ms. bogardus?most web banners or power point presentations do not include materials of the business aggregation rules. does your company's? >> we address the issue inconsistent they refer to as a brokerage firm refer our clients to their tax agent legal advisers to have a better understanding ofns many corporations are, business arrangements that requires an analysis ofons. options or documents treated for purposes other thanso addressing i business segregation so it can be extremely detailed fit. >> how do they find out? >> quite frankly there adviser? >> more than $10,000? >> if they have current legal counsel that raises the issue if they read about it on their own they know there is information on thee as ira's web site as well. >> are you an attorney? >> yes.nder >> paid by the hour? >> yes, sir. >> if i had my attorney who have to read thousands of pages of regulations is being charged by the hour? >> it does not necessarilyen you require the attorney to read the entire act but requires a ana

ms. bogardus. >> of the provisions definitely do hinder job growth and the hinder strong job growth and by that, i mean that the jobs that could be created in the future would instead be part-time jobs. that is of course advisors on the topic have their own bag of tricks and it is definitely possible to stay outside of compliance with respect to each individual employee if you can keep that individual in a per time position. full-time jobs are absolutely necessary. you cannot serve two masters. it's hard to have the word nation just on the part of the employee much less between the two separate employers. so strong job growth is necessary. and of course there are other issues involved as well. but i agree the funds that are spent to analyze the issue and then also to comply are extremely high and it's not just the initial cost. it's the participation every single year in the premium payment. >> thank you. mr. winstanley? >> i think that's what w that we seeing now is less people have insurance band

ms. bogardus. so, these business aggregation rules already apply to many aspects of business law like arissa and cobra. so i know some of these small businesses founded a su eit a s possibly, that it also included their compliance as it related to the affordable care act. so maybe you can explain to us why it came as a surprise when these aggregation rules already existed and small businesses were in compliance in other areas. and maybe there are some small businesses that are having to come in contact or in compliance with these aggregation laws for the first time. and maybe -- let us know why it was a surprise. maybe, too, what kinds of small businesses are experiencing this for the first time? what kinds of businesses that maybe never had to comply with this law before? even in other areas. >> yes. representative hahn, thank you. the answer to that is that while these rules have been in effect for quite some time, they affect arissa, cobra, medicare, secondary, a number of technical issues inclu