the nsa adapted and moved on.ith the fall of the soviet union admissions team less urgent submitting and the nsa lagged behind in the latest technology. as general michael hayden the nsa director who took charge in 1999 put it, in an age of telecommunications breakthroughs the nsa was becoming deaf. but 9-11 delivered a shock that was loud enough for everyone to hear. the nsa got a bigger budget and a new mission, stop the next attack. which leads us to a massive data center being built by the nsa in the utah desert. it's capacity to collect and analyze data so enormous it has even former nsa staffers worried. >> it is really a turnkey situation where it could be turned quickly and become a totalitarian state pretty quickly. >> how comfortable are you with the government being able to know so much. that's next. alec, for this mission i upgraded your smart phone. ♪ right. but the most important feature of all is... the capital one purchase eraser. i can redeem the double miles i earned with my venture card to erase

nsa is not saying.tion was just about any of that and perhaps even more. >> drake says americans should be concerned about letting the government go too far in the name of security. >> the only way to have perfect security is a perfect surveillance state. that's george orwell, that's 1984. that's what that would look like. >> drake is not alone in feeling that way. >> whatever you did electronically, they could capture. >> bill benny worked at the nsa nearly four decades, starting as a data analyst in the days before desktop computers. after 9/11, the nsa began a warrantless surveillance program approved by president bush. >> it started with the telecoms providing billing data records of people in the united states calling people in the united states. my estimate is that they were collecting 3 billion a day. >> 3 billion phone records? >> 3 billion, yeah. that's internal for ththis coun >> nsa was spying on americans within this country. >> he thought it was wrong and quit in protest. someone leaked a s

the nsa was becoming deaf. 9-11 delivered a shock that was loud enough for everyone to hear. the nsa got a bigger budget and a new mission, stop the next attack. which leads us to a massive data center being built by the nsa in the utah desert. it's capacity to collect and analyze data so enormous it has even former nsa staffers worried. >> it is really a turnkey situation where it could be turned quickly and become a totalitarian state pretty quickly. >> how comfortable are you with the government being able to know so much. that's next. did you know, your eyes can lose vital nutrients as you age? [ male announcer ] that's why there's ocuvite to help replenish key eye nutrients. ocuvite has a unique formula not found in your multivitamin to help protect your eye health. ocuvite. help protect your eye health. this tree has deep roots, strong limbs... things are pched and not pinned. nicely done. thboys love it. they are up there day and night. well that might be because y overlooked one thing... what? it looks

but the nsa's first amendment, as whistleblower thomas drake has said, was for a long time that the nsa never spied on americans without warrants. that changed after 9/11. the gloves came off, and suddenly they were sucking up vast quantities of our internet and phone conversations, you know, data mining them looking for so-called terrorist patterns. and, you know, essentially, operating a dragnet spying operation which including the private communications of americans and doing so without specific warms. warrants. so we learned that, actually, too late, much too late in 2005 as a result of a new york times story that broke that news to the public. "the new york times," by the way, it's important to say at a media conference, "the new york times" sat on that story for a full year. today knew, you know, they had received information about what was going on before the 2004 election, and they did not tell the public until after the election. they did that on purpose. they said that they did it because the journalists needed more time to research the story at the cough the bush -- at the re

the nsa adopted and moved on. with the fall of the soviet union the missions team less urgent and the nsa lagged behind in the latest technology. as the nsa director who took charge in 99 put it in the age of tell communication breakthroughs the nsa was becoming deaf. but 9-11 had a shock that made everyone hear. they got a bigger budget and mission stop the next attack which led to a massive data center in the utah success ert the capacity to collect and analyze data so enormous had had former nsa staffers worried. >> it is a turnkey situation where it can become a totalitarian state quickly. >> how informed are you with the government being able to know so much. we got a subaru. it's where she said her first word. (little girl) no! saw her first day of school. (little girl) bye bye! made a best friend forever. the back seat of my subaru is where she grew up. what? (announcer) designed for your most precious cargo. (girl) what? (announcer) the all-new subaru forester. (announcer) designed for your most precious c

