tell him what we're going through. >> a democrat or an independent now, there was pitch four, pat buchanan a former staffer with president nixon, turned conservative cable star plus fire on the right, that buchanan, buchanan long had the pulse of the gop's base. we've been together eight years now and soon it'll be time for me to go with reagan's departure and communism defeat. >> mr. gorbachev tear down this wall i'm ready to roll. good to see you again. >> buchanan sensed an opportunity to revive the rights isolationists tradition gop was reagan's successor, george herbert walker bush bush was the republican determined that america should continue to lead the world after the fall of the berlin wall he helped reunified germany germany is united. >> germany is free tonight, the battle has been joined, and he led an international coalition to kick saddam hussein out of kuwait guy over baghdad have been illuminated. that victory was swift and convincing. >> kuwait is liberated. >> bush declared a new world order, led by the usa, a new world order where diverse nations are drawn together in c

pat buchanan is running for running office. i mean, he's running his primary bush and the national review him a kind of tactical endorsement. so it's strange to spend time saying that this person is, you know, tantamount to being a nazi, but we're going to endorse him anyway. and in that repeated itself, when pat buchanan, you know, had quite a successful run that bush and they spent all their time saying, oh, he's he's, you know, another duke and tried to connect him to the the extreme right all the time was a fair attack. he was to those people. and then they invited him to the convention to give a speech. so they recognized that these people were a necessary part of their coalition, that they couldn't jettison that easily. yeah, right. and then this repeats itself with like the national review's never trump issue exactly where you have these stentorian attacks and then they get weakened. and well, just a few months ago, you're saying this is the worst thing that could ever possibly happen. and now you're. yeah. so the chapte

pat buchanan is running for running office. i mean, he's running his primary bush and the national review him a kind of tactical endorsement. so it's strange to spend time saying that this person is, you know, tantamount to being a nazi, but we're going to endorse him anyway. and in that repeated itself, when pat buchanan, you know, had quite a successful run that bush and they spent all their time saying, oh, he's he's, you know, another duke and tried to connect him to the the extreme right all the time was a fair attack. he was to those people. and then they invited him to the convention to give a speech. so they recognized that these people were a necessary part of their coalition, that they couldn't jettison that easily. yeah, right. and then this repeats itself with like the national review's never trump issue exactly where you have these stentorian attacks and then they get weakened. and well, just a few months ago, you're saying this is the worst thing that could ever possibly happen. and now you're. yeah. so the chapte

war, one, people wanted to focus on problems at home from his perch on cable television pat buchanan took notice and pitch pitchfork bat i seize this moment, declaring my candidacy for the republican nomination for president of the united states reagan had spoken of america as a city on a hill buchanan saw fortress in need of defense. >> the united states and mexican governments, buchanan blasted free trade deals. for president ought to be tougher in protecting american jobs and american businesses and american industries he wanted to stop paying for the defense of longtime allies, the germans and the japanese have been free riding and freeloading off the united states. and if i'm president, they're going to pay the full burden of their own defense he rejected international commitments demanded a border wall, and he summed it all up with one big slogan. >> i believe in a foreign policy of american first, you kenan's america first stance translates into opposition to foreign aid, lower taxes, trade protectionism, and immigration restrictions establishment. his message resonated right n

of months later pat buchanan is running for office and in these primary in with bush and to give them a tactical endorsement. it's strange to spend time but it is a and we will endorsement away. that pattern repeated itself with pat buchanan having a successful run the damaged bush and they spend all their time saying that he's another david duke and try to connect him to the extreme right of the time which was a fair attack but he was and then invited him to the convention.. so they recognize that these people were a necessary part of their coalition. >> and it repeats itself with the national review. >> exactly where you have these attacks in the few months ago you were saying it was the worst thing that could possibly happen. >> one of the chapters i thought was the most fascinating was the chapter you started reading from but the part thate connects wht we were just talking about with what you are reading from murray rothbard and other people in that circle. i had no idea that they had such a vetted cessation of the mob and the mob -- vetted cessation of the mob as the godfather.

