third shot? >> that is a question that some people have raised in terms of not having enough safety about users. from a biologic perspective, it would be really rare to think about

that's what moderna and pfizer, mrna vaccines.ine two months in the past. the j&j is a broader recommendation than moderna and pfizer, it's very confusing and hard for the general public to sift through all of that, but that's where it stands. >> and for people who got the one dose j&j, do you think it's better for them to get an mrna booster now that available to everybody, rather than a second j&j? >> i do think this is a promising way to really increase immunity that people got from the j&j vaccine. the j&j vaccine used a different booster. and it's something if the j&j should think about getting, who got the j&j vaccine, to get boosted with an mrna. it's a way to mix the vaccines. >> just another mix and match question, if you got pfizer should you get the moderna, or vice versa? if you got moderna, get pfizer, completely mix it up or doesn't matter? >> moderna and pfizer both use the same technology. so i don't think there's great advantage to mixing pfizer and moderna. suppose you go to a drugstore and they don't have the on

i've had some patients where i have said, i think you should get an mrna vaccine.ull approval for pfizer, so there's some flexibility to do that. and i think that's where individual conversation needs to take place. but johnson & johnson, you need to get something. the efficacy rates were not high enough to feel like you can be protected months out. >> last question here, real quick. remember when johnson & johnson was first released, it was then subsequently paused for about ten days because this very rare side effect of blood clotting in individuals. is this currently a risk for people getting a second booster of johnson & johnson, yes, rare, but still a risk? >> it's rare. it was not seen in the boosted data population. i would say that's exactly the reason why i would say you should talk to your physician if you're a woman under the age of 50 and you are at higher risk and didn't experience anything with your j&j vaccine, it's worth having that conversation. so, i'm glad you pointed that out. but no, they did not see any risks, so there's no increased risk, and

kristen: when will the mrna be updated to handle more strains? dr. patel: as needed. with the delta variant representing 95% of the coronavirus in this country, and the vaccine working well, it's not needed at the beauty of the technology as it is almost like a plug-and-play game, so the new variant shows up a new vaccine can be turned around quickly. kristen: martha jean, should i get a booster? i am four months pregnant. dr. patel: talk with your physician, if you have underlying medical conditions which you do being pregnant, but this is a conversation you should have. when in doubt, if you have an underlying medical condition, if you are at any level where you are being exposed on a regular basis to people who may be positive, you should get a booster and i commend you for asking that question, especially because you are pregnant and you are doing the best for your own health and that may be. kristen: we are going to squeeze in one last one, after costly -- contra costa county is considering following others lead to partially lift the mandate in gyms and offices w

this particular study shows that mixing and matching with an mrna vaccine, pfizer or moderna, one of their boosters, and that the study actually saw significant results. do you suggest considering this? >> yeah, so, what we know about mixing and matching is the following. first of all, it's very safe tot first, you can get a different vaccine as a booster and it's going to work fine. i don't think we have long-term followup that says one is better than the other. so, as far as i'm concerned, if you want to mix and match, that's fine. if you want to stick with the original, that's perfectly fine, as well. >> dr. jha helping us to break through it all once again tonight. always great to have you, doctor, see you soon. >>> we are also following a two dropping headline o movie shoot tonight. here's matt gutman developments. >> reporter: tonight, the deadly real life horror unfolding on the set of axico. >> we have a person who was shot accidentally. >> reporter: authorities confirming a prop gun discharged during the filming of a scene of the upcoming western movie "rust" starring alec b

then the actual mrna that you inject gets degraded.s gone. so all you basically have is a boosted immune response for that one spike protein. there is no plausible mechanism for how this can go into effect a child's fertility. it's confusing for people out there when you see these reports on social media. but the bottom line is asked i talked to some immunologists who have taken a step back and said i can't even fathom to create a vaccine to target sars-cov-2 and human reproductive system, even if they wanted to can some twisted world. kristen: all right, that's good to know. another thing parents who are hesitant .2 is that kids really do seem to be better defended against covid. 73 million kids in the u.s., fewer than 700 have died from covid. that is one in 100,000, right? so is it fair for parents to say look, i like those odds. why should i take the risk if they view the vaccine as risky? i know that's the part people disagree on. what if they just say one in 100,000, i'll live with that. dr. patel: i'm happy that numbers that low

