but seriously having had the ntsb experience we have made great strides. we used to have two standards. we did for the regionals and the air carriers. but we do not any more. we're all together in the 121 category. but the fact is some of the largest airlines have larger safety programs and have higher standards than even the minimum of 121. why no that is something you want to look at 23 have the right minimum standard or should we start stepping up to be more in line with some of the larger air carriers? the troubling thing of course, his four of the last five accidents and we have had in our country have been regional jets. maybe they have not been all jets and guess i assume regional carriers. i think pilot issues have been a part of that. what i want to hear and ask you to particularly the gatt is obviously pilot history, calculations, a cockpit oversight, trading, but also maintenance trading. that is not in most of these accidents but we do need to look just because we are beginning to see that may be made in its trading and oversight these to come

we respect what the ntsb has to say. with those tools together, yes, sir. >> generally i would agree. the programs that faa has in place properly implemented would allow it to exercise proper safety oversight. it is always a question of execution and implementation verses the plan itself. >> the faa is doing as good a job as it can possibly do. i believe these are well intentioned people. these people care about safety as much as any of us here to. but they have a lot to do. they have the objective and the mission of making sure that our aviation system is as safe as it possibly can be. and with that it will take over sites. it will take new 21st century equipment, and that comes with money. and i'm not here to lobby on behalf of my colleagues. i could use a little money for my organization at the same time. >> the answer is simply a little bit helps. >> a lot would help these people. >> and last question. >> in spite of what was indicated at the the faa could do much more with a little bit of help. >> i thank you very m

last month, ntsb held a preliminary hearing into the cause of the cold in the accident in which some evidence suggests a pilot training in fatigue may have contributed to the crash. as a result mr. chairman, you along with chairman committee rockefeller, committee ranking member hutchinson and said committee member demint requested our office began an extensive investigation into some of the issues brought to light during the hearing. we have already begun work on this review. today, i will first address to a major weakness is related to faa oversight of the aviation industry and then move onto operational differences between main line and regional carriers. first, the subcommittee hearing in april 2008 how late it weaknesses and faa risk-based or sipe system and air carrier compliance. wahler were identified save the lapse in southwest airlines' compliance, many stakeholders were concerned that they could be symptomatic of much deeper problems with faa's air carrier oversight on a systemwide level. for example in 2002, we reported faa needed to develop national oversight process is

but, seriously, having had the ntsb experience, we have made some great strides. as you know we still have two standards. for the regionals and the air carriers. but we don't anymore. we are now all together in the 121 category. but the fact is that some of the largest airlines have larger, also a safety programs and they have higher standards than even the minimum in 121. i know that is something you are going want to get, it is do we have the right minimum standard, or should we start stepping it up to be more in line with some of the larger air carriers? the troubling thing of course is that, four of the last five accidents that we have had in our country have been regional jets, and clearly, we have-- or maybe they have not all been jets but i assume they were. anyway, the regional. carriers. and they think pilot issues have been a part of that. so, what i am going to want to hear and ask you to particularly look at is the obviously the pilot history, krueger's cut calculations, coppitt oversight, training paramount but also maintenance training. that is not p

number 3, ntsb recommendations, while we willing to accept and 85% implementation rate of ntsb recommendations by the fda when 100% would save lives? would i be sitting here talking to you today had previous recommendations for training and cold weather flight management been acted on? these recommendations must be taken seriously. acted on jointly by the faa and the ntsb. we must learn from accidents so we can prevent future occurrences. my wife, terry, my son, christopher, and lauren's boyfriend, kevin, miss loren every minute of every day. i will not have the opportunity to walk my daughter down the aisle and give her away in marriage. she will not experience the joy of a growing child within and raising a loving family as we did. our traditional christmas eve visit to new york city for some last-minute shopping and taking in mass at st. patrick's cathedral will probably come to an end this year, it will be too painful to make that trip without lauren. many of my fave -- fellow crash victims' families sitting behind me have similar stories and similar losses. so now it is up for you to make