the cia and fbi and nsa and all the other agencies. it took me about a year to complete a decent catalogue of the government entities and corporate entities that work in this world. >> narrator: they discovered they were the only people in the country collecting such detailed information. the only way they could verify any of it was to go there in person, hundreds of secret locations hiding in plain sight in office parks. >> priest: this is a gate to... to the nsa? >> lane: there's a government facility back in there. you'll see it better after we turn down this road. >> narrator: inside buildings like these, they launch drone strikes, gather and spread secret information, engage in cyber conflict. >> lane: you've got titan in here. csc is in one of these buildings. general dynamics. >> priest: so you really have the big mega-firms, the giants of this whole industry here: northrup grumman, boeing... >> lane: with a security station here at the front where they... they check out the cars and look underneath. >> priest: yeah, that... so

with meat is the technical director from the nsa. he worked with the nsa for almost 40 years, national security agency. we are also joined by an oscar nominated filmmaker, and jacob applebaum, computer security researcher. you two have something in common with each other. every time you come into the united states by plane, you are stopped, searched, you are interrogated. laura, tell us about your experience, your latest one. >> i have been stopped at the border since 2006, since i started on these films, looking at the u.s. post 9/11. i have lost count how many times i have been detained at the border but i think around 40 times. --this particular trip, lately they have been sending someone from homeland security to question me in the departing city. i was questioned in london about what i was doing. i told them i was a journalist. my work is protected and was not going to discuss it. in this occasion, i landed in york airport. flying, they do passport control inspection at the gate, so they make everyone de-planing to show their pa

after 9/11, we now know the nsa nsa -- is how people have described it. that is to say the nsa for a long time, its mandate was to survey a overseas communications, to look for you no information in foreign countries so that you know the nsa could another which listen to people in england having conversations with people in pakistan without a warrant. this has been the case for a long time but the nsa's first amendment as whistleblowers thomas drake has said was for the longtime that the agency never spied on americans without a warrant. that changed after 9/11. the gloves came off and suddenly the nsa was up vast quantities of our implement foreign communication, you know datamining and looking for operating a dragnet which included the private communications of americans, people in this country and doing so without specific warrants. so we learned that actually into ways. in 2005 as a result of a "new york times" story that broke that news to the public. "the new york times" by the way, "the new york times" said on that story for a full year. they knew,

we would be helpless if we did not work with dhs, cia, nsa, and the rest of the intelligence community. if there is one substantial change that has made the biggest difference, i would say breaking down the traditional walls between the intelligence community and the domestic law enforcement community because information flows very easily over borders now, and you cannot just see one piece of the puzzle without getting the other piece. it has made a tremendous difference and given rise to the approach from all of us that says we want to work together in a task force context. >> for our radio listeners, you are listening to the commonwealth club of california radio program. our guest today is fbi director robert muller discussing security threats concerning the united states. we would like to ask you a little bit about the national security implications of our energy policy, an issue of much concern in the news and certainly here in silicon valley. what might you say about the relationship between energy policy and some of the national security challenges that the fbi is addressing? >>

we do not know how much money we spend on the nsa. there are about 30,000 employees.is larger than the cia. there's a huge rock receive, actually -- huge bureaucracy, actually. in the years since 9/11, we have learned a substantial amount about what the nsa has been doing, only because the people who have blown the whistle on some of the abuses. brief give you a very chronology of what has happened since 9/11. after 9/11, we now know the nsa took the gloves off, it's how people have described it. nsa, for asay, the long time its mandate was to surveil overseas communications, to look for information in foreign countries. the nsa could this and to people in england having conversations with people in pakistan, or in sweden without warrants. this has been the case for a long time. has saidirst amendment' that the agency has never spied on americans without a warrant. that change with 9/11. the gloves came off and the nsc -- the nsa has been sucking up quantities of our resources ofinclude the communications people in this country without specific warrant. inlearned that

so joining us now is general michael hayden, the former director of the cia and the nsa.currently a principle with the chertoff group, a global consulting firm. yesterday we heard president obama defend the fbi's investigation into tamerlan tsarnaev in 2011. he said it is not as if the fbi did nothing. how do you respond to that? >> i think the president tried. now look, zoraida, we may find some things that could have been done better, should have been done better. but on the face of it, i'm not prepared to conclude right now that anyone did anything wrong. look. these are very difficult problems, and something i said more than ten years ago, even if our security services, and intelligence services are at the top of their game, that doesn't mean that bad things won't happen. this is a very hard problem for us. >> i suppose there's an issue of between whether something was done wrong, or whether more could have been done. senator lindsey graham, who has been extremely vocal about this, tweeted out yesterday after the president's speech, he said if boston is not an example