so, you know, pat buchanan, very infamously a column for i think it was in the new york post 1990, in which he suggested that he was skeptical that hundred thousand -- were gassed at treblinka. and it's fairly clear that he was drawing that from holocaust denial that was in the orbit buchanan world at the time so there has always been this pipeline line of the sort of radicals, but what i think is different now and i wrote about this in the new york times, a couple of months ago, is that everybody who is in sort of gop staff politics, world drinking the kool-aid to one degree or another? i do think also that i would just want to touch on the project. 25.1 of the things i'm concerned about with project 2025 is that it is if it if you are serious about implementing that as a governing vision, then j.d. vance is the guy you pick as your vice presidential candidate to implement it. i mean, whether or not vance will actually have it, i mean, assuming trump wins election, whether or not he will actually have real political influence, the administration is another question. mike pence kind o

pat buchanan said, it was moby . it had to be slayed. so nixon was trying to get over the finish line and the manhattan 12, which was the conservative groups who were dead against it, they were mounting a primary campaign against them. so it was doomed except for that supplemental security income piece to failure. sorry. that was lengthy. >> well, one of the many interesting things in your book, the last liberal republican, was how you document how nixon pursued f.a.p.. i think there is a critical feeling that he proposed it and just let it wither. but he kept going back with it. >> just one or two more sentences. steve bell who was a leaving conservative on the hill road in '73, i think it was, after f.a.p. had been left behind, he said for two years and even much of a third year, richard nixon and his administration worked not incompetently and steadily to try to pass f.a.p.. he said, i am so relieved and so unhappy. now, for the first time, i don't see f.a.p. in the budget. think god. >> susan, we were going to come back to some of th

beforehand, when he had pat buchanan on, we asked pat one time, why didn't you challenge the race?illinois. they stole west virginia. and pat's answer was, because we still kentucky, joe. pat was very proud of it. but there were charges, like the races today, there were charges of corruption. >> what went on, and it may well have gone both ways, but what went on in illinois with richard j. daley, where kennedy won by a.d. hundred votes. and in texas, where it was rampant fraud with the paper ballots. it was pretty dramatic. you are right. there was some stuff on the republican side. and maybe if they had had a full investigation kennedy would have won in the end. but if nixon had been able to flip just illinois and texas, he ends up being president instead of jack kennedy. >>> up next, a new film depicts the chaotic i.d. minutes before the very first saturday night live aired in 1975. the cast and director of saturday night join us ahead on morning joe weekend. >>> what are you thinking? >> i'm thinking, better honeymoon. >>, i have a? neymoon. >>, i have a? ...on a ranch ...in mon

dinner for women serving the administration and the top eight women serving and political aides pat buchanan, charles colson rogers, morton, who was the chair of the republican national. we're all in favor of this. colson says, quote, we are missing an opportunity in this area as well as allowing negative issue to develop. there is no single area which would be more responsive and would result so many political pluses at so little cost, end quote. and morton's quote, i think, is even more interesting. and these are his words at the end. they're not mine. morton says, quote, we've been fighting pretty much of a losing battle on subject of the recognition of women in this administration. the top women's organizations are beginning to unite in their promotion. the equal rights amendment, and they are beginning to believe that only and only is in caps, only the democrats are interested. here's his closing sentence. the gals have a tremendous influence on the outcome of any election and quote and i'm holding this up, you see erlichman checked. yes. to have this. so i that this is very interesting

pat buchanan said to me, it was moby dick, it had to be slain. so, nixon was trying to get f.a.p. over the finish line, trying to get this finished. and the manhattan 12 -- what was the group of conservative groups dead against it, mounting a primary campaign against it. so, it was doomed, except when the supplemental security income piece, to failure. sorry, that was lengthy, but i hope it was helpful. >> well, one of the interesting, many interesting things in your book, "the last liberal republican," i thought, was how you document how nixon pursued f.a.p. i think there is this feeling, a critical feeling, that, you know, he proposed it, and then just let it wither. but, he keeps going back with it. >> just one or two more sentences. steve bell, who was a conservative, wrote in '73, i think it was, after f.a.p. had been left behind, he said, for two years and even for much of a third year, richard nixon and his administration worked not incompetently, and steadily to try to pass f.a.p. -- he said, i am so relieved, i have been so unhappy for the last couple of years. now, the f

so, you know, pat buchanan, very infamously a column for i think it was in the new york post 1990, in which he suggested that he was skeptical that hundred thousand -- were gassed at treblinka. and it's fairly clear that he was drawing that from holocaust denial that was in the orbit buchanan world at the time so there has always been this pipeline line of the sort of radicals, but what i think is different now and i wrote about this in the new york times, a couple of months ago, is that everybody who is in sort of gop staff politics, world drinking the kool-aid to one degree or another? i do think also that i would just want to touch on the project. 25.1 of the things i'm concerned about with project 2025 is that it is if it if you are serious about implementing that as a governing vision, then j.d. vance is the guy you pick as your vice presidential candidate to implement it. i mean, whether or not vance will actually have it, i mean, assuming trump wins election, whether or not he will actually have real political influence, the administration is another question. mike pence kind o