. >> what we're seeing ises this a group with lower overall efficacy than we have seen with the mrna vaccine so there is some urgency here. >> reporter: the advisers launching into a spirited debate over whether j&j should have been a two-dose vaccine to begin with. the company defending the need for a single shot option in a pandemic. and today, a key question on mixing and matching vaccines, specifically whether it's safe and effective to boost johnson & johnson with an mrna shot. a small study shows that a johnson & johnson booster dose triggered a climb in antibody levels four fold but a boost we are pfizer sent those up 35 fold and with a moderna boost, they jumped 76 fold. panel members acknowledging the public needs guidance soon. >> in the real world the combinations are already happening. we can't hide from it. we need to give guidance to the public. >> really interesting discussion from the panel about whether the johnson & johnson vaccine should have been a two-shot vaccine from the start. but big picture here tonight, the panel saying yes to boosters from pfizer. that was

there's a report this morning that perhaps you are better off getting another -- getting one of the mrna vaccines as a booster if you took johnson & johnson. explain why that is. >> that's exactly what i was referring to. this was a pre-print that came out yesterday that showed that -- it looked at the combinations of the three vaccines, two mrna and the johnson & johnson vaccine. what it showed is that as a booster, the mrna vaccines tended to give a more robust level of neutraliing antibody. what i was referring to before is the fact that with the kinetics of the antibody response are different. the antibody levels don't peak until 60, 70, 80 days afterwards. this study cut short around 30 days. it stacked the deck looking at the effectiveness of the johnson & johnson vaccine. that has to be considered. the johnson & johnson vaccine in two doses gives you a different type of immune response. putting all of that together in the phase one and phase two data, the johnson & johnson vaccine as a two dose vaccine is still very good. >> how comfortable -- i know that pfizer, moderna, johnson

>> i think so, you know, we have had this discussion before, jim, we said that the two mrna vaccines will be three dose vaccines and joinhnson & johnso will be a two-dose vaccine. i said that early on where it showed that individuals who got two doses of the j&j vaccine had much higher levels of virus neutralizing antibody and more robust t-cell responses. and i think that's what's panning out. there was some discussion a couple of days ago about a preprint that came online suggesting that those who got a j&j dose of this irvaccine when they were -- when they got boosted with mrna vaccines they did better than a second j&j dose. i'm pushing back a little bit on that in the sense that when you look at that early data, the big rise in responses were delayed happened later on, maybe 70, 80 days after as opposed to the 30-day window in that study. i think there going to be more follow-up. i think it will turn out that the j&j vaccine is a strong vaccine. >> did dr. paul offet and made the point that all this talk about vaccine boosters given that the efficacy of vaccines against the key

the opportunity to get an mrna vaccine especially with moderna where we saw that 76-fold rise in thehat your protection is durable. that means that your protection is gold standard. >> is there any downside in getting a different shot? i know we're asking 50 questions here. i'm curious for family and friends. is there any downside to getting a different, a different brand for your third shot? >> no, we don't see anything in the data that suggested there is a downside. you should feel safe and you should feel comfortable getting a shot of a different brand. >> good to know. evgen >> you talk about good science in real time. we're talking about two different americas. we're weighing information, talking about boosters and another where misinformation and disinformation are still reigning. case in point, the zentner academy in miami, private school, made headlines earlier this year because the school told teachers they would not be allowed to return to the kwlas r -- classroom if they were vaccinated. now they're telling parents if you get your child vaccinated, you have to keep them ho

their booster can now be with one of the mrna vaccines. to get official confirmation on getting vacc vaccinated. we know the m mrna vaccine will give them a better immune response. physicians are recommending this. nice to have policy line up the practice. >> one of the things people should know is that for moderna and pfizer, the booster is recommended six months after the second shot. for johnson & johnson, two months after the single shot. why is that important? >> essentially, anybody who got johnson & johnson right now today is eligible for their second dose. and the johnson & johnson vaccine should have had a recommendation a long time ago for that booster. so it is disappointing it's taken this long to have the recommendation out. >> to be clear, there is some evidence, and the trials have been small on this, not huge trials, but some evidence that mixing the booster shot, getting a different booster from the previous shot might actually enhance your protection. what do the studies say? >> yeah. the study most recently shown in the