right now we have the utah nsa billing in progress. of computer monitors alone.now what protections the american citizen has against domestic surveillance on them by a the nsa computer in utah. guest: he highlights an important point. especially as technology changes the problem of not being able to change -- to gauge the scope of surveillance -- some of that is a function of national security powers. related surveillance powers are covert design. it is a catch-22. there was a recent supreme court case that was an attempt to challenge the large scale wiretapping by the nsa. journalists and activists who had regular communication with sources or clients overseas said abilityaffecting their to communicate with their sources and they believe it violates the fourth amendment. yousupreme court said cannot prove you have been wiretapped yet. the problem is under the law they do not have to tell anyone they have been wiretapped. there may be good reasons for that but it does create a situation where affectively that type of surveillance is effectively immunized from com

who leaked to a sun reporter that you had bloated budgets in the nsa. we're talking about aggressive treatment towards whistle blowers, you're not just seeing it on ben, you're seeing it elsewhere, as well. we now know that. but at this point, you don't have people in jail, you don't have anyone being held accountable and this does seem absurd. the group that the cia requested selling the attack has paid security in ben. it is fair to have deep frustration that it seems no one may ever be held accountable. >> well, you know, erin, yes, there are some questions and the investigation is not deplete. complete. but is there anything that doesn't give lindsey graham the vapors at this point. it doesn't matter if it's ben, the boston bombing libya. it's always the president's false. he's always done something wrong. do you know how many of these happened on george bush's watch? the fact is there was confusion that night. and there was an investigation that was on going. and i just don't think this is -- everything is water gate with them. >> the problem is th

both options are very undesirable nsa failed to consider a fair plan that some ibook does. >> host: what is the third way? >> guest: the ways to change our policy relating to the irg c., which is one of indulgence and passivity. we've allowed to sponsor the killing of americansldiers, rines from lebanon, airmen in saudi arabia, soldiers in iraq and the nato soldiers in afghanistan. we've allowed the irgc to work with hezbollah and other in iraq two armed men to kill for that purpose and that is illegal in today. reset or shut up to the irgc a long time ago. but we did stand. but we did stand up and made a big difference to israel to negotiate effectively as a result. so we should stand up, defend ourselves from the irgc sponsored attacks and then through that show of strength, and make serious negotiation possible. >> host: year of experience negotiating directly with ukrainians correct? in my capacity? >> guest: as legal advisor to the state department under george shultz and jim baker and i connected the negotiations with iran. there were negotiations over claims, the claims included a

the development of an intelligence capacity, breaking down of the walls between ourselves and cia, nsa, and the intelligence community, but i think always in the back of our mind, everyone at the bureau knew we could not let this happen again. on that day, i felt like that high school student who got the wrong assignment when the president asked that question, but it has been in the back of my mind since then. each president, for most on their mind is protecting the american public from another attack. >> we have a number of questions that deal with mission areas you did not mention specifically, given the importance of cyber security and espionage and counterterrorism. i wonder if you could say a little bit about two things, one being your sense of where the country is in respect to drug policy. the fbi is involved with drug policy along with other law- enforcement agencies, but more generally, how you approach the challenge of managing this broad range of responsibilities that the fbi has to continue to attend to, while at the same time prioritizing the missions you mentioned. >> act

a friend of mine is a headhunter for the nsa.y're looking for analysts versed in cyber warfare. really? that sounds exciting. oh, it is. yeah, the job is totally cutting edge. yeah, it sounds like it. are you sure you're gonna want to make the commute to fort mead every day? uh--ahem-- actually, it's a-- it's an overseas position. where overseas? i can't say. it's classified. are we breaking up right now? uh, no. no. uh--uh--they haven't hired me yet. it--it's my final interview. final? how long have you known about this? uh...a few weeks. i didn't want to say anything to you until it was real. ok. ok. and... and this is what you want? i'm not sure. i mean, the long-distance thing would be rough. yeah, it would be, considering you can't even tell me where you're going. well, i--i could if you applied with me. i mean, they need other people. leave the b.a.u.? just think about it? um... my head hurts, and jj just brought in a case. i need to get back to work. oh. [typing] an unsub that kills with his car. i haven't seen that before