we know pat buchanan. he came in second in the new hampshire primary. and for 45 years he made an unbelievable. career of it. he was a hot item. he was on every show. he came in second in one primary. we came in first in 50 primaries. we then had a great election that we won. we then had another great election that we did a hell of a lot better in, and bad things happened. we're not going to let that happen. covid, they used covid to chea, but we then had an election. but now we have the election of oh, this will be, in my opinio, i have to say, if because, you know, there's always risks, i guess. but if we pulled this off, this will be the biggest political event in the history of our country. right. and we're building the biggest, broadest, most diverse coalition in american history, including union workers and border patrol agents. by the way, the border patrol gave me last week their complete and total endorsement. they said he's the greatest president in the history of the country, but we don't have to go that far. and they said there's never been

story and an older guy now, very old, but he was great, conservative guys, -- conservative guy, pat buchanan, you know pat buchanan, he came in second in the new hampshire primary and for 45 years he made an unbelievable career, he was a hot item, came in second in one primary. we came in first in 50 primaries, we then had a great election that we one, we then had another great election that we did a hell of a lot better in, bad things happen, they used covid to cheat but we then had an election but now we have the election and this will be in my opinion have to say this, because you know, there are always risks i guess, but if we pull this off this will be the biggest political event in the history of our country. right? [cheers] and we are building the build just, broadest most diverse coalition in american history including union workers on border patrol agent's, by the way the border patrol gave me last meet their complete and total endorsement, he said -- they said he has the greatest president and the history of the country but we do not have to go that far and they said there has neve

we know pat buchanan. he came in second in the new hampshire primary. and for 45 years he made an unbelievable career of it. he was a hot item. he was on every show. he came in second in one primary. we came in first in 50 primaries. we then had a great election that we won. we then had another great election that we did a hell of a lot better in, and bad things happened. we're not going to let that happen. covid, they used covid to chea, but we then had an election. but now we have the election of oh, this will be, in my opinio, i have to say, if because, you know, there's always risks, i guess. but if we pull this off, this will be the biggest political event in the history of our country. right. and we're building the biggest, broadest, most diverse coalition in american history, including union workers and border patrol agents. by the way, the border patrol gave me last week their complete and total endorsement. they said he's the greatest president in the history of the country, but we don't have to go that far. and they said there's never been any

coalition to win these campaigns, i mean that kind of nativist undercurrent was always i mean, pat buchanan, so much of what he was saying. yeah, from what i saw. was that something you were thinking of? okay, we need to tolerate we need to have these people in the tent to win the election or how were you thinking about that, i guess at that time i'm not going to say i wasn't uncomfortable with it, but i'm also not going to say it was very to me. because what i will say is this i want to be very methodical in how i pick my words here. the america first stuff was was very strongly, not entirely very strongly imbued with a sense of nativism that was clearly a blood and soil component to you could see it at conventions and there was a lot of really nasty, ugly anti-mexican stuff specifically in the 1990s when i was a political director that, was making its way through convention halls at the time. but i also i also very much subscribe to the idea that a lot of what i was hearing on the left was equally racially charged and what i could never reconcile why. some of it was okay on the left. if i

i beg your, having me, i think i have just got the pat buchanan who called the congress many, many years ago. israel's almond corner at another time because that is ready to act . but they're doing and you know, on a more serious note than me look at the political major article today. you know, i major article and political it actually a, you know, an investigative report that shows death. how almost, you know, more than half of congress is totally beholden to, to israel, that taken on the 3 trips to, to israel. and they actually gone days ready, a point of view. there they are. finance and the election as a was a path to make sure that they went or lose many of them less than they are really at a sort of progressive neighborhood, a something or a district like was there she the play by the on my and that you know, summer me and, and many of us. so uh yeah, i mean that, that it did that and all we ask, and i mean these guys are, you know, on the take all of them they, they take money and i don't say this in any kind of. yeah, yeah, no malicious way, but that's, that's a, these are the fa

administration changed the party changed and the country changed and you saw that stuff that was pat buchanan back in the dark corners of conventions become the dominant isolationist protection. this nativist and that's not conservatism as i know it. so i reject the idea that there's know populist conservatism, that those are two diametrically opposed ideologies. it's like being a dodgers of the giants. and, you can't do it. you want to think you can, but you really. yeah. so you so this was became a driving for you and other conservatives to start the lincoln project. yeah. which you worked on in 2020. talk about your work on that and this idea of the bannon line. yeah so you know i got a call from a reed galen one of the eight members who said, mike, you know, you've been very vocal, very vocal critic and unwavering and you're kind of fearless. they knew rightfully that if we spoke out that we would be mercilessly attacked including threats to our family, to my children, attacks on everything from my technology, my business, just massive, massive impacts. because the thing about it trump is