some people for whatever reason don't want to take an mrna vaccine.ink for these kinds of considerations, if a person is worried, they should talk to their primary care provider about what vaccine works best for them. >> all right, thanks so much, we appreciate your time, dr. robert atmar. >>> next, this year it's not the grinch but a shipping crisis that could steal christmas, leading major retailers to start the holiday shopping season early. >>> and strike-tober. given a nationwide labor shortage, thousands of workers are hitting the picket line. micheal myers is still alive. tonight, our family will kill him. i want to take his mask off and see the life leave his eyes. managing type 2 diabetes? on it. -on it. on it, with jardiance. meet the people who are managing type 2 diabetes and heart risk with jardiance. jardiance is a once-daily pill that can reduce the risk of cardiovascular death for adults who also have known heart disease. so it could help save your life from a heart attack or stroke. jardiance also lowers a1c. and it may help you lose

you would take an mrna. let me show you the vaccine breakdown right now. about 8% of americans who are vaccinated got j&j. that's 15 million people out there, so if the fda comes out today and you're a j&j recipient and the fda later today says you can get another j&j boost. if you were another of the 15 million would you go today or tomorrow and get it or would you wait thinking in a week or two you can get a pfizer or moderna, now or wait? >> well, i think that's a very good question. depends when i was and what the situation was. a lot of people that got j&j are actually young people so their chances of developing severe disease are lower than if they were older individuals, and if they are young people i would say way. you're in absolutely no rush to get a booster. if you're somebody over the age of 60 who happened to have received j&j, i think that that would go ahead and get the booster as soon as possible. >> help me understand. the question i ask myself and i'm not a medical professional, are we havi

and if you choose and you elect to get an mrna, well, now the fda and cdc says that's okay and you can the side effects when things were first being rolled out, first shot, second shot or the single shot with johnson & johnson. how about a booster? are you expected to get side effects, and are they milder? >> well, fortunately, alex, the data at this point says or shows that people experience side effects that are more similar to their first injection. so in the case of the mrnas, the moderna and the pfizer, which means typically less because we were seeing more genicity with the second shot. in terms of maio cardites or the thrombositeopenia syndrome, they were not seeing that in excess at all with the second shot. so people were experiencing the same thing, headache, sore arm, typical vaccine reactions but no safety concerns. >> we know that we're going to get a decision pretty soon about kids and vaccines. and pfizer has said its vaccine is 91% effective for kids. when and when it gets improved, how long until it's actually rolled out? could it happen as soon as the first couple wee

who got the johnson & johnson vaccine when they got that second dose, they did bet were one of the mrnareful about that because, you know, the kinetics of the immune response with the j&j vaccine is a bit different. the peak in immune response tends to be delayed, and you also see more t-cell responses with the two doses of the j&j that you might see with the mrna. so there may be other advantages. so the team that's doing those booster studies is going to be publishing additional studies to look at it later on. so possibly the one place where you might want to make a switch is if off single dose of the j&j vaccine and you're at risk for clotting disorders, if you're pregnant or susceptible to thrombotic events or birth control, you might want to switch to a mrna. the biggest question i get by far is those overseas who don't have any access to the vaccines used in the u.s. and use a china or russian vaccine, what should they do when they come to the united states. >> thanks for that. so transitioning to another aspect of what we're constantly talking about is schools. when it comes to s

so the mrna vaccines were developed in a rapid sequence. but were also tested very carefully.an attest to that, the kinds of safety parameters and the data collected with these vaccines is extensive. so we know they have a great safety profile and they're very effective. so you have to put that in the context of this question. but some people would much rather have a more standard protein vaccine, just because they're more familiar with it. that is very understandable. now the novavax vaccine looks promising. it is just lagging behind in terms of getting the submission to the fda and other regulatory agencies around the world and getting it authorized or eventually licensed. and then, of course, there has to be tested now in younger age groups, just like the mrnas have been. so it is a good question. very understandable. but it is going to be a bit of a delay before you see novavax that is out there for this age group. >> dr. paul spearman, we appreciate the help you've given us answering these questions. >> thank you very much. good to be on the show. >>> so we have a remarka