ms. mcarthy, you said definitely and unequivocally, detention does not deter migration. can you tell me how you know that? >> from our cases. i mean, we've seen so many cases of individuals. that was part of this complaint that we filed with crcl is that there are individuals who arrived here and were detained and then were deported back to their home country and came back because they were not safe. and so we've seen case after case whether it's because of persecution or wanting to be reunited with their family, it has not solved the problem. >> so to the extend that there may be some in policy making positions who believe, albeit regrettable i presumably the fact that these mothers and children are being detained in less than the least restrictive settings that they could possibly be dealt with in the notion that that is sending a message to perspective immigrants that they might as well stay home. that's not an affective message, is that your contention? >> i don't think people who are fearing for their lives think about what's on the other end. they flee. and that's

ms. mcarthy we'll open that up for questions and i will sort of lead off and let my colleagues to go next. during the break in one of the panels you mentioned to me that you had some comments about mr. con roy of cca's comments in response to my question about prison labor. could you elaborate on that, please. >> so i was struck by how carefully his response was. he told you that cca does not use detainee labor for outside contractors in ice detention. but as mr. libel just pointed out, there are tens of thousands of people everyday -- well, every year in ice detention facilities who are working to mop the floors, cook the food, clean the toilets. basically all the work that is required to keep the facility running for about $1 a day. this rate is something that was originally developed for pows. in fact, it was used for the japanese incarceration camps during world war ii so it's ironic that we're talking about this on this day but that rate has remained the same without adjustment for inflation since world war ii so you now have a situation where the ice detention system has affectively