coalition to win these campaigns, i mean that kind of nativist undercurrent was always i mean, pat buchanan, so much of what he was saying. yeah, from what i saw. was that something you were thinking of? okay, we need to tolerate we need to have these people in the tent to win the election or how were you thinking about that, i guess at that time i'm not going to say i wasn't uncomfortable with it, but i'm also not going to say it was very to me. because what i will say is this i want to be very methodical in how i pick my words here. the america first stuff was was very strongly, not entirely very strongly imbued with a sense of nativism that was clearly a blood and soil component to you could see it at conventions and there was a lot of really nasty, ugly anti-mexican stuff specifically in the 1990s when i was a political director that, was making its way through convention halls at the time. but i also i also very much subscribe to the idea that a lot of what i was hearing on the left was equally racially charged and what i could never reconcile why. some of it was okay on the left. if i

and the republicans will be showcasing the most prominent mothers republican national convention pat buchanan actually used the term culture wars. there is a religious war going on in this country. it is a cultural war as critical to the kind of nation we shall be as the cold war itself. for this war is for the soul of america the culture war was really coming into its own in 1992. that's when republicans started talking about something besides lower taxes, limited government muscular foreign policy. >> a culture war issue speaks to you as a person, right? like gets into the core of you your identity, your ethics and so they were able to use it to rile people up from the inside, using it meant kind of highlighting the nature of the cultural disparity between hollywood and say, conservatives. >> and on behalf of family values. we've taken on hollywood and the media elite, and we will not back down it just kept getting bigger and bigger. >> and then as the speculation of, you know, the beginning of season five and how that was going to be dealt with just became enormous. >> monday's episode of

so, you know, pat buchanan, very infamously a column for i think it was in the new york post 1990, in which he suggested that he was skeptical that hundred thousand -- were gassed at treblinka. and it's fairly clear that he was drawing that from holocaust denial that was in the orbit buchanan world at the time so there has always been this pipeline line of the sort of radicals, but what i think is different now and i wrote about this in the new york times, a couple of months ago, is that everybody who is in sort of gop staff politics, world drinking the kool-aid to one degree or another? i do think also that i would just want to touch on the project. 25.1 of the things i'm concerned about with project 2025 is that it is if it if you are serious about implementing that as a governing vision, then j.d. vance is the guy you pick as your vice presidential candidate to implement it. i mean, whether or not vance will actually have it, i mean, assuming trump wins election, whether or not he will actually have real political influence, the administration is another question. mike pence kind o

we had populism in 92 with pat buchanan and ross perot.a pipe was aback and 68 with george wallace. we have pipe was back in the 1930s with huey long. this is not new. we should not be shocked that this happened. this periodically happened in american history when the average person, the average guy, she's got the shaft, it's hard to raise her family, it's hard to get the job, it's hard to get ahead. >> one ofop the things we studid by this movement in american history is akin to arise when there is great skepticism about so-called beliefs. that's a term we hear thrown around quite a lot. the elites and perception that the elites whoever they are our corrupt and that they are running this country to their own advantage and not to the advantage of interest of the average american. what do you think of those kinds of claims. do you think there is a kind of coterie of elites are running things to their own interests? >> historically, as you point out populism happens when people feel that they areth otherwise t being heard. movement again, ju

we had populism in 92 with pat buchanan and and ross perot. we had populism back in 68 with george wallace. we had populism back in the 1930s with huey long. this is not new. we should not be shocked that this happens. this periodically happens in american history when the average person, the average guy feels he's gotten the shaft. she's gotten the shaft. it's hard to raise her family. it's hard to keep a job. it's hard to get ahead. you know, one of the things, if you study populist movements in american history is they tend to arise when there is great skepticism about the so-called elites. and that's a term that we hear thrown around quite a lot. you know, the elites and perception that the elites, whoever they are, are corrupt and that they're running this country to their own advantage. and not to the advantage or the interests of the average american. what do you think of those kinds of claims? do you think there is a kind of coterie of elites who are running things to their own interests, you know? well, historically, as you point out,

pat buchanan, great guy, conservative commentator.me in second in new hampshire and he became very famous and he had a phenomenal career because he came in second. i came in first in 50 states. think of it. for the nomination. first in 50 states. and then we went on to win the presidency of the united states and then we won it the second time, but i guess were going to have to do it in third time. were going to do it a third time. and it's going to be, if we do it together, because it's not me it's us together, it's we. it'll be the greatest event in the history of politics in america. i believe that. and we're going to straighten out our country and we're going to make america great again. it's going to be amazing. five days, oh i can't wait. i've worked for 62 days in a row. i haven't taken a day off. and by the way, i looked at her today, she was trying to justify the fact that they called us all garbage. and i watched her at a news conference, she's exhausted, she's finished. about two weeks ago after having worked for like, you k

but as telling you before, when we had pat buchanan on, we asked pat one time, why didn't you challengelinois, they stole west virginia. and pat's answer was, because we stole kentucky, too. and pat is very proud of it. but there were charges of -- like, racists today, there were charges of corruption, fixing of the mob, sam giacana. >> what went on in illinois with richard a. daly where kennedy one by 8100 votes and in texas where it was rampant fraud with paper ballots. it was pretty dramatic. kennedy, you're right. there was some stuff on the republican side and maybe if they had a full investigation kennedy would have won in the end. but if nixon had been able to flip just illinois and texas, he ends up being president instead of jack kennedy. >> let's just drill down a little more on that. there's so many parallels was willie noted from the election now with the accusations of the election being rigged. take us behind the scenes why did nixon make a different choice than trump and not pursue and say hey, this isn't on the up and up, why didn't he concede? >> well, it may be the pat

>> you know, claire, brother pat buchanan and brother barnicle in the past, we are talking about political athletes. you're either a political athlete or you're not. watching that clip suggests actually you can grow into being a political athlete and something i've seen kamala harris do especially over the last couple of -- you see her there and how effective she is. any trump person watching this show, take what she just said and take that interview and find any interview donald trump has done over the last nine years and stack them up. claire, you will find one candidate speaks in completely sentences and one candidate speaks in complete thoughts. one candidate can engage in detailed policy discussions. one candidate is capable mentally, intellectually, emotionally of being president of the united states. one is just simply not. it's out there for anybody to see. this has nothing to do with ideolo ideologiy. i believe he is a threat to american capitalism. even if he weren't, donald trump compared to kamala harris, right now, is a distant, distant second. and, beyond that, spiritually. a

slammed by buchanan. pat was an aid to mr.. nixon. he said, i'm sorry to delay the w interview. it wasn't the greatest in the world. pat thought i was a spy from the rockefeller camp. at least that's what he teased me today. they gave me a job andnc started answering correspondents at the office i tried to do research. marty saw the value in what i was doing. as wein approached the nomination more than nixon. would win. anderson offered me the job and got a job working for allen greenspan. he was the policy adviser. things worked out i ended up. i took the bar exam and ended up in the 1970s. i don't know if he hadd a chance for the facility. all of the achievements that have been made five and half years of the nixon presidency. when you tour this and see all of that was done in the 5.5 years i'd like you a to understand. all of the achievements under a huge head win. 540,000 troops in vietnam.g troops weird troops weird killed every month in vietnam. the word had been promoted and escaladed by this d establishment and the state department and created by johnson. despite all of

buchanan, and pat was a then was an aide to the president, mr. nixon. and he said, i'm sorry, we getting back to you, so why don't you come on in for an interview? it wasn't the greatest interview in the world since i was a columbia law student. pat thought i was a from the rockefeller camp. at least that's what he teases me today. but he did. they did give me a job, and i started answering correspondence at their office. 520 one fifth avenue, and i to do some research. and marty anderson, who was on leave, that hoover institution, saw some value in what i was doing. and he offered, as we approached the nominees. and in 1968, it looked like more, more that nixon was going to win. marty offered me a job that summer for the presidential campaign, then i got a job working for a fellow named alan. alan greenspan was domestic policy adviser in. that campaign. well the things worked out. of course, we won that election. and then i ended up in the white house. i finished my third year of law school and came back to california, took the bar exam, and then up in

buchanan, and pat was a then was an aide to the president, mr. nixon. and he said, i'm sorry, we getting back to you, so why don't you come on in for an interview? it wasn't the greatest interview in the world since i was a columbia law student. pat thought i was a from the rockefeller camp. at least that's what he teases me today. but he did. they did give me a job, and i started answering correspondence at their office. 520 one fifth avenue, and i to do some research. and marty anderson, who was on leave, that hoover institution, saw some value in what i was doing. and he offered, as we approached the nominees. and in 1968, it looked like more, more that nixon was going to win. marty offered me a job that summer for the presidential campaign, then i got a job working for a fellow named alan. alan greenspan was domestic policy adviser in. that campaign. well the things worked out. of course, we won that election. and then i ended up in the white house. i finished my third year of law school and came back to california, took the bar exam, and then up in