doing whatever the north korean equivalent of a high five is. >> that's a good question. maybe it is a salute to the picture of the holy trinity, the kims. again, we don't know for sure if it was north korea, as the source. but it's definitely great publicity for them. and i just want to say that a lot of americans. are making forward to this. we suspend politics when we watch. as an american it is just unfortunate. >> you were expressing the possibility that that might get seen. quickly before we go. my best wish is that sony would put it out on demand, and just as a great sort of gesture to everyone out there. that we can't be unbowed. >> from the washington post, kathryn moon from the brookings institution, bruce nash from nash institution services, great to have you all with me, that brings us to the end of this edition, thank you for being with us, the program may be over, be uh the conversation continues. we want to hear what you think about the issues on this show, do you want to see the interview, would you go to a movie theater to see it. send us your thoughts on

and the north korean economy is basically primary export country. yet, for example, russia is suffering from downfall of oil prices. and, also, the 1980s, what north korea could export is primary goods. and fisheries. and, also, forced product. you had to connect only certain amount of fishery. you can connect from old work. world economy. you must introduce technology. you must adapt to the foreign markets. but if you are primary goods export country, you don't have to run from the world economy. yes. kim jong-il presents or gives a certain amount of trade allowance to armed forces. and the military distributes sub units. divides to the sub units. he can say his licenses if he can pay back some amount of money. but it's illegal. by it's -- everybody does the same. so as she says that this is we can say formation of institutions. and in north korea, the market has developed by itself, by is own dynamics. and we can observe that the institutioner in er i institutional system has developed autonomously without protection, without the guarantee of legal

and then allowing such marketplaces has become the lifeline of north korean people. another social phenomenon is that north the north korean people are nowadays having more and more access to the south korean pop culture and even newscasts, the dvd, radio, television, and even usb, being caught and punished. and 2.4 million units have been reportedly supplied to the north korean people, and that number will continue to increase. so at this session we we will examine how these social phenomenon we will affect the political and social transformation of north korean people. and one of the questions before us is whether the survivor of the north korean regime would be compatible with the unstoppable marketization of north korea so now we have pretty distinguished speakers. person of the korea institute for national unification and center for north korean studies. based in china. at the moment the director. for the details these speakers before you. i suggest that each speaker have up to 20 minutes so that we can have some time for useful discussions and interactions betwe

north koreans talk about race. they say they are the purest race, and this is very important for them. they understand our race relations to a greater extent than we think they do. as i said i'm not surprised that they were able to take the most inflammatory portions of the e-mail and release that. they are very good at this. remember, propaganda is really been the forte of the kim family. from 1948 since the founding of the north korean state. >> are we limited because we know so little about them, because dennis rodman is the only american we can rely on for insights about this guy? >> i don't think we're limited. i think there are a number of things we can do beyond a cyber attack. we know that the north korean regime depends on flows of money. if we cut them off we've seen what happens. in 2005 when the bush administration put financial sanctions in place it affected the regime. there are things. we are not without tools in this area. and especially with regard to the sale of ballistic missiles, nuclear weapons

the world has the wrong view of the north korean state. incorrect world view, north korea was able to increase its ability to launch cyber attacks. south korea learned the hard way. banks across the country were paralyzed, atms frozen for days, media outlets dark, servers jammed or wiped. north korea denied it was the source of the hack but in the wake of the attack, south korea beefed up its own cyber forces declaring the on-line war as dangerous as pyongyang's nuclear ambitions. north korea exists in the land of over the top propaganda while experts say it age wages its parallel war in cyberspace led by a young man of the internet stage, ushering in a new phase of the korean conflict. cnn, seoul. >> amazing stuff. let's continue the conversation with the former u.s. ambassador of the united nations bill richardson. joining us, david rothcough, editor of foreign policy magazine and chief correspondent jim sciutto. governor richardson, i know you've been there several times to north korea. let me play a little clip. this is josh earnest th