ntsb does a great job and it is a great honor the help us. we heard the statistic that the f.a.a.adapts somewhere in the range 82-85, that's where the former chairman said we have an obligation to report everything. >> that's where i wanted to make sure we were clear. that other 18-50% is to make sure what happened and for the ntsb to know why it didn't implement those and that's one of the reasons and where do you go from there? that is the point i tried to say. perhaps i didn't make it clear. >> i saw the recoil ochre and want to make sure we are clear but i want to make sure that your policy that you are going to implement and now look at the you are going to implement is the percentage that is not taken into a full recommendation. you are going to respond in some way that the ntsb can see and the public can see why. >> yes, sir. >> that would also draw potential pathway, maybe or maybe not depends what happens. >> yes, sir. >> i'm struggling and the chairman said it again about the salary levels. i just struggle with this because i know in our state, we pass and i don't want t

the ntsb has issued numerous recommendations to the faa on stall training, pie lit records, a remedial training, situational awareness, pilots monitoring skills, low airs ditto alert systems, a pilot professionalism and fatigue as well as aircraft icing. two of the series, aircraft icing in human fatigue are on the boards most >> while there are currently more than 450 open recommendations to the faa, on january 12 of this year, the faa took action on some of those recommendations when it published a notice of proposed rulemaking. >> race in numerous safety recommendations, the issue that we issued to the faa. in 1995 the ntsb issued recommendations for the faa to require an airline to evaluate an applicant pilots experience, skills and ability before hiring the individual. the following year congress enacted islet records improvement act. that came in 1996 and required any company hiring a pilot for air transportation, request and receive records from any organization that it previously employed the pilot in the previous five years. however, it does not require an airline to update fa

the ntsb says it doesn't and we should make it accessible to the airlines.aptain, as you know, had failed -- or had flight crew disapprovals of the private pilot check right i assume it is. the commercial multiengine, atb sub 340 and the first officer flight instruction -- those must be the five failures but the point is that commuter airline that hired this captain did not know this information. they have indicated to us they did not -- they were not aware of this. the other question is, mr. rosenker, you've stressed several times today that the investigation is not complete. i understand that. but having read a lot of what the ntsb has done and learned, it's pretty impressive to me what is there that you have to yet have to learn. at this stage of the investigation, it appears to me you're well down the road. so what -- what remains that you expect to learn? >> senator, mr. chairman, we actually only yesterday, would get in the simulator, to fly those same patterns, those same actions to understand more about the human performance factor and the aircraft p

we're looking for door with this committee, the faa, ntsb, as cooperative. -- we are looking forward to working with this committee, the faa, ntsb and will be very cooperative. >> chairman dorgan, i am roger cohen, and i'm president of the regional airline association. i want to express our deepest sympathies for the lives of the passengers and crew of flight 3407 that were lost and for the families affected by the crash. we deeply share in their grief. i also want to express today not only for our member airlines but for our 60,000 highly trained professionals are total unwavering commitment to safety. -- our total unwavering commitment to safety. let's make sure this post accident process does not have to be repeated. we will take whatever steps are necessary so that our flight crews and aircraft are safe as humanly possible. the safety of our nation skies is a shared responsibility. at monday's faa summit, five of our regional airline ceos joined with federal agencies, major airlines, and union representatives to candidly explore all of the issues making headlines over these past

at the begun of rulemaking on that, which the ntsb suggests? there is no excuse in my judgment for the faa to wait another month to begin of rulemaking to make certain that all the records of a pilot are available immediately and now to a potential employer of that pilot. that ought to happen now, and i will ask you the next time you are here whether the rule making has started. i hope he will consider that a priority. >> if you don't invite me back for at least a week the answer will be yes. >> did you very much. let me thank the four of you for appearing. we will have a discussion with the airlines and some other witnesses in addition to the airlines. this is, as i said in a serious subject. in many ways as is probably always the case these subjects are most aggressively and often discussed when they are born of tragedy. our heart goes out to those who are involved in the tragedy and those who love them and, we just hope that through these discussions we will make progress in protecting others. and i want to end it the way i started this, to

