olesya yakhno, a political scientist, candidate of sciences, and she has been following this russian madness for a long time. olesya, welcome , hello, hello, listen, well, it's some kind of gesture, you know, it's just some kind of thing-, yes, because the russians are already they don't even discuss how they will win on the battlefield, with all this army, with all these missiles, with all this. they are now discussing how to destroy the economy of ukraine, not even the economy at all. well, there is the life of the community of ukraine, once there, and with iranian drones, and secondly, what is the usa going to do? or somehow it will suddenly change the situation in the u.s. finally, they will be able to talk about the cessation of hostilities. what is this ? what are they counting on in reality? because there are several constant topics in russia, there is the topic of the united states, which performs the function of a supposedly bipolar world where the whole world is supposedly divided into the united states and the russian federation as two large entities , there is no europe, there is no china, and the united states wants to weaken or destroy the russian federation, that is, it is constantly present in order to show its own importance, in order to show that russia is a world power, that it is at the level of the united states in terms of resources and potential, and therefore this topic is constantly present, that now we will come to possible elections, which previous elections are also evidence that in russia they want to constantly show that this is allegedly a problem of certain elites, including the american elites who have now come to power and who again want to destroy the russian federation will come everything can change because in russia this, well, if this is the thesis that peoples or societies, well, in fact, of all countries, even in the west, and even as they tell it in ukraine, they all love russia very much , they want to be friends with russia, and it turns out that there are some bad authorities in some in certain countries that come and that start conducting some allegedly hostile and anti-russian policy. that is, this is a standard theme that is repeated . well, we have known for many years that it also does not go well in the daily routine even before the full-scale invasion and now after of a full-scale invasion, i really actively follow the information of all of these components of the russian federation and many of these personnel of the characters there personally saw how they behave, including those who were shown in the plot - in the plots it is late that i see now a trend that will be formed that the complete filling of the external agenda with information in russia will cease to work and arose at the request of the students anyway for internal problems in the course of the process inside russia itself, they are already and so russia is now playing up this propaganda trend, which is absolutely hopeless, because after the full-scale invasion of the war that russia is waging, this trend cannot be translated, well, for russia, into some kind of political or geopolitical external result. therefore, it all came down exclusively to the internal audience of the calculation, at least in 14 it wasn't like that year. well, let's say yes. and there in the world even partially accepted this russian approach about the fact that russia allegedly wants some kind of negotiations. russia is ready to make concessions, there is no such thing now, it is exclusively aimed at the domestic audience and it is a matter of time when this transition will take place from full support and an attempt in this way to block any discussion of internal problems when this transition will actually take place to internal issues, well, just of course there in 2050 is too long, but i read in one of the studies that in 2050 there will be a majority of the muslim population in russia, and at that time i am engaged in alleged protection, as they say there is the russian world. yes, there are russian-speakers all over the world, they are competing with some kind of russophobia at this time. no, the picture inside the country is changing. well, the picture itself is changing, yes, the nationalities of the peoples, but no one with this internal policy . that is why, in my opinion, the war, which is present everywhere in russia , does not go away, and in fact, nothing is discussed except for the war. and there are really openly hostile calls for joy that must be destroyed . to bomb ukraine, that is, people express admiration for how much was broken or destroyed, but the real picture will gradually differ, and i think that this is television virtuality and reality is even connected with mobilization, it will already dissonate in a certain way and gradually this regime no matter how tv and how this word will not be formed in relation to ukraine, i would not say that the deep-seated russian people who will even condemn the war will think about ukraine will think how bad it is that we are destroying ukraine. no, they will just start to think that it is possible that the war is, in principle, a war. no, it does not matter against whom, but if you wage this war, then you also have losses and they will be these losses, and i think that in this area, certain processes will begin that will reduce the very effectiveness of this propaganda. and the fact that the authorities have no other option but to play up this whole delusion is a well- known fact. well, what can they do? the same english coach tells 155 times if putin comes out and says in a speech that they are competing with statists in the west, well, that is, such a degree of rhetoric or if you listen to other officials there, what degree of rhetoric do they have and what kind of vocabulary does it say that there is little to mobilize, yes, even with calm words, some kind of no it is possible to mobilize russian viewers, which means that it is necessary to increase the level of crackling that they are doing, but it is not infinite, well, in general, you know, in all of their latest statements, when they say well and such and such and such more and more first of all, about the fact that there must be some prerequisites for an agreement. someone has to put pressure on someone. and if there, as i say, they are bombing, then someone somewhere will surrender. well, really, it is because they can not reach the military point of view, well , it is in a military way. and by the way what's interesting is this understanding that they will essentially lose on the battlefield, it stimulates this internal discussion that you talked about, because so far this internal discussion revolves around mobilization, it revolves around what this propagandist said. we are 30 years old why did we give money for the war and where did we give it for 30 years and that the war is going on now finally, but it is not at all what we thought because it turns out that there is no such thing, there is no church we ca n't there we can't here we don't fight in general, it is not known what is the circle of gestures of goodwill , and here is putin’s last trip to ryazan to the training ground where he is. well, there was