korea so ordinary north korean citizens could get these and watch them. the other thing they're concerned about is what goes on all the time and that is smugglers taking d.v.d.'s into north korea across the chinese border for profit. the north korean leadership was obviously very concerned with people in north korea seeing this. you got to remember that people in north korea have a pretty slanted or very narrow view of the world because they only know very little about what goes on. and the leekage of d.v.d.'s into north korea has been one of the primary ways where north koreans understand what's going on first of all in south korea and also the rest of the world. so they did not want this d.v.d. getting into north korea. that was really i think what they were driving at with regard to this movie. once people start to understand that their leaders could be assassinated and that rand researcher talked about, then obviously they might decide to do the same thing. that's what the regime was really concerned about. host: monty tweets in, sony is a japanese cor

hackers being paid by the north korean government to do this. ermine. experts have told us that north korea's hacking capability has been improving. >> whether or not the north koreans outsourced or did it themselves, they's responsible, and presumably the u.s. government has determined that and presumably there will be a response. i want to bring in jeffrey toobin and peter beinart. jeffrey, there's going to have to be some serious deliberations in the u.s. government right now. what does the united states do to north korea if, in fact, they have determined, and we are reporting that they have determined north korea did this to sony pictures. >> we don't have a trade relationship with north korea. north korea is as isolated as any country in the world is right now. even more isolated than cuba was before today. and so we don't have a lot of levers of power. i think the real question is, how are we going to respond to these events in the future? are we simply going to back down and respond to every threat from north korea now by shutting down mov

to north korean asylum seekers in other countries. it is reasonable to debate the most effective strategy to end the nightmare of north korea's human rights crisis. what is unconscionable in the face of these widespread abuses and dangerous, given the threat the situation poses to international peace and security, is to stay silent. silence will not make the north korean government end its abuses. silence will not make the international community safer. we have begun to shine the light and what it reveals is terrified -- terrifying. we must continue to shine the light as long as abuses persist. today's session is another important step but far from the last towards accountability for the crimes committed against the people of north korea. the council must come back to speak regularly about the human rights situation and what we can do to change it for as long as the crimes that brought us here today persist. that is the absolute minimum we can and must do. thank you, mr. president. >> i thank the representative of the united states for

so this is an extension of the korean war. north korea is an army with a country. 40% of the korean war, our pows were psychologically tortured, and ultimately died. war, "the manchurian candidate" came out. you can see what we're up against -- psychological warfare. solution to the situation -- dropped food and north korea, not bombs. those people will overthrow the government. if you notice, the only weak person in north korea as their leader. why is he overweight, and the is in a famine? like forrest gump, that is all i have to say about that. host: and gary is next. gary is in florida. that r: i have a comments sony should not make any movie about killing any president in any country. and -- can you hear me? host: we're listening, sir. caller: and if they do make a a fantastic movie about reappropriation. a st: coming up in just minute, gordon chang is going to be with us. he writes for the "daily beast". he is a lawyer. and he has spent quite a bit of in china, as well. he has written quite a bit on this. we are going to contin

but park sang hak pledges north koreans will. this plastic bag is packed with western news clips about north korea's brutal atrocities from labor camps to attacks on south korea and music videos of how the west views the regime. for years park a north korean defector has launched the bags across the border. these giant balloons drop the bags into north korea with the hope of reaching the average citizen. and when it does it challenges the sole image north koreans have of the regime. this is all north koreans see their entire life. only one state controlled television station exists in north korea. kim jong un is god. his citizens expected to worship devout and loyal to a frenzy or pay the price of betrayal. the interview shatters the revered image of the regime, says park a silly comedy to the west a powerful tool for this defector. he waits and hopes sony releases on dvd. it's deeply personal. 20 years ago he read a south korean leaflet and he realized he needed to flee north korea. is this how you see the regime crumbling? "sing

