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joining me now is norm eisen, the former white house chief ethics lawyer under president obama. co-founder of the contrarian, which has come out with a boom. people haven't subscribed. they should. okay, norm, there's a lot i want to ask you about. but first of all, can any president just legally fire inspector generals? what are the confines of the law? >> gen donald trump promised to be a dictator on day one, and he's carried that forward through the entire week, including this midnight firing of the igs. this is a country of laws, not of dictatorial leaders. >> he gave them 30 days. could he just fire them? and more than that. >> he has to give them 30 days, and he has to give congress reasons. so this is of a piece he claims there's no birthright citizenship for american people. he flouted the constitution here. he's flouting the statute. he's testing and pushing the limits. i agree with him on one thing. yes, it's a common thing to do in a dictatorship, not in the united states of america. >> so we were just talking about this before we started, before we came on air, is th

also with us is former white house ethics czar norm eisen.jen and norm announced they are launching the contrarian and independent media project they say will be unshackled by corporate interests. and anybody can sign up and subscribe today. so let me start with you, jen, because this was a big announcement. you've been at the post a long time. you love the institution. i know, but some of what you said in here, i think spoke to what some of your colleagues have also felt. what drove you to leave the post? >> it's been a long time coming, but the central fact is we're at an inflection point in american democracy, and we need a free press that's going to stand up to authoritarianism, that's going to speak truth, and that is not going to equivocate and deal in a lot of false equivalencies. >> and unfortunately, the post under its current ownership has made very clear that they're in the business of accommodating, enabling, giving money to donald trump. >> can you only imagine katharine graham giving $1 million to richard nixon or lbj? >> i can'

evan perez, norm eisen, thank you both so much.e'll have continuing coverage here on cnn as soon as that report is released. but up next, we're going back to the urgency of california. this for a closer look at the inmates who are on the front lines of the race to stop these wildfires, hundreds being used in what's become, to some, a controversial practice. so what is it really like? i've got a former inmate turned professional firefighter who is standing by next. >> as the new year starts. >> follow cnn. president carter will be remembered for his lifetime of service reporting the events shaping history. >> follow all the changes in 2025. >> i, donald john trump, follow the facts. >> follow. see it. >> saving for retirement was tough enough, and navigating markets can be challenging at times. >> i understand that's why at fisher investments we keep a disciplined approach with your portfolio, helping you through the market's ups and downs. >> what about communication? >> we check in regularly to keep you informed, which means you'l

norm eisen, trump appointed judge cannon, as you and i well know to the bench. so how do you interpret his claim that he doesn't know her? >> well, wolf, he's engaging in trying to tell a story, a completely made up story about what happened. any other american who had maintained these documents in their home? if i had taken even a single document when i was in the white house or the state department, i would be prosecuted and be in the pokey right now. he wants to distract from that. he says he won all the cases. wolf, 34 criminal convictions. laura and i were in court for them in new york for election interference and cover up. so he's distancing himself from her even though she is his nominee. as part of this narrative, he's trying to change the reality of what happened. >> you know, it's interesting because, as you know, trump takes office as president in about 13 days from now, 13 days. so does the attorney current attorney general, merrick garland, have enough time to rule on whether or not this report should be released? can he release it? >> well, he has

so i, together with my partner in crime, as it were, norm eisen, decided to form the contrarian.oing. >> to let. >> democracy die in darkness or in. plain sight. frankly, we are going to attack authoritarian moves that degrade and that destroy democracy. and one of the things we're going to do is bring in a lot of voices that maybe the mainstream media has overlooked younger voices, voices from people of color, voices from across the political spectrum. and the only thing they have to do is be in favor of democracy, have something interesting and fun to say. and we're also going to talk about culture. we're also going to feature. we sent a goodie bag home with our subscribers over the weekend, a cartoon, a cookie recipe, and a cat, a favorite pet of the week. why are we doing that? because you have to maintain joy. you cannot let them crush your spirit. you cannot let them have you mope around, give up hope, refuse to engage with other people. joy. culture is one of the ways we fight back against this gray, oppressive, thuggish authoritarianism. >> i've been tired all morning. i

and so i, together with norm eisen, who i know, you know and has been a good friend of the show, decided to find a way to do this. and we found the contrarian. it has been a success beyond our wildest imagination. the response has been overwhelming, not just from subscribers, but for writers who want to join us, from other news organizations who want to partner with us. i think when you give something to the american people, that is yes, fact based, but is clear, unequivocal, takes a moral stance, they will respond. and we're also going to be fun and funny. and we have everything from cooking to pets to music. we're going to try to do what they used to call in the old days. david will appreciate this. the back of the book in a magazine, which is all the fun stuff that isn't necessarily hard news. >> yeah, because, look, we might be at this for a while. david, you point out this is not always the erosion of democracy does not always happen very quickly. it sometimes doesn't happen very successfully. sometimes it doesn't happen at all. i am a little surprised at the speed with which instit