nsa wasconsequence for -- the big consequence for nsa was, in a short term it grew very radical and studentsallied around it. but, they cannot do any international work. they were absolutely suspect. that was true decades later. do not believe that they do international work. if they do, it is very limited. weight -- wait. the title the book your -- title of the book you're doing? karen: yes, and almost at me the whole 15 years to get the title. i was searching for something that would capture the theme of idealism and duplicity. much know that these two terms, patriotic and betrayal, ntion. tension -- inte where you come out as a reader is up to the reader where you fall in that tension. an objection by some of the waiting participants to the book, it is the title because they do not feel the betrayal is warranted. again, that is the distinction between the aspirations, intentions, altruism and commitment to fighting communism and judging the consequences. i do not see any way around. either whether it is a dictionary definition or because it involves things in the book. you cannot have a s