somehow, it is starting and ending with a north korean issue. this must be just a coincidence. i am saying this with a heavy heart because for south koreans, people in north korea are not just anybody. millions of south koreans still have family members and relatives living in the north even though we never hear from them, even though by now the separation has become a fact of life. we know they are there. just a few hundred kilometers away from where we live. we cannot read what is described in the report without it breaking our hearts. we cannot watch video clips from north korea without flinching on every scene. we cannot listen to stories of north korean defectors without sharing in their tears, without feeling as if we are there with them to experience the prejudice. therefore, mr. president, as we leave the council with the debate of the dprk's human rights, we have an ardent wish. a wish for people in north korea. our innocent sisters and brothers on the streets, in the countryside, in the prisoners camp who are suffering for no reason. we only hope that one day in the fu

clearly interesting that in the fbi's statement they referenced north korean attacks on south korean nks so clearly there is an effort behind the scenes here by the united states to sort of put a ring around north korea diplomatically and get a lot of countries involved in whatever the response is going to be. >> it's a multinational response they are spear heading here rather than turning around to this country's security services and saying we unleash the hounds. >> interesting that they would invoke russia here. there's a lot of complaints about russian cyber activity and the united states has sanctions imposed on russia now and the united states has complained for years about chinese cyber hacking so to reach out to the chinese is an interesting move by washington. >> is there a sense here that the administration is trying to say with all of the cyber hacking that exists among governments sony is a step too far? it's a step beyond even what government cyber hacking should be doing? >> it's interesting. it's goes to this point that previously what we have seen from nation states ha

but the crime, in the eyes of the north koreans, dated back to the korean war.nd it was a very different kind of situation, and then once the north koreans had him in custody, they interrogated him. and at a certain point, it became clear that they made a mistake, and then the challenge was, how do you figure out how to let this guy go without losing face, after taking the drastic step of detaining him. >> mike, you've been to north korea seven times, and can you talk about the u.s. relationship with north korea and the sony story, where the accusations have flown that north korea has hacked into sony's computer system. >> well, the u.s. relationship with north korea is extremely fraught and it has been so since the end of the korean war, and there's no sign today that that is going to change. obama administration has made it very clear that it's not willing to engage in bilateral dialogue with the nort north koreans, and it's pressing them to agree in advance to commit to the eventual goal of getting rid of its nuclear weapons before any deployments can get und

>> for instance, north korean citizens have dvd players -- [ overlapping speakers ] >> so it starts playing on everyone's television in north korea. >> they take the dvds and give them to the south korean activists and put them in the balloons that go over the demilitaryized zones and that is how they get them. he had cut north korea off from the global system and we can do that. >> but their nuclear program has grown stronger. >> but we didn't pursue them and we have to do it because what we have seen the north koreans do by getting sony to pull this picture is basically they are determining what the content is in the u.s. >> well they are. and sean, it is the point that fareed made which is if iran did this, there is no question we are talking about very serious responses and you would be using the word war. because it is north korea and a regime people take as a joke. the discussion is a little more muted, but should it be. >> i don't know that it is north korea, but i think it is because it is cyber. and we've seen attacks and ex filtration of properties, research and development for ma

is speaking china's help in north korean threats. last year, tens of millions of credit card numbers were stolen from the retailer target servers after a major security breach. other institutions, jp morgan chase, home depot. even the u.s. posal service has all been victims of digital attacks in the past. cyber crime costs the internet in north korea is experiencing severe technical problems. one computer security expert in the u.s. describes the north korean system as totally down. when are governments, allies, and defenders of private business, when do governments seek protection of private entities as part of their own interests and why. we'll look at the action and reaction of those who pick the locks on sony's electronic front doors. joining us, ceo of global cyber risk, a cyber risk management firm. and chris hill, and alan friedman, a research scientist at george washington university. jodie, with such high profile breaches just in the past several months is there an explicit or implicit responsibility of government to help sh

north korean spies are attempted -- to v attempt today murder park -- have attempted to murder park. few options in dealing with north korea. but park believes he can get even. but the very movie the regime tries to hard to block, right in their own backyard. now sony is under pressure to release the movie the company's attorney says at some point the movie will be released. but sony does not know how. >>> family in person woe land as -- western poland has entered the record books for this. more than 60,000 christmas lights are lighting up this house and that's the most lights ever in poland. the family started the tradition of putting up holiday decorations 17 years ago. over the years, they have added to the display making their house one of their hometown's biggest christmas attractions. >>> and nasa says you can see christmas lights from space. it says many cities glow up to 50% brighter this time of the year. here's a good look at the bay area and sacramento. the places that are green have more lights than usual. it's the same for california and arizona and phoenix is one place w

