nikolas, can you tell us experience about the hack-a-thons? >> i've only been to one hack-a-thon which is the tumblr hack-a-thon and i from it i received a whole bunch of education when i went and they showed me how they took a problem and used coding to solve it in a way that was unknown to me when i went. they stated the problem to a whole group of people and then they decided how they would use -- they would use the certain apis that tumblr gave them to solve the problem and it was cool. i've never seen anything like it. >> that's really awesome. apr's application programming interface. >> yeah. >> one of the -- what we can offer these students is exposure to the tech industry even students like nikolas who already knew he wanted to get into tech and is studying it at his school is on the robotics team have so little access to actual technology professionals. have never visited a company that a technology company in new york that the first company that we brought you to was spotify and nikolas said i thought spotify was just overseas in eur

. >> thanks for much, nikolas. >> thank you. i'm going to be very brief and say that on the democracy assistance has not been successful. i think tom or others will probably make a strong case for it. i agree with all of that. i think it has been very successful and that would just leave it at that and focus on some of the challenges. i should say also that i'm coming from the world bank and these are my own views, not of at the bank tried to stop me, so there's a democratization movement going with in the bank, too. i think ideas matter and i think how we frame problems in the world matter. and i think if we look, if you just watch five or 10 minutes of news, you get the sense of security crises out of control, that we've got border crisis and we've got terrorism and the long war, and we've got drug wars. there's just all of these problems. the ebola panic, and we just see the way that we frame the challenges, that we have today. there's a very heavy emphasis on there's a world that is a dangerous place and we have to do everyt

i want to get to nikolas in the conversation because there are not questions directly to nikolas and as we talk about the role of democracy and development and in terms of how we create long-term interests. where does these issues play in terms of the short-term goals? tom also talked about balancing these very important considerations. so from your perspective as you take a more real polltic view of the world, where do you place issues like democracy and development? and to what extent, by focusing on realpolitik issues do you face backlash when the ultimate revolt comes and we're unprepared to deal with that reaction? >> what is interesting about many of the questions, it comes back to the point the ambassador raised in his opening remarks, democracy, what point of the foreign policy pyramid should it be? is it the apex or one of many issues or going whether syria, ukraine or middle east or anywhere else? we do struggle where are we going to put this and i think that coming back to this question of real politic, we found, that that if country is tied to us because it has existentia

maybe the first point to make is one that nikolas concluded on which is, you know, the nehru problem, as it were. i prefer nehru to mao and a democratic india to totalitarian china. we don't expect every country when they become democratic to somehow do our business, you know, do our bidding. but democracies tend to be friendlier than dictatorships which, you know, often rely upon needing enemies which whip up extreme nationalism to deal with their legitimacy problems. i prefer south korea to north korea. south korea's not perfect, and a lot of people in south korea that have problems with the current government. but i assure you, it's better than north korea and not just that it doesn't have a gulag and murder its own people, but it's friendlier to us than north korea. and those are the choices we face in the world. and it's not irrelevant, you know, that dem can accuracies are not perfect -- democracies are not perfect and 100% allies. second point, yeah, change sometimes difficult. first of all, we don't bring all, about all that change. mubarak was not going to be permanently ther