leading off our discussion tonight is paul butler, a professor of law at georgetown university, and former federal prosecutor. jill wine-banks, who served as assistant watergate prosecutor. they are both msnbc legal analysts. and also with us, stuart

paul butler and jill wine-banks will join us next. so she starts a miro to brainstorm. “shoot it?”gests the scientists. so they shoot it. hmm... back to the miro board. dave says “feed it?” and dave feeds it. just then our hero has a breakthrough. "shoot it, camera, shoot a movie!" and so our humble team saves the day by working together. on miro. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's skyrizi. ♪ things are getting clearer, i feel free ♪ ♪ to bare my skin ♪ ♪ yeah, that's all me ♪ ♪ nothing and me go hand in hand ♪ ♪ nothing on my skin, that's my new plan ♪ ♪ nothing is everything ♪ achieve clearer with skyrizi. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. of those, nearly 9 out 10 sustained it through 1 year. and skyrizi is 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. ♪ i see nothing in a different way ♪ ♪ it's my moment so i just gotta say ♪ ♪ nothing is everything ♪ skyrizi may increase your risk of infections and lower your ability to fight them. before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. tell your doctor if you have

paul butler is back with me, okay. we haven't called an audible here, paul. i'm of two minds here.to me like i'm 6. there's a part of me saying, okay, isn't this what they were doing all along and there's another part of me saying wait a minute. they are asking for phone records so maybe we've seen some progress between now and the "a" block between now and when you and i talked before. how should we take this new report? is this something new, or is this just basically merrick garland acknowledging something that we assumed was happening all along? >> jason, the stakes just got way higher. donald trump may now be the subject of a federal grand jury investigation. now that's different from being a target. criminal charges are not imminent, but the grand jury is actively investigating trump's criminal conduct. this is historic. >> so now they have got grand juries. now they are investigating him for direct conduct. so, as you said, this is lighting the cannedle, lighting the giant, you know, bomb, okay. it's sizzling. does that mean we could see something in the next 18 months? does

paul butler and jill wine-banks will join us next. will join us next. so they shoot it. hmm... back to the miro board. dave says “feed it?” and dave feeds it. just then our hero has a breakthrough. "shoot it, camera, shoot a movie!" and so our humble team saves the day by working together. on miro. this is xfinity rewards. our way of showing our appreciation. with rewards of all shapes and sizes. [ cheers ] are we actually going? yes!! and once in a lifetime moments. two tickets to nascar! yes! find rewards like these and so many more in the xfinity app. the breaking news of the night is a report that people associated with donald trump tried to influence cassidy hutchinson's testimony to the january six committee. the new york times reports tonight that ms. hutchinson has told the january 6th committee that she was among the witnesses who had been contacted by people around mr. trump, suggesting they would be better off if they remain loyal to the former president. at tuesday's hearing, congresswoman liz cheney showed examples of interference with witnesses that, according to

paul butler's are implicated in the sort of locking up black people. and so song and i thought that it made sense to think about the implication of his arguments so policing so do we think it makes a difference if you're a black cup and the empirical evidence is kind of. mixed and the reason it's mixed if you make a difference you make a difference to people on the street or make a difference to law enforcement you make a difference in black people's lives. so you will have a different form of policing and policing structure to the extent that black cops are a part of the scene. so please seeing will look different feel different because they're black cops. that's the idea. now there are a couple of reasons to question that if again we take seriously that the problem of policing is a structure. so if you put black people in a problematic structure what you end up with is a problematic structure now, it doesn't mean that there is no pushing back, but it means that they are grappling with racism as black cops and the space for them to exercise agency in

