sonali: joining us now is allspring's george bory and jpmorgan's oksana aronov. have this idea that it does not necessarily matter when that rate cut will be. do you believe that? oksana: the fed has kind of back themselves into a quarter where the how to deliver it some point, because i've been talking about it for so long to it really does not matter, because we are in the -- in a world where the yield curve is so deeply inverted. what is that going to do when the 10 is already in the low 4's ? furthermore, you have to study history. you see that, in the late 1980's, the second half of the 1980's, the fed did execute a couple cuts, then they kind of held off. you had elevated rates between 4.5% and 6% for a number of years. i do not think the fed cutting for the first time really is a long-term signal of anything. they are going to have to be data-dependent. they tried not to be at the end of last year, did not work out so far -- so well. they will tread carefully. sonali: where do you think the first cut will be and when do you think we can reasonably achieve i