and as the united states moved into the balkans and nato moved into the baltics, as the orange revolution, the ukraine took off, as the united states became very influential in central asia, the russian saw a second encirclement taking place. so if containment one, a containment of russia after world war ii, putin from the kgb saw a second encirclement. the russians also, they became exporters of primary commodities. not only natural gas but everything else. >> host: they had in many ways their economy had been based on that evening the soviet time. >> guest: gas problems optimize that. so rather than -- >> host: they saw the collapse of the industrial base. >> guest: and putin deliberately said we're not going to try to reinvest the whole gaza. we will look at gasp problems but also grain exports, would exports, the range of primary commodities as something we can do now that builds dependencies, creates political advantages for us. where as under brezhnev the strategy was take these enterprises, these industrial enterprises and continue investing in them. putin made a fundamental change