only one telecom company stood up to the widely nsa program. the phone companies are in on this.o cooperate with the government. there's a sense, i feel like of chickens coming home to roost. we see gullibility whether any of this threatens. we see julian assange being portrayed. or whether guantanamo lawyers pose a threat to national security. >> i want to put up on the screen, there's an interesting episode that played out in the middle of the week. it's a group called message matters. this is affiliated with media matters who i have heard of. they released in the middle of the week basically talking points. they were talking points for democrats for people on the left to go on the air and defend the idea of going after the ap, the doj going after the ap. you can see some of the talking points up on the screens. if you go on tv this is what you should say. what was interesting to me, there was a good point. this caused a lot of media outrage how can the left be ignoring civil liberty concerns. but the point was made nobody wanted the talking points. did you actually -- i didn't

the cia and nsa collected overseas under looser authorities because they're not affecting united states citizens. we have the responsibility of doing the intelligence gathering in the united states, understanding is american citizens we are attempting to protect. we have to do it under the constitution and applicable statutes. the sharing of that information and working together has gone light years since september 11. having been through a number of battles over the years, the focus on the mission trump's just about everything else. what is difficult is coming up with an organizational structure to address cyber in all of its manifestations. fraud schemes are now on the internet. the dissemination of child pornography and the like have integrated to the internet and the field of cyber. cyber intrusion, the exploitation of information is in the cyber arena. how we address that is going to be a huge challenge in the years to come. " we are about to run out of time. i am going to ask you three brief questions. you can address any piece of this that you like. you have such a serious job. w

based on the contracts that buyers sign, farmers can not use the seeds of seeds without compensating mo nsa. making it clear. this win is for this case only. moving from soybeans to corn on how much corn has actually been pleasanted so far. projected the biggest corn crop whatever. only 12% of it has gone into the ground. morgan stanley is projecting today's report will show a jump to 30% of corn being planted. with lots of dry weather predicted for this week, that is good as farmers will try to catch up. >> that is one instance where it is fair to blame the weather. coming up next, the cell phone and suit edition of street talk. >> and the big data point that makes it look like all of the fear and loathing may have just been overdone. we will bring it to you, coming up. everyone's retirement dream is different; how we get there is not. we're americans. we work. we plan. ameriprise advisors can help you like they've helped millions of others. to help you retire your way, with confidence. ♪ that's what ameriprise financial does. that's what they can do with you. let's get to work. ameriprise

. >> welcome back to power lunch, take a look at shares of mo nsa nto selling off today.etically modified wheat found its way into a wheat in oregon. shares on thursday as its ten-day moving average below its 30 day average. i have spoken several analysts. it may not change long term analysts. >> thank you very much for that. allowing mobile companies to sell mobile phones in homes of empowering them to speak out against their governments. starting what i guess you would call a twitter revolution. this new announcement means that companies can sell a host of communications products to citizens without first getting special permission from the u.s. government. laptops, tablets, disk drives, and data storage. encryption software. the most important impact comes in the form of software downloads. they were using older slower versions of products. senior u.s. official told reporter that the general license will empower at a time when the government is intensifying the efforts to stifle access to one another. >> united against nuclear iran. >> the regime controls all of the te

nsa leaks. black panther, department of energy solyndra, department of agriculture and c.i.a. secret service, it's an alphabet soup! it's been that way for years. >> bob: you had two commissioners that told congress they didn't know about this and they lied. is that what you are saying? >> andrea: we know that lois lerner knew. it's always a lower level aide,y connection, the salaries for the lower level aides they are completely disconnected. problem is political protectionism. they have been protected by the press and also by their allies. from ever having to deal with certain problems. now, do you remember jobs saved or created. that was ton of baloney to talk about the economy but the press bought it. you get to the point where you will say virtually everything even if it is ridiculous. i would think that the overall the leaders of the democratic party are very worried right now. because one of the things they were able to do, we can deal with national security in the way that america wants and will be competent managers and governors. that has proven to be false. >> bob:

. >> bret: well, a lot of things happen at the nsa that are not talked about and red team, blue teamn there. >> going on because it obviously isn't extremely effective given the extent of the chinese attacks on us. >> bret: juan? >> i think the administration has taken a much sharper tone with the chinese in recent months. now, tom donilon, the national security advisor has been over there and he spoke about the urgency and scope of the problem. the pentagon has directly said that the chinese government is responsible for this that they had in the past have said well, chinese companies but the defense-out pentagon, the defense department has now said those are agencies of the chinese military that are in fact conducting these kinds of attacks then you have had recent months attacks on the "new york times." the "wall street journal." again, directly tied to the chinese. president obama is supposed to meet next week chinese president ping. and when we heard today at the white house from jay carney is he plans to make this a priority in terms of their talks. >> bret: but, you know, jona