. >> so the north korean government actually put out on one o one of their web pages. sony pictures is going to release on christmas a film called the interview. it stars james franco and seth rogan in a comedy plot where they're hired by the cia to kill kim jong-un. it's an assassination. the north koreans on their website said they called the interview, quote, a provocation deserving stern punishment. hollywood was shaking in their boots. they pulled the release date. there's a belief on the part of sony that the north korean government along with 3,000 hackers in china that go by the name of guardians of peace hacked sony pictures. shut down the computer system, but stole those

according to a north korean defector, the north koreans have a vast group of hackers around the world called bureau 121. >> it's a highly sophisticated organization under the military branch of the people's republic of north korea. and what this group is designed to do is to advance their cyberwarfare capabilities. >> reporter: sony executives are calling the act an act of terrorism and now the obama administration under mounting pressure to respond yet so far the administration is hesitant to point the finger at north korea. >> we have to consider a range of series of options which we are doing in the u.s. government about how to respond to it. >> reporter: u.s. officials tell cnn that's because they are looking at how to hold north korea's feet to the fire. north korea could be crippled if the u.s. goes after chinese banks that do business with pyongyang or the u.s. could flex its cybermuscles and flex an attack on pyongyang's computer systems. >> the only way we'll stop them is if they are persuaded that this was a bad idea. we've got to react in a way that deters future attacks of

so, if the chinese know about this and have leverage over the north koreans, that is one tract that the.s. must take. >> if the united states is certain, though, that this originated from north korea, perhaps with chinese help, does the kind of counterattack that the obama administration might envision including that sort of chinesebation but are the specific things that the administration can do without actually harming the majority of the north korean people? >> well, that's a very good question in terms of safe guarding the wellbeing and the rights of the north korean people and their ability, also, those who are very adventuresom and curious about the outside world to access the outside world through spillover or elicit signals that they may be able to get from the existing infrastructure. so we don't want to harm their curiosity or prevent that curiosity. people talk about putting north korea back on the terror list. i think right now, it's premature to do that because there are various definitions of cyber terrorism according to international norms, and we would have to legally be

not necessarily just north korean territory. i think to do attribution is difficult. this is north korea and there is some ties to north korea, you still have to do the thorough investigation. that's what the fbi is doing. >> if it was and could break into sony, what else could they get into? >> that's my biggest concern. while the fact of the matter this sony incident raised great awareness among american public and these corporations, these kind of attacks by nation states have been going on for a long time. not necessarily a destructive perspective from china, russia, iran, breached thousands of u.s. companies and stole billions of dollars worth of data, property, corporate strategies. this is a big problem. >> you bring up a good point. the past, it has to do with corporate theft. a lot of the hacking by nation and states or different nations into steal secrets or make money. what happened here if it was north korea, they broke in to stop sony from making a movie with a political motive. that's one of the reasons people are calling this cyber terrorism. it was a p

however, i do think by pulling the movies they gave the north koreans -- and let's be honest where thiseat came from -- i think u.s. officials have reported that this came from north korea, bureau 121. what they effectively did was give them a victory and gave them what they wanted to achieve, which was the pulling down of this movie. i hope at some point this movie will be shown and the intrigue over it will make it more of a money maker. but i think pulling it gave them exactly what they wanted. >> and i guess the converse argument, when i was talking to a hollywood friend yesterday, is that people were -- the people that control the theaters and the people who made the movie were so afraid that figure happened, even if something not done by the north koreans, just a lone wolf or copycat or whatever, that they would then be attacked by many of the same people who are criticizing them now for caving, for -- somebody said they should change their name to neville chamberlain pictures. >> i can certainly understand that, particularly around the holidays, that is a date we're concerned wit

