ms. pipkins, let me follow-up on that. tell our viewer what kind of son e.j. man. he would give you the shirt off his back. anybody he could help, he was going to do that. he was definitely going to do that, just like his father has, he was there. he's -- he's stopping by checking on his father saying, you know, dad, is there anything you need? what is it that i can do for you? taking him places. he even took him to some of his malls. he loved people. >> and he was in the mall on thanksgiving night, this shooting happened, attorney crump, and all of a sudden he ends up shot, killed by police and then they come out and accuse him of a shooting that he had nothing to do with to justify the police shooting him when there was a lot of reaction because there was a shooting by someone that is still at large, is that correct? >> absolutely. reverend al, there seems to be a pattern in america that when police encounter young, black people as the suggestion is, we need the good guys to have guns to stop the mass shootings by bad guys. well, when police officers see goo