maggie vespa joins me and paul butler. maggie, what do we know at the officers involved? are they concerned about more protests today? >> reporter: chris, no more plans of protest that we have heard today but city officials remain on edge because the city is still under a state of emergency with a 9:00 p.m. curfew planned. the eight officers are on paid leave, standard procedure in this case and the identitied not being released. people said they want more transparency from the city and the names to be released as soon as possible why they're horrified by the shear magnitude of bullets fired at him. police say he ran from the car wearing a ski mask and found a gun in the car. given the 90 shots and roughly 60 wounds to the body by 8 officers people horrified saying they can't get past the numbers and the police response. take a listen. >> i want them to make a change in the way that they do the procedures as far as stopping. for a traffic stop? really? you have to gun him down? get his license plate and run it and then pick it up later. you didn't have to chase him down t

paul butler, former u.s. prosecutor and david jolly former republican congressman no longer affiliated with the party. lindsey graham, this is actually a very big deal for a sitting united states senator to be subpoenaed in a criminal investigation. here is what his lawyer said about what he did that made him of interest to attorney bonnie willis. as chairman of the senate judiciary committee senator graham was well within his rights to discuss with state officials the processes and procedures around administering elections. that sounds find. graham asked whether brad raffensperger, the secretary of state had the power to toss all mail ballots in counties found to have higher rates of non-matching signatures. raffensperger said he was stunned that graham appeared to suggest he find a way to toss legally-cast ballots. it sure looked like he was wanting to go down that road, said raffensperger. in your mind, nick, when you think about what lipid sigh graham did, is it as obvious to you as it is to his lawyers t

next >> let's bring in nbc's aly rafael, and paul butler. so ali, let's start with the committee and those news for mulvaney. what more can you tell us about these texts with mcdaniel? >> yeah, lindsey. while we know former white house chief of staff, nick mulvaney, met with the committee for more than two hours on thursday. and he says that one of the topics he was asked about where his communications with people before january 6th, during, and after that day. specifically a text that mulvaney says the committee didn't get from him. this is a tax that he says he sent to then rnc chairwoman, ronna mcdaniel's a few days after january six. mulvaney saying he asked her for more clarity on messaging, because he says he was going out publicly, and saying that the state of arizona was still up for grabs. that state had not been accurately called for president then candidate joe biden. and he says that he saw rnc officials really countering that publicly, saying that the state of arizona had initially been cold. mulvaney saying that the committee a

stuart stevens, jill wine-banks, paul butler, greatly appreciated.thank you for starting us off this evening. coming up, a counter intelligence risk of the highest order. that is how peter strzok, we spent 22 years inside the fbi, describing donald trump's oval office meeting on december 18th 2020. peter strzok joins us next. n december 18t 2020 ♪things are getting clearer♪ ♪i feel free to bare my skin♪ ♪yeah, that's all me♪ ♪nothing and me go hand in hand♪ ♪nothing on my skin♪ ♪that's my new plan♪ ♪nothing is everything♪ achieve clearer skin with skyrizi. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. in another study, most people had 90% clearer skin, just 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. ♪it's my moment, so i just gotta say♪ ♪nothing is everything♪ serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections, or a lower ability to fight them, may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to. ♪nothing is everything♪ now's the time to ask your doctor about skyrizi, the number one dermatolog

stuart stevens, jill wine-banks, paul butler, greatly appreciated.thank you for starting us off this evening. >> coming up, a counter intelligence risk of the highest order. that is how peter strzok, we spent 22 years inside the fbi, describing donald trump's oval office meeting on december 18th 2020. peter strzok joins us next. xt so they shoot it. hmm... back to the miro board. dave says “feed it?” ot it, camera, shoot a movie!" and so our humble team saves the day by working together. on miro. before treating your chronic migraine— 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more you're not the only one with questions about botox®. botox® prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine before they even start—with about 10 minutes of treatment once every 3 months. so, ask your doctor if botox® is right for you, and if a sample is available. effects of botox® may spread hours to weeks after injection causing serious symptoms. alert your doctor right away, as difficulty swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weaknes