nation, i so dislike north korean leader kim jong-un that, let's just say, i'm not going to name my nextd evidently neither is anyone else. >> there is only one kim jong-un in north korea. that's a law. by directive of the north korean regime, the name kim jong-un is off limits to any other citizens of the secretive and repressive state. birth certificates with the names kim jong-un are rejected and anyone who happens to share the supreme leader's name must change it. >> stephen: gotta do it. when the average north korean sees the headline "kim jong-un inspects local lube factory," you don't want them wondering, "is that kim jong-un, the farmer from down the road, or kim jong-un the dictator who killed that farmer for having the same name?" point is, you do not want to cross this guy. consider what's happening to sony pictures over their upcoming movie "the interview," starring james franco and tonight's guest seth rogen. (cheering) they play tv journalists recruited by the c.i.a. to assassinate kim jong-un, i'm guessing by smoking a lot of pot at him. apparently, ol' sourpuss here doesn

in with the north korean government's blessing there would not hurt them in the same way. with a very different situation. but besides all that it is now the court with humidity wife with the level of the enslavement with the citizens to be allowed to exist because no one has done it. it with that report coming at of north korea. i don't know how i feel about all of this and then to have blood on their hands but i feel it is on all of the average hands because this country has been like this over 60 years. with the political prisoners. so i dunno how much longer with that propaganda concert. >> with limited miniskirts a wonder anyone use spoke to referenced? if not their role areas but the city's. if they remembered that gore thought about that? >> and as the afghans refer to that this is the russian or soviet attempt and then before that it was very limited. it was not like that was a time when women were free. said to be referred to as the hour rushes by afghans. event to become elected but is largely referred to with a short period of time. then to some extent. also the

it is starting and ending with a north korean issue. coincidence.just a i am saying this with a heavy koreans,ause for south people in north korea are not just anybody. millions of south koreans still have family members and relatives living in the north even though we never hear from now theen though by separation has become a fact of life. we know they are there. just a few hundred kilometers away from where we live. read what is described in the report without it breaking our hearts. we cannot watch video clips from north korea without flinching on every scene. we cannot listen to stories of north korean defectors without sharing in their tears, without feeling as if we are there with them to experience the prejudice. as weore, mr. president, leave the council with the debate of the dprk's human , we have an ardent wish. a wish for people in north korea. our innocent sisters and brothers on the streets, in the countryside, in the prisoners camp who are suffering for no reason. we only hope that one day in the future when you look back

week, the movie studio nixed the release of the comedy film "the interview" about a plot to kill north korean leader kim jong-un. the cancellation followed threats against theaters and a hack of corporate data which officials say was ordered by the north korean government. speaking to cnn, president obama said the u.s. would respond proportionately, but said he doesn't consider the hacking an act of war. >> i don't think it was an act of war. i think it was an act of cybervandalism that was very costly, very expensive.

in 2010 we saw the north koreans take out a south korea submarine killing 46 south koreans. r that year we saw north korea, again this is in 2010 shell a small pacific island and it killed four south koreans so we've seen this in 2010, this increase in terrorism from the north koreans, i don't understand why president bush took them off the list in 2008 and certainly we should have put them back on the list at least by 2010 when they demonstrated that they were willing to kill their neighbors just for a military exercise. >> rick, i get the distinct impression that you don't buy this denial on their part that they had nothing to do with the hacking of sony pictures. >> you know, i don't buy it but it's a golden opportunity for the president and for the nsc, for our national security advisor susan rice to come forward with evidence for the world. you know, these types of denials by north korea do play well at the un. there are some people who will believe this. others, obviously are very skeptical. what we should do is take the opportunity to ruin north korea's credibility her

in 2010 we saw the north koreans take out a south korea submarine killing 46 south koreans. r that year we saw north korea, again this is in 2010 shell a small pacific island and it killed four south koreans so we've seen this in 2010, this increase in terrorism from the north koreans, i don't understand why president bush took them off the list in 2008 and certainly we should have put them back on the list at least by 2010 when they demonstrated that they were willing to kill their neighbors just for a military exercise. >> rick, i get the distinct impression that you don't buy this denial on their part that they had nothing to do with the hacking of sony pictures. >> you know, i don't buy it but it's a golden opportunity for the president and for the nsc, for our national security advisor susan rice to come forward with evidence for the world. you know, these types of denials by north korea do play well at the un. there are some people who will believe this. others, obviously are very skeptical. what we should do is take the opportunity to ruin north korea's credibility her