enacted on jointly by the faa and the ntsb. we must learn from accident so we can prevent future or current. my wife, terri, my son christopher, and lord boyfriend kevin miss her every minute of every day. i will not have the opportunity to walk my daughter down the aisle and give her away in marriage. she will not experience the joy of a growing child within and raising a loving family as we did. our traditional christmas eve visit to new york city for some last minute shopping and taking in mass at saint patrick's cathedral will probably come to an end this year. it will be too painful to make that trip without lauren. many of my fellow crash victim families sitting behind me also have similar stories and similar losses were so now it's up to you to make a difference. everyone in this room today, and those who were here last wednesday, expressed that they have come before you to make the necessary changes in safety. winter is coming. if we do not implement critical safety changes before then, and another accident occurs, we c

we're looking for to working with this committee, the faa, the ig, the ntsb as cooperative in a fashion as possible. thank you mr. chairman, i'd be pleased to answer questions. >> mr. may, thank you. next we will hear from mr. cohen, you may proceed. >> thank you. chairman dorgan, senator demint and members of the subcommittee, i emma roger cohen, president of the regional airline association. i want to express our deepest sympathies for the lives of the passengers and crew of flight 3407 that were lost and for the families affected by the crash. we deeply share in their grief. and i also want to express today not only for our member airlines but for a 60,000 highly trained professionals, our total unwavering commitment to safety. as we work toward insuring this -- let's make sure this post accident process does not have to be repeated. we will take whatever steps are necessary so that our flight crews and our aircraft are as safe as humanly possible. the safety of our nation's guys is a shared responsibility. at monday's faa the summit, five of regional airline ceo's and other senior e

we will know more about the answer to that as more disclosures come from the ntsb and so on. we learned some from last week's hearing and this week's hearing. we have decided to, in the name of those we love, find a way to make a difference and make sure that others do not experience the same thing. this hearing is adjourned. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2009] >> coming up next on "the communicator's," a discussion on president obama's choice to lead the fcc. later, supreme court justice anthony kennedy delivers the commencement address at stanford university. then, bill clinton and the steady hoyer honor retiring democratic leadership ceo al from. tomorrow on "washington journal." a look at iran and the health- care debate on capitol hill with tony blankley and jon- christopher bua. later, a look at the cover story, barack hoover obama, the best and brightest blow it again. this week on c-span's "newsmakers." pete stark, chairman of the house at ways subcommittee on health discusses legislation wor

but having read a lot what the ntsb has done it is impressive to me. what is there you yet have to learn? at this stage of the investigation it appears you are well down the road, so what remains do you expect to learn? >> senator, mr. chairman, we only yesterday the day before yesterday were getting into a simulator we could fly the same parameters, the same patterns, the same actions to understand more about the human performance factor and aircraft performance factor and there is analysis going on at this moment. we literally sent a crew to that simulator to enable us to understand more of what happened in the cockpit so there's a good deal of analysis that must be done if we are going to cross every t and got everybody and that is what we do in our investigations. >> why are you only able to get into a simulator in june? >> we just finished a public hearing on this and we go through a process that of an investigation. so, in this particular time it is when we could put everything we learned from our public hearing into what we needed to do and test

there was actually a proposal made by ntsb back in about 1994 when this whole debate came to pass and when 121 was created putting the regionals under 121 to have the mainline carriers be the enforcement of 121 for the regional partners. that was specifically rejected by congress and the faa because they wanted to have a single level of enforcement as well as a single level of achievement. and i think that decision was the correct one. at the time and i think it remains correct that the faa needs to be the principal enforcer. we have openly said here today and will continue to say if we need to change those standards, and upgrade them, then that is something that we are to look at doing. by the same token, i think the enforcement needs to rest with the faa. >> well, you know, i was just in another committee earlier this morning and described federal agency that was willfully blinded cheerfully ignorant for about 10 years. and i don't describe that to the faa except to say that i had a belly full of enforcement requirements by certain agencies that have completely neglected the opportu

the ntsb i know is doing substantial investigations.but the larger question for me here is, what about the airlines and the faa's ability to prevent a double standard or two different standards of experience in the cockpit? what about the enforcement of rules with respect to÷mb familiarity with certain kinds of conditions, familiarity with certain equipment. we are supposed to have dating back to the mid-1990s one level of safety, quote-unquote, for both regional and major carriers. and i want to hear from our witnesses today whether you think that is actually the case, whether the system has kept up with changes or whether there have been changes that have occurred that have drifted us away from one standard. i'm particularly concerned from some of the things i've learned in the last hearing, for example, that a carrier does not easily have full access to the records of pilots they are considering hiring. i'm talking about all the records. they have access to the records of everything that has occurred with respect to an airplane. an