years, and i know it's a challenge for you, it's a challenge for the caa, it's a challenge for the nsa everything. in homeland security. but the more you can work and share the safer we're going to be, aren't we? >> absolute. and i will tell you and everyone of these incidents we go back and look and see what could we have done better? this particular incident handling the text notice is in everywhere going to do better on the next time. >> let me get into another area since this is in the boston area but it is improvised explosive devices which we all see so much because of our troops and so forth. but they have come to america. the boston bombing highlighted what our troops have been encountering for years overseas. the devastation caused by improvised explosive devices, or ieds. the threat from ieds here, director mueller, you've talked about this before, is widely recognized. in february the white house released a report on the threat and established a new task force. inspite of the spotlight the administration placed on understanding and countering ieds, we know it's very complica

. >> bill: do you have any sympathy at all for the cia, the nsa, all of our other intel agencies thatbasically are trying to plug leaks? they don't want, you know, secret stuff that could get their agents killed and u.s. military killed out in the press? do you sympathize at all with that? >> i sympathize with the need to go after the leakers, to go after members of the administration who are leaking but you don't go after the press because that's when you sometime me the freedom of the press. >> can i say something about that bill? >> bill: what about social media like wikileaks and people like that who don't get national security stuff and throw it on out there and our people could get killed, powers? >> where do they get the information? >> bill: take that seriously. it's a question of whether you think wikileaks should be treated as a journalist and i think. >> bill: social media thing. >> yeah, i think they should be. i just want to address this argument though that the administration they -- holder made this argument about the a.p. why they went after the a.p. because there was

bush with the nsa wiretapping story, every president exerts i'm doing this to keep you safe. a lot of people in the public, they say that's enough. and they believe it. but the truth of the matter is that it's not enough of an answer in and of itself. that's why there is congressional oversight of the executive branch. it's not enough just to say we're doing it to keep you safe, because the moment the american people seed that territory, then presidents can do whatever they want. >> and when you look at the specifics of this case with the associated press, you have a subpoena that was broadly drawn. >> very broad. >> that was done in secret. that they only discovered after the fact about a story that was a successful attempt to thwart terrorism that eventually the administration revealed itself. so there are questions regarding this particular case that are different from sort of the overarching theme. >> the attorney general, eric holder, says this might be the one or two or three most severe damaging impacts on national security. >> and the associated press held the story.

. >> 9/11, i was in my office at nsa. >> i was at the executive office building for the white house.tagon when it got hit. >> the first breaking news was coming in. >> somebody has it on real player at their desk. >> the report was saying a small aircraft had reportedly hit. >> right then the second plane into the second tower and i knew. >> there was no doubt in that office in that moment that this is what we were waiting for. this is it. those are the words that went through everybody's mind. this is it. this is bin laden. >> it's an attack, it's terrorism and it's al qaeda. >> i knew who they were. i knew what their intentions were. >> this is it. they pulled this thing off. we're going to battle stations. >> and we were all evacuated after that second plane went in because we thought the next one, that is the shanksville plane, might be heading for us. it was complete chaos. >> plane flew in under my office, my two assistants looked out the window and saw a 757 fly in under their feet. >> the order then went out for the building to be evacuated. except for the counterterrorism an

who basically identified some real concerns with how surveillance might have been outsourced from the nsa those items. he was ultimately proven to be in the right. as you document, the system that he criticized was discontinued. he was investigate in the 2006, he was charged by eric holder's justice department under the espionage act. they had to back down from that. a judge said that prosecution didn't pass the smell test. and they ended with a plea deal widely criticized where he went from facing 30 plus years to espionage to a plea deal with the government saying he had misused a computer from the government. nothing more. he now works at an apple store. why was it important for you in this film to tell his story. and why should they apply not to traders but to whistle blowers working with journalists. >> we've been trying to get a statement or a comment from eric holder or anybody in the department. maybe you will be able to get one. we haven't been able to. to see exactly some of these fundamental questions. why were these patriots, these are real patriots. they're doing there becaus

