nancy gibbs, the editor of time joins me now. your most recent cover this bold red letters it asks is truth dead. what is your conclusion? >> it's fascinating we are having the conversation now. we've been having for quite some time around this president. a week that began with the fbi director saying completely inci incindirary statement that what the president said. we've been having this other debate about what does it mean. what are the implications of having a president whose relationship with truth is unlike any we've seen in a public figure probably in our lifetimes. >> let me put part of it on screen. you said like many news rooms we have wrestled with what to do, what to say when someone is lying. we can point out when a president gets his facts wrong, asks the follow up questions. there's a limit to what we can deduce about motive or intent. the word that comes up is lie. when you have decided to apply the word lie or not to the president's claims? >> we're careful with that language. it's true that it's our business to

nancy gibbs, where are we in this question of truth and how difficult is it for journalists? y: journalists have been debating a long time of when you say someone is lying and the challenge is that it is much easier for us to check facts. we always do that. although this statement is true, the statement is not true, partially true. when you talk about someone lying, there is an added layer of intent. what is it that they know or believe? are the mistaking or intentionally stating a falsehood? i think that is where this president has posed a particular challenge to the people covering it. a great many things he says is the much lovelfalse. he knows what he is saying is false and how many of them are actually things that are untrue but he believes are true? i think separating those things is very important because what presidents believe is enormously important and what they decide to do. what issues they care about, what wars they start, they end. what challenges they face and how. a president's knowledge and his understanding of fact is a greatly important. charlie: and his cr

. >> rose: and we look into the question of truth with nancy gibbs, the editor of "time" magazine and david leonhardt of the "new york times." >> what we have here is a case in which the current president speaks so many untruths, just again and again and again and again, about the murder rate, his electoral marge, about the crowds during inauguration day, about j.f.k.'s assassination, about 9/11, about president obama's worth i about president obama's wiretapping, and i could go on with 20 more, he speaks so many untruths that i think with we have to conclude that he doesn't feel bound bid truth. >> rose: finally, actor richard gere talking about his new film, "norman: the moderate rise and tragic fall of a new york fixer." >> the interesting thing i found out about norman and playing him, which surprised me, is that there was no anger in him. he gets hurt, and he's humiliated time after time. this is kind of a charlie chaplain side of him. there's no anger. >> rose: a look at health care in washington and a conversation with richard gere when we continue. >> rose: funding for "charli

nancy gibbs' writer began his piece about her, him, the president by saying "a president who pedals falsehoodnspiracy confronts the challenge of reality." how difficult is this for journalists? >> journalists have been debating for a long time about when you say someone is lying, the challenge is it's much easier for us to check facts. we always do that, and know this statement is true, this statement is not true, this statement is partially true. when you talk about whether someone is lying, there is an added layer of intent, what do they believe, are they mistaken or intentionally misat a timing a falsehood, what's where this president pose add particularly challenge to people covering him. a great many things he says are demonstrably false, but how many things would he says would qualify as lies, he knows what he's saying are false, and how many are actually things that are untrue but he believes are true? as you said in your letter before this piece, it is vital that we be able to believe our president, it is also viet that we know what he believes and why. the president has made both a s

i'll talk to nancy gibbs about her latest cover story and about when to say something is a lie. >>> the

times editor and chief nancy gibbs is with us now. have you received a response? >> not yet.ng that everyone agrees on 79% of people listening to that commitment to invest more in infrastructure agree, including 72% of people who did not support president trump. this is not a matter of whether to do this. it's a real test of can they come together on this issue where there is such broad agreement and still a real fight over how you would go about doing it. >> the freedom caucus, wouldn't they fight the expenditures. >> yeah, they're gonna fight. >> we have the answer. >> there's a faction in the house and senate that don't want to spend this money. the theory, and sam you follow this stuff in detail so you probably have a view about it, there are two big questions it seems to me about infrtructure. one ihink is a big historical question we'll be asking for years and it is why did the administration, given trump's passion for it, bannon's passion for it, why did they not put infrastructure first ahead of health care, a thing that could have gotten democratic support. the secon