there was actually a proposal made by ntsb back in about 1994 when this whole debate came to pass inthe 121 created put in the regionals under 121 to have the mainline carriers be the enforcement of 121 for their original partners. and that was specifically rejected by congress and in this faa because they wanted to have a single level of enforcement as well as a single level of achievement and i think that the decision was of a correct one and at the time and i think it remains correct that the faa is to be the principal enforcer. we have openly said here today and will continue to say, if we need to change to those standards and upgrade them then that is something that we ought to look at doing. by the same

it is actually depressing and sad that there is no highway for the ntsb or the department of transportation or anybody else like to make recommendations, but they have no enforcement authority. i did not know that until this happened. of philosophies about the federal government, but it seems to me that where you have a heavy train being hit by -- vice versa, a light train being hit by a heavy train and something went wrong and yes, we know, we'll speculate and it'll all come come out in the end and in the meantime, the only thing that really counts is the, you know, all those families of the dead and sometimes the families of the injured suffer@@@@@@ hello? >> sorry, the train was a little late getting here. >> thank you, mr. chairman. among chairman, he is the chairman. thank you all for being here. nd my apologies for a couple of minutes off target. the -- what we'll try to do in order to expedite things is to -- we'll limit opening statements to the three of us, make them short and we'll ask the other members who may come to include their opening statement in the record or in their ques

we've been in constant touch with member hersman with the ntsb and i'm happy to talk more about that q & a. in the 15 week since this hallmark legislation was enacted we've been working very hard. today i'll share with the committee some of our accomplishments on how transit has helped local communities large and small. the recovery act made available for public transportation $8.4 billion and we view that as an extraordinary opportunity. unlike some of our partners who get one or two large formula or discretionary programs fta is standing up six separate programs, three formula programs, three discretionary programs and one that's brand new that was effectively authorized in the recovery act itself. these six programs together will serve no fewer than 695 grantees with the potential of over 1300 separate recovery act grants. these grantees, true of the entire transit industry, exhibit drastically different levels of financial strength, technological sophistication and staffing capacity. they range from the largest rail systems that serve more passengers annually than amtrak to the s

it will more about that answer it as more disclosure come from the ntsb and so on and we're learninge from last week's hearing in this week's hearing ever that we are indebted to the witnesses. it mr. maurer, we are indebted to you and the families who decided to in the name of those you love to find a way to make a difference and make certain that others did not experience the same fate so we appreciate all four of you being here. this hearing is adjourned. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] some of the debate on the bill included comments from senators barbara boxer and john mccain. this is about 10 minutes. >> a message to the people of pakistan and that the united states has made a long-term commitment to stand by their side in the region and at home as they battle domestic insurgency and extremists. however, the conference report also contains millions of dollars in unrequested spending that is largely unjustified and certainly non-emergency. president obama's message to congress was two keep funding focus on t

meeting at which everything is shared, again, to protect these issues, with the faa, with members of the ntsb that are there, and it is not a public meeting, so that they can share those experiences. so you are exactly correct. that it is not on the public website. they meet for 10 hours a day in a windowless room. we would urge you when they meet here the next time, i would urge members of this committee -- you are invited and we would love to have you there. >> we do share the outcome of last conference meetings with the committee? if it needs to be confidential, i am happy to oblige. let me go to another issue regarding the pay rate. it surprised me that you did not know the beginning salary or a range. as the association ever done a salary study? i am guessing that must have had some analysis in the many years you have been there. can you provide that to the committee? >> we will provide you with a member -- information of our member carriers, what is publicly available. we will get that to you. >> we can keep things proprietary information, so i would like you to stretch further, if you