services committee headquartered in delaware and also through the national guard service adjuncts to the nsa. i think this sort of function and this particular legislative authorization would be helpful to doj and the fbi as well because it can help the map more capable better prepared state and local partners. i certainly welcome recommendations or comments from you or from the other witnesses on the next panel. we will be holding a law enforcement caucus in june and i'm grateful to senator whitehouse for the chance to contribute to this hearing this morning. thank you. >> thank you senator coons. we in rhode island also have a cyberweighing in the rhode island guard and i look forward to working with you on your legislation. i think it's a very valuable thought. it is important for the record in this proceeding to reflect that when you move from our local guard and reserve capabilities to our military and from there to our active-duty military and from there to our intelligence services. there are increasing restrictions and concerns about taking action within the continental united states

special operations command, i have every agency from the cia, fbi, nsa, defense intelligence agency - are three letters, i have a person there. they have had a reciprocal agreement with us. i have somebody in my headquarters at tampa. you have to be able to translate the language of a particular culture within the agency. you have to be able to have those liaison be representative of you and of the head of those organizations. when i have read issue, i am able to reach over to my liaison officer and they can help work out problems that might have occurred as a result of something we are trying to do around the world. that is incredibly important to us. that network is vital to your success. but we also have liaison officers with industry, academia, colonel davidson was mentioned earlier. he is here at the wilson center. we put some of our brightest epidemic -- academic institutions so we know what the best and brightest are thinking about. we recognize not all the best ideas about the military come from within the military. we are trying to see what it undermines think about what you'

a number of times larger than the cia, whistleblowers like william benny and others who joined the nsa, the national security agency, because they were deeply concerned about national security and wanted to serve their country and then started to speak out about what it was doing. after they tried the channels within the agency, deeply concerned about, for example, surveillance of americans. they were finding that programs were being developed not to improve national security, but to actually data mine americans. and as they spoke out, one by one they faced prosecution or persecution in the case of william benny, the authorities raided his house, had him at gun point in his shower. he was a diabetic amputee, his family terrified. and in the case of others, they are charged, like thomas drake. and under the obama administration, there have been more whistleblowers, um, charged than in all past presidential administrations combined. it's a very serious issue which then brings us to the case of bradley manning. this young soldier who went to iraq and has now pled guilty to, um, having rel

so we always sort of wonder where that overlap is between how much of the nsa's budget is from the nationalnce program, how much comes from the military. then there is a specific budget on each of those agencies. how big is the cia's budget? i do not know the answers, and they're not going to release those numbers. host: the president has called for more transparency on the use of drones, and when it comes to the line items on all of this, is there transparency in this administration or are they pretty tight lipped? guest: pretty tight lipped. purchasing the drug, you can get the numbers for those. that not usually too secretive. -- purchasing the drones, you can get the numbers of those. the cia is buying some of those, and that is not transparent. the president talked about moving some of the drone program, which has been moved mostly to caa, more into the military, and i will probably add some transparency to it because the military budget is a bit more public, so if there is a transfer to the pentagon, sort of away from me ci -- away from the cia, we will probably get more insight. host

agencies like he cia and nsa actually communicate with stake local, and lawe, enforcement, they all communicate with each other. counterintelligence blending with law enforcement, know they're two big different i know. but my question is, why couldn't it was very interesting what you had to say about our liberties and everything else and just weighing the balance. mi-5 eat britain, we have which is conducting domestic spying since pre-world war ii era. and the britains haven't given p their civil liberties or their freedoms. isn't it -- is it possible that e could develop some type of thing through fusion centers where we could have a robust counterintelligence within the united states? >> robber, thank you for the call. get a response. philip mudd? >> i faced this problem for example the classic question of we don't have a domestic intelligence service for the united states. i don't think it's a good idea. i don't think it's a bad idea. it's not necessary. centers in this country. 70 plus police departments in regions like california that are centers to her in say what's our collective view of

it is that 90%, there's a myth that the nsa and others are monitoring the private network, they're notuld be. i mean, if you have these private defense contractors and their security is not good and they're getting access to all of this sensitive material and chinese hackers are stealing it from one of the big defense contractors, that's a major problem. >> it is a huge problem. we think we have a separate answer by allowing the government to share malicious source code with the private sector and private sector to share back, that should happen. >> why hasn't it happened? >> it passed the house, i think we will get a bill this year, bipartisan bill sponsored by myself and ranking member that will pass in some form this year. i think that will happen. but remember, you don't want your government monitoring the 90% of the private sector networks. i think this is a uniquely american problem, but we have to have a uniquely american solution. i think we have that, and part of that is making all of the supply chain, everybody that makes the screws for a particular weapons system, to putting