also a prison riot at parchman.blic accounts of that riot in which the guards completely lost control of the facility, also spilling out to public view around the same time i think it brought a lot of public pressure to bear on the situation. >> katie, before i let you go, i want your take briefly on another issue confronting the justice department. it seems every day we get additional details on what happened on january 6th. jim jordan and matt gaetz were reportedly deeply involved in the trump white house's efforts to overturn the election. you have written about the pressure of attorney general garland is under to aggressively pursue cases related to the insurrection. how far do you think the doj is willing to go in pursuing this matter? >> i think i look at it slightly differently. what we're seeing is on the congressional side a very fast-moving investigation that has to wrap up by the med term elections. that's their drop-dead deadline, put as much into the public view before they end their investigation. the

and john on that bridge on the freedom rides and so many different places parchman prison, which faulkner called destination doom. after the freedom rides he insisted that what we said in the declaration had to be made real so john you've obviously written a important book on jefferson. can you explain to people why it is that jefferson wrote a sentence that some would say is the most famous sentenced english language behold these truths to be self-evident that all men are create equal when he had slaves how could a man say all men are created equal when he had all those slaves hundreds of them? what was what was he thinking or what? did he really mean? he could write it because he was a man. it was a human being and he was fallen frail and fallible like all of us lincoln said that the declaration was intended to create a maxim and to embed in a revolutionary document a standard to which we could aspire. jefferson was unable to make his intellectual convictions triumph over his personal convenience, and i don't mean having a butler or something, but i mean his entire work his entire order