metro rail system and is actively depressing, senator warner, sad that there is no current way for the ntsb or the department of transportation or anybody else that can make recommendations but they have no enforcement of 40. i did not know that until this happened. and people can have a variety of philosophies about the federal government. but it seems to me that where you have a heavy train being hit by vice versa light stream being hit by a heavy train and something went wrong and yes we know we will speculate and it will all come out in the and and in the meantime the only thing that counts is all those families of the dead and sometimes the families of the injured suffered longer. but there is no authority, they have got to run a safe train. there are recommendations but no authority. the chairman has arrived. >> sorry, the train was a little late getting here. thank you, mr. chairman. among chairmen here, he's the chairman. thank you for being here, and my apologies for a couple minutes of target. what we will try to do in order to expedite things is we will limit opening statements t

we have been in constant touch with members men, the ntsb and i'm happy to talk more about that in q&a and i have also been notified that ms. norton maybe calling ect hearing and we are happy to participate in that as well. on the recovery act mr. chairman, in the 16 weeks since this hallmarked legislation was enacted, the fda has been working very hard to deliver funding to support the economic recovery and today want to share with the committee some of our accomplishments

one of the issues that came out of the ntsb investigation is the issue of pilot fatigue. the faa has long held that it is the responsibility of both the operators and flight crew member to prevent fatigue not only by following regulations but also acting intelligently and continuously while serving the traveling public. tampa, florida. john on the independent mind. caller: of one to make it, that everybody has the absolute right to choose the airline they fly on but a lot of people will buy a ticket on continental and delta and all of a sudden you are flying regional jets. host: and that his, you don't have a choice. what a cut you just have to look at what the ticket says. if most -- caller: you just have to look at what your ticket st. regis says. host: but if there is no other way to get to some parts of the country other than using the regional carriers. caller: that is true, as some places you don't have a choice, but in a lot of flying the last couple of years, the mainline route has been replaced with a smaller, regional jets going from houston to york -- newark, u

just as the ntsb leaves rule making to the f.d.a., the systemic risk council would leave most of the day to day rule making with the financial regulatory agency. but the systemic risk council -- and i understand criticisms of the council's approach today. we don't want to be debating at a moment of crisis. that is why it needs independent staff and resources. it would have the authority to review every bit of information that the individual day-to-day financial regulatory agencies possess, to require those agencies to collect information from the institutions they regulate. it would also have an independent staff capable of analyzing this data, understanding how the pieces of the regulatory system work together, and then at that staff level feed that information up to the council so we could identify weaknesses or caps within our system or potential systemic that might be arising outside the purview of the individual financial regulatory agency. the council would also have the authority to require the federal regulators to develop clear written plans for dealing with potential financ

everything is shared again to protect -- to protect these issues with the faa, with members of the ntsb, that are there. and it is not a public meeting so that they can share those experiences. and so you are exactly correct, that was not on a public website. they meet for 10 hours a day, and in a windowless room, and we would urge you when the next time when a meteor, they meet regularly. i would urge members of this committee to come to -- you are invited. we would love to have either. >> would you share the outcome of your last conference meetings from that with the committee? it needs to be confidential or whatever the rules are i am happy to oblige. let me go to another russian that senator johanns asked and that is regarding the pay rate. i'm not going to -- it surprise me that you did not have the beginning salary or arrange. has the association ever done a salary study? i'm just guessing a much have had announced them, and if so can you provide to the committee? >> mr. chairman, senator, we will provide you the information of our member carriers, what is publicly available and w

meeting at which everything is sharon it again to protect these issues with the faa, with members of the ntsb that are there and is not a public meeting so that they can share those experiences. and so you're exactly correct, that was not on the public website. they meet for 10 hours a day in a windowless room and we would urge you when the next time when they meet here, they meet regularly. i would urge members of this committee to,, you are invited and would love to have read their. >> would you share the outcome of their last conference meetings from that with the committee? and these to be confidential or what ever the rules are i'm happy to oblige. let me go to another issue, the senator asked in regards to the pay rates. i am not going to debate to peer and a it surprised me you did not know the beginning salary or a range so you -- do you have a. has the association ever done and association salary analysis over the years you've been in existence and if so can you provide that to the committee? >> mr. chairman, senator, we'll provide do the information of our member carriers what is pu