and the north koreans are getting away with it.ust as putin is getting away with it, just as enemies of america are getting away with it. there should have been a much stronger response from the president of the united states to the threat to create another 9/11. through hacking. by the way, it's not just this president. richard clark has been complaining about cyber terrorism, terrorism against the united states from iran, from russia, from china, for and years. and nothing has happened. the president hasn't done anything, a succession of presidents hasn't done anything and neither has the congress. >> i'm talking about the president this time, this terrorist, right now about north korea. it is extraordinary to me that north korea can send a message to sony saying anybody goes to this movie, you will face a 9/11-like attack and we did not hear a word from the administration. does that surprise you, as well? >> first of all, i think sony was terribly embarrassed by the e-mails that were out there. not sanl major corporation in amer

we know that the north korean regime depends on flows of money. if we cut them off we've seen what happens. in 2005 when the bush administration put financial sanctions in place it affected the regime. there are things. we are not without tools in this area. and especially with regard to the sale of ballistic missiles, nuclear weapons technology, that the north koreans sell to the iranians with china's help. we cut that off that would have a big effect on the ejeem. then the ruler wouldn't have the support of the other people. >> final question. i asked this of secretary ridge, i'll ask it of gordon change. the chinese, think they were vofrled? >> definitely were involved. those were routed tli chinese ip addresses. china has the great fire wall t most sophisticated controls nobody could have been able to

the reaction of people monitored by the north korean orchestrators. hey actually, john yang in 2001, with the e.u., we met a lot of people. but the group of idea, even though we did it in north korea, but we didn't see north korea and the propaganda theme. >> in reference to your question, i mean, we had to reader surveys where we ask what topics you cover more of. the interesting name is when you put these surveys out you put these surveys out, there is wmd, human rights, blah, blah, blog. the thing that continuously comes back as feedback is people want to know about daily life in north korea way more than any other topic or so we have a column in north korea where we have various factors come in and talk about very mundane aspects of daily life. how to date, just the stories, but it can only really be done accurately outside the country. but it is encouraging and that there is the very strong interest in learning about the reality on the ground. >> we could go on and on, but i'm afraid we need to draw this to a close. i want to thank all of you for

the north koreans are saying, no, we're listen. >> you've said in some of what i've read online that actually could be an upside to this and could be a good thing, the fact that north korea even though this is how they're doing it is engaging with the outside world, does care about how it's perceived. spin that out for me. >> you know, i said that it was a good thing before this attack became so serious. but i do think they're paying attention and have been very, very upset about the threat to bring kim jong-un before the international criminal court on human right as becauses and that also shows that they're paying attention, they're engaged with the outside world if not in a very productive way. >> just in the few seconds we have left, what would be your advice as far as what should be happen next? should sony shelf this or should the u.s. government get involved? what should happen next. >> to be honest i'm still a bit skeptical. i'd like to see what evidence the u.s. government has that the north koreans really did it. you know, certainly they had the technical capability and the

the world has the wrong view of the north korean state. incorrect world view, north korea was able to increase its ability to launch cyberattacks. south korea learned the hard way. banks across the country last year were paralyzed, atms forgotten for days. media outlets went dark, servers jammed or wiped. north korea denied it was the source of the hack. but in the wake of the attack, south korea beefed up its own cyberforce, declaring the online war as dangerous as pyongyang's nuclear ambitions. north korea exists in the land of over the top propaganda, while experts say it wages its parallel war in cyberspace, led by a young man of the internet age ushering in a new phase of the korean conflict. what north korea craves most is visibility on the global map. what this hack of sony has done is given them exactly that. kyung lah, cnn, seoul. >>> well, the attack at sony may not be the only time a major company in the u.s. has been targeted, allegedly by an outside government. we're now learning details of a computer attack on sands casinos.