some magical story , now they are even saying that they shot someone there, some mobilized person who tried there say hello to putin as much as possible it is not clear, but the fact is that a person who sat in isolation , to whom no one was allowed, who was hiding there, now he is forced to travel around russia, meet somewhere, hug some military personnel at training grounds, demonstrate all this because , well, there is some mistrust, judging by everything, and no one else can shut up this mistrust, except for putin personally, he has to come to show that we are getting along, everything will be fine. well, i'm watching there, you know what they should be dressed as mobilized people, they show him all this, well, the king knows, look here all ok, that is, you know it’s already such a throwing of the last one. well, it seems that everyone else can’t cope with the argument. putin should personally deal with berets and boots. well, yes, but in my opinion, this is a practice that was actively used and was effective for quite a long time in russian politics, but... after all, in the pre-war period, putin was constantly going somewhere, we know that he didn't go to the bottom of the black sea for amphorae , let him fly with sticks, uh, here he was skating there, playing hockey there, well, listen, no, he was not a young man it was when well for example, this all stopped somewhere at the turn of the 13th year, something like that. after that, he started driving less and showing everything. and here he is forced to do the same thing again. yes, but it was a working practice when it was possible to build a system of dependence on the conservative majority and the leader, yes. later they began to call him the depths of the people and the leader, and of the formal pact when any liberal freedoms and aspirations are selected, i don’t know there, the manifestations of a civic position in exchange for them they show a propaganda picture on tv so that people think that everything is fine. they wake up. they read or watch how great russia is, how they are winning on all fronts, how everyone wants to somehow weaken russia, because russia is economically strong, and more and more less, yes , because there were years, at least when oil prices were high, they were, well, these years, well, not poor, so yes , we provide you with a refrigerator, and a plus for the refrigerator . yes, that's him today i went to one place in another, he does one and the other ten and it all worked, but these people will start having problems with the refrigerator , just as people will have problems with the tv, also in the literal sense of the word, because now people are being forced to go to war and war and this is a picture that was on television when you can sit and watch someone kill. and now it will be destroyed because people are being invited. well, not yet to a nuclear paradise. yes, but they are already being invited to go to war, and this image of the leader riding there shows the to his own example, how brave he is. yes, he goes to the training ground somewhere, all this is not working. i do not say that it will happen immediately, but gradually, as the war goes deeper into russian society, the so-called deep people will begin to wake up and get off the ostankino needle from this needle needles of information and virtuality will begin to diverge from reality, it will turn out that it is not only it is important that the leader rides somewhere on the training ground or shows what kind of hero he is, and it is important to understand what is happening in reality and when ask the question what are russian citizens fighting for, they will not have an answer to that after someone has been to the front himself and he understands that this is a war, well, it is not known at all what this war is for, what are the russians fighting for, no one attacked their territory they will tell that the occupied territories after the pseudo-referendums are allegedly russian territories, but this too well, this is not very convincing, but convincing. by the way, let 's see, we have small plots like this, this is how they explain it now, what are they fighting for, that's solovyov there it's fine with us, he's trying to explain everything , that's why they're losing now, no, but my bitch planned, so people were planning to go to donbas and crimea. god grant that these would be pictures of sevastopol so that these would be pictures of moscow from petersburg so that these would be pictures of yekaterinburg chelyabinsk, you know what is interesting here, it is not even about victory, it is about the fact that i am the victorious second army of the world, it turns out not withstand the ukrainian offensive, and it is very interesting if you say, now you say that putin is driving now. putin is trying to renew this fact with the population, but this pact is the population. he held on to the fact that russia is not victorious, and can it be renewed when the leader ? i don't say it like that, he somehow happily jumps, but on the other hand, he no longer looks invincible, and baron munchausen is no longer the same. already practice that is not working today, but the question is, uh, because uh, this is a war, uh, propaganda on the war and on the external threat inside the country, i believe that she will start to ask questions about what will happen next, and where will it unfold and in what direction will it turn because the same mobilization yes, it actualizes social injustice within russian society itself and the perception or line of a somewhat proportional e-e sending to the front of e-e e-e different nationalities and national minorities of various nationalities, as well as at the level of the social elite and reactive deep-rooted people. therefore, where should we turn? but i think that no one in russia itself understands in which direction it will turn, and the question is not even whether it will lose . it is clear that russia will not win in this war but this is the status quo when russia did not win, or rather ukraine, as it was in the first six months of the war, ukraine did not lose, but russia did not win, and now it is gradually changing to a trend, ukraine has not won yet, but russia has not yet lost completely either yes here it will drag on like this, this is the whole story, when there will be military actions here and there, it can all last quite a long time, russian propaganda can explain it. well, in principle, also for as long as you like defeats, they can tell that our goal was that we did not save part of the people there at all, we took them out yes, look, this is already ours there, that is, they can tell all the same as they want and this is the status quo. when ukraine wins but has not yet won because we have already understood that our victory is the return of the entire territory to borders of 1991, but it loses, but they haven't lost yet, and that's why i'm in one sentence right now, that's why it's important what will happen inside russia, will it be able to start processes that have been suppressed for many years with freedoms like thank you, it was olesyarying to find how show her what she is
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