joining now is paul butler, former prosecutor. and kyle cheney, for political.his. the seems very, very serious. it honestly -- i think you probably would agree, as a reporter, it just stinks to high heaven. it's just one of those things -- i'm not getting the story here. it really does seem like after we saw that testimony of evidence last night, that the texts from that day, from the details of the vice president and the president. are some of the most important pieces of evidence we can get. what do you think? >> absolutely. and the way the story has changed just a matter of days. there was an agency wide upgrade of foam that may have compromise some unknown -- text messages over a wide range of time. now we're drilling down to, as you pointed, out the key moments -- and tenth specific agents. they know what they are missing. and apparently those messages are relevant -- and the fact those are among the messages that are gone, it raises all kinds of red. flags the select committee, every time they learn something new, the alarms go off. did not learn thing th

i want to bring in former federal prosecutor and legal analyst paul butler.is considered for the family and him justice. >> mr. lopez lost years of his life and saddled with a criminal conviction. the system messed up big time. why would he have pled guilty if he didn't do it? prosecutors told mr. lopez who was a teenager at the time if you don't plead guilty to robbery we'll charge you with rape why sometime innocent people please guilty because it is too risky to go to trial and this is a growing problem in the legal system where about 90% of people charged with crimes end up pleading guilty. people know that wrongful convictions are an issue but wrongful guilty pleas are a major problem and real justice requires looking at the issues beyond the one case. >> look at the systemic issues. talk about them with us. the case is like 40 years ago and the question folks might have is the progress since then of false confessions, wrongful convictions. >> the only reason he had this measure of delayed justice because the manhattan d.a. has an integrity unit. they re

will you under any doubt that this was a bribe for the diplomatic paul butler? obviously, we don't use to arrive. we'll just use the word a token of appreciation. but definitely without that money or he wouldn't have got his diploma password. ah, the my dominique trade house opens in 2014, the year of dominique his last election. ah, documents confirm a rally by prime minister scare its ruling party with entertainers and fireworks is paid for by them. a nation trading house. as is the bill for printing, the parties manifested 2 months later. prime minister scary wins a 3rd term of office. days after that, he rainy in early mon, fred sends his voluminous thanks and appreciation to skerritt the making him an ambassador to a manual non fan denied. receiving any gifts, if he and roosevelt skerritt called the payments entirely lawful campaign contributions and denied any wrong doing nanzen didn't explain why they were paid to his family service station. margaret higher, they were just out. not for the interest of the country. i said corruption but this way and corrup

for us, investigative correspondent tom winter and former federal prosecutor and legal analyst paul butlersha, let me start with you. the suspect in court today after the seven murder charges, first degree murder charges were filed against him. a lot of new details coming out just this morning and this afternoon. >> reporter: yeah, hallie. some chilly new details coming after that court appearance. according to the lake count y's state's attorney general, the gunman confessed to the shooting, confessed to dressing up in women's clothing, climbing up on the roof and firing off 83 rounds into the crowd at that 4th of july parade. he also -- this is quite a chilling new bit of information, hallie. he drove to madison, wisconsin after firing off those rounds at the 4th of july parade and contemplated another shooting. he saw another event, another crowd, contemplated doing this again. he had another rifle with him. he had about 60 rounds with him as well. this was not planned, though, unlike the attack here in highland park, which investigators say he planned for weeks. he drove to madison, co

. >> paul butler, jim kavanaugh, always good to have your expertise.an, thank you for that. >>> coming up, wnba star brittney griner's handwritten plea to the president. why she says she is terrified. >>> cassidy hutchinson's testimony gets more witnesses to come forward. who we can hear from as the january 6th panel gears up for more hearings this month. 6th pap instead, start small. with nicorette. which can lead to something big. start stopping with nicorette more hearings this godaddy lets you sell from your online store or in personh and manage it all from one spot. trusted by over 20 million customers worldwide, godaddy has the tools to sell anything anywhere. start for free at godaddy.com/sell your shipping manager left to “find themself.” leaving you lost. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire (woman) oh. oh! hi there. you're jonathan, right? the 995 plan! matching your job description. yes, from colonial penn. your 995 plan