investigators concluded that north korean leaders ordered the attack. a statement from the administration blaming north korea and laying out the response was anticipated as early today instead a white house spokesperson didn't use the words north korea in responding to questions about the attack, simply saying the investigation is ongoing. >> i'm not prepared to ascribe any accountability for this specific act or to describe who might have been the sophisticated actor that initiated it. >> and careful to use the word "act" or using the word terror or war or anything like that. could this mean the u.s. is about to blame other countries or third parties. and today posters for the movie the interview, many are upset sony did not pull the picture. and pamela is "outfront," why no formal response from the white house? >> that could change quickly. we know right now u.s. officials are gearing up to respond publy as -- publicly as early as tomorrow morning and to publicly state how they came to this conclusion and this is in the wake by the extraordinary move b

north korean military. comedy in the dprk, you ask? well, sort of. as a comedy writer, is it very dangerous, what you can make jokes about? among writers, he says, the ones single to prison or executed most often are the comedy writers. go too far in a punch line. it's prison time. often for the entire family. kim says the goal of public comedy is not to laugh but as another method to enhance loyalty to the regime. it is little wonder north korea fails to see the humor of this silly american movie. satire just doesn't exist. joking about the supreme leader and killing the character on the big screen is not metaphor but punishable by death. kim understands why the movie would push north korea to launch a cyber attack. something the regime denies doing. this former comedic writer is now in the very unfunny business and sending it via proxys. he doesn't joke about it because he wants his former homeland to understand the very serious consequences of what began as a comedy. it bears reminding that we are in the

the world has the wrong view of the north korean state. with that incorrect world view, north korea was able to increase its ability to launch cyberattacks. south korea learned the hard way. banks across the country were paralyzed. atms frozen for dpas. media outlets went darks, servers jammed or wiped. north korea denied it was the source of the hack. but in the wake of the attack, south korea beefed up its own cyber forces, declaring the online war as dangerous as pyongyang's nuclear ambitions. north korea exists in the land of over the top propaganda, while experts say it wages its parallel war in cyberspace, led by a young man of the internet age, ushering in a new phase of the korean conflict. what north korea craves most is visibility on the map. what sony has done is given them exactly that. >> well, now sony is saying if you want to see this movie "the interview" because of the cyberattack, you are out of luck. it's remarkable that north korea can actually prevent americans from watching a movie. obviously a lot of people are weighi

on north korean studies and having this seminar here today. then after being a reporter who had studied north korea seriously i can find ten ideas to make content while preserving the principles. so i will quickly read just title, the ten titles. maybe it would be helpful for you all. one is the basic. cross check. cross check. cross check. when we cross check the information we can get more in . and the second major distinguishment from north korea, for example, we can make a graph with the data offers, third, cover north korea directly, like we have to visit, and we have to interpret from the northen korean zone. fourth, utilize the resources from the society from academiac or social sinuses or something like that. and the fifth fact-finding in the past, the woodrow wilson centers, nkied project, which was my treasure ship for scooping, so i made lots of scoop in the under, in this document. and sixth is making network of intellectual supporters and seven thr making international sources. that is why i'm here as a correspondent, washington co

there's really no money to be made in north korea, so hollywood is more than eager to use north koreans as villains. so, in that sense, alyssa rosenberg is right that we are offloading a lot of things on to north korea in many, many different ways. now, this does not fill my heart with sympathy for the north korean regime, as i say, but i think it is a kind of evasion of things that we should be thinking about, a long list of things we should be thinking about. i guess i agree with her. host: the north korean regime taking their complaint about the movie to the united nations back in july, asking them to have u.s. authorities ban the movie. we ask our viewers what movies should be sent overseas, what pop culture movies should be en overseas, a few tweets, show them "wall street" and "network" so they know what they're up against. our twitter page also says the movies we need to make are historical documentaries. we'll be taking your thoughts on that as we continue talking with martha bayles. she wrote "through a screen darkly: popular culture, public diplomacy, and america's image abroa