with us is patrick radden keefe a staff writer at the new yorker. article appeared in the new yorker last may. and from washington, d.c. is don winslow. his most recent book is called "the cartel." i'm pleased to have both here. was this inevitable that he would get out of prison? >> i think so. let's back up a little bit and see who this man is. a billionaire businessman. ruthless. intelligent. he is organized. hate cannot run his business as well from prison. this is the second time he has god out -- got out. the man number two on the list behind osama bin laden. i think it was inevitable. charlie: does it say something about him and mexico? don: absolutely. let's take a look at this escape. a mile-long tunnel. the construction crew and the maxim security prison. we are supposed to believe he didn't have health from the outside or inside -- help from the outside or inside? that is inconceivable. who were these people? nobody knew a tunnel was being down for a mile-long? chapo has the power and intimidation. he has organization to do something like

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. >> all right, patrick radden keefe, thanks so much. >>> closing arguments set to begin this week inter shooting. next our legal experts take a look at what we can expect from james holmes' defense team. (music) i'm supposed to tell you how it feels when you book the perfect family vacation on hotels.com. but i think he's kinda nailing it. (music) hotels.com. they don't need me right now. (wind chimes) (single piano note) (wind chimes and piano) i called for help as soon as i saw her. i found her wandering miles from home. when the phone rang at 5am i knew it was about mom. i see how hard it's been on her at work and i want to help. for the 5 million americans living with alzheimer's and millions more who feel its effects. let's walk together to make an even bigger impact and end alzheimer's for good. find your walk near you at alz.org/walk. >>> closing arguments set to begin tuesday in the trial of james holmes the man accused in the aurora colorado movie theater shootings. the defense rested its case on friday after 256 witnesses and 47 days of courtroom proceedings. holmes' attorn

patrick radden keefe has written extensively phat that guzman and -- on guzman.don winslow is author of several books on mexican drug wars. the most recent is called "the cartel." pleasure to have both of them here. was this inevitable he would get out of prison? >> yeah, i think so. let's back up and take a look at who this man is, he is a billionaire businessman. he's ruthless. he's intelligent, organized and he can't run his business as well from prison. so job number one for him is to get out. again, this is the second time he's done this. it's unprecedented. a man who is number two on the most wanted list behind osama bin laden has now escaped not once but twice from the maximum security prison. so i think it was inevitable. >> rose: does it say something not only about him but mexico? >> absolutely. let's take a look at this escape. a mile-long tunnel dug by a construction crew into a maximum security prison, and we're supposed to believe that he didn't have help from the outside or the inside? it's absolutely inconceivable. how did he communicate? who were