post," a part of that extraordinary by line on the bombshell report that we just mentioned and paul butler, former federal prosecutor, professor at georgetown law school, also for our sake an msnbc legal analyst. josh, let me get to you, as we noted, you are part of the team that helped report this at the "washington post." walk through what you have unearthed and why it is so significant. obviously the process as it relates to any justice department investigation certainly this one is broadly opaque, but it does pull back the curtain a bit on what they are doing behind closed doors. >> sure. i mean, i think it's important to note, as you said, peter that is correct we don't know how this will end, it's no sign that it will actually lead to any sort of charges or anything against the former president. we just don't know that yet, it's too early, but what we do know is that there's been some significant investigative steps scrutinizing former president trump's actions. one, back in april they looked at home records of former top aides including mark meadows, his former chief of staff to loo

joining us is nbc news capitol hill correspondent ali vitali, betsy woodruff swan and paul butler, georgetown school professor and msnbc legal analyst. ali, this is playing out a day before the committee's next big hearing in prime time. what are you learning about this single text conversation? >> reporter: yeah, this is a single text conversation that is the result of the dhs inspector general asking the secret service for text messages sent or received by 24 specific secret service personnel between the dates in december and january 8th. the secret service saying in this letter to the january 6th committee yesterday that we obtained saying once they got that specific request, they were able to namely a text conversation between former u.s. capitol police chief to uniformed division chief thomas sullivan in which that text said they were requesting assistance on january 6th and then later advised that the agency did not have any further records responsive to the inspector general's request for text messages. they're saying, again, that's because of a migration to a different internal system

with me now paul butler, professor at georgetown law school and kurt bardella adviser to the dddnv. trump upses he's much less likely to be indict federal he's a candidate for president. the already cautious merrick garland probably would not go after him if he were running or am i getting that wrong? >> well, what you're getting right is that trump is trying to play garland by speeding up his announcement about running for president and then if trump is prosecuted he will say it's the biden administration going after him to help biden win re-election. merrick garland should not fall for that. the attorney general will make the decision about whether to prosecute trump in consultation with career lawyers and my former squad, the public integrity section of the united states department of justice based on the guidelines that they use in every case. joy, running for president is not a defense to a crime. if trump is not held accountable in criminal court, the message sent is that a president can commit the most serious crimes, even sedition and get away with it. >> and that is -- that

paul butler, you, too. 12 jurors and two alternate jurors have been chosen in the trial of former white house strategist steve bannon. court was in recess for part of the morning as both sides hashed out a disagreement on evidence. the judge rejected another request by the defense to delay the trial this time by a month. bannon faces two criminal contempt charges for defying a subpoena from the january 6 committee. joining me now is nbc news justice correspondent pete williams. i am looking at the jury notes and there seems to be a state department employee on the jury, an art salesman, nasa contractor, doctor, architect, and handful of d.c. government employees. a lot of whom have extensive experience serving on juries. >> it means a typical d.c. jury. two d.c. government employees, someone who works for the state department, somebody who sells appliances in maryland, a photographer, a guy who works for a covid testing firm, and the architect says he watched nbc news reports about the bannon case and the task here is to find people who say they can judge the case based on the arguments

he will be in conversation with paul butler a former federal prosecutor who provides legal

joining me now is correspondent ken delney paul but butler and you wrote in the latest story that the the live hearings played into public pressure for the doj to hold trump criminally responsible. i don't know if they played into these two pence aids testifying, but what to they bring to the table? >> the justice department investigation is secret. we should be humble about how little we know about what they are doing. but there's no doubt when i talk to people familiar with the merrick garland, there's a perception that the massive avalanche of evidence we have seen in these public hearings has put pressure on the justice department to intensify its investigation. there's no doubt that these two people are key witnesses and really represent sort of a different category of witness. these are the first people that can bring investigators inside the white house and talk about meetings, particularly mark short was involved in a meeting on january 6 4th during which john eastman tried to pressure mike pence to hold up the certification on january 6th. and mark short knows exactly what ha

paul. well, from one european capital soon another paris. this time natasha butler is standing by outside a shelter in the french capital. natasha another very, very hot day in france. and i understand you've just been to a homeless shelter in central paris. yeah, that's right. look very another very hot day indeed, mailing the north in the east of the country though, because the temperature has dropped considerably in the west of the country. of course, that's good news or for the fire fighters in the southwestern region of shiranda has been battling places now for a week. they have seen temperatures plummet there perhaps even a rain expected or overnight, so that will certainly help the situation for them. we have just been at a homeless shelter. we've been speaking to people there because of the homeless are of course, amongst some of the most vulnerable people and in a heat wave they are particularly impacted. we spoke to the head of the shelter, said look very nearly 3000 homeless people in paris. they can come to that shelter though. they can fit in some air c

true as they brought many enslaved workers to fill the roles of butlers maids and cooks one example that i have on the screen here is pauljennings who was an enslaved ballet to president james madison in addition to working for the madison's and later the polks at the white house. he also published the very first white house staff memoir called a colored man's reminisces of james madison and as i talk today about different members of the white house resident staff these staff memoirs are a critical piece of evidence that we on the historian team use to understand more about their lives and their relationships with each other as well as their relationships with presidents first. these and first families. so that's just one thing to keep in mind as we go along. now beyond the abolition of slavery, there's a long history of race at the white house and in the west residents staff, typically the residents staff really mirrors the way that americans society operates. so in the 19th and early 20th centuries, you see a lot of these domestic positions filled by african american workers and immigrant workers and up through the 195

butler is there. while the run, surprisingly not many people are braving the heat at the foot of the eiffel tower record breaking temperatures expected in many. paul, the france including in the north in brittany, an area that is no usually for very cool climate. now the french government have put several regions on red alerts. they have advice, people to be extremely vigilant. they've rolled out the heat wave emergency plan advising people to stay at home, stay in the shade and keep a very hydrated in the. it's not that he'd way on coleman and from the usually they are several years of hard climate change. experts say that because of the changing temperatures, what we are seeing is he wave for the more intense and more frequent this heat wave . in fact, is the 2nd one in just a few weeks. well, all this is making the situation in the south where the frost particularly difficult. thousands of fire fighters trying to tackle blazes that have destroyed a lot of forest. thousands of people have been evacuated from camp sites from holiday homes. it is mary very popular with for it, but some fruit fight is on the horizon, say, meteorologist because temp

flames. natasha butler reports from power will run. surprisingly not many people are braving the heat at the foot of the eiffel tower. record breaking temperatures expected in many paul, the france including in the north in brittany, an area that is no usually for it's very cool climate. now, the french government have put several regions on red alerts. they have advise people to be extremely vigilant. they've rolled out the heat wave emergency plan advising people to stay at home, stay in the shade and keep very hydrated. indeed, it's not that he'd waive our own comin in front b. usually they are several years appalled climate change. experts say that because of the changing temperatures, what we are seeing is heat wave for the more intense and more frequent this heat wave. in fact, is the 2nd one in just a few weeks for dry hold. whether it's 30 exacerbated the situation for 5 fighters been battling blazes in the south west of france that she roamed a region. thousands of people have been evacuated from camp sites and homes in the area. it is part of frogs and staples here indeed with holiday makers. particularly of course, at this time of year in the summer break.

butler is there. while the run, surprisingly not many people are braving the heat at the foot of the eiffel tower record breaking temperatures expected in many paul, the france including in the north in brittany, an area that is no usually for very cool climate. now the french government have put several regions on red alert, so they have advised people