you look at the size of the companies being run by these 25 women, whether it is ginni at ibm, or indra who ran an extraordinary job at pepsi, or mary barra, these are predominantly male industries, many of them, and the fact that women have broken through gives me optimism. having said all of that, i think it is up to the pipeline, so it is an even playing field, but every slate has to be filled with women, so if you are promoting somebody, if you are hiring and using an outside search firm, i think you have to refuse it if the slate is not equally balanced. it doesn't mean the woman has to get the job, but if you're bringing me a slate that is not half women, don't look at it. i think that is true for a board member, outside hire, promotion, a simple but critical discipline, because the outcome will never it there if the input is wrong, and the input is still wrong. david: has the paradigm for ceo shifted towards you? in the sense that you go back a generation, the brash, bold, typically male ceo is what is brought to mind. has that paradigm shifted? andrea: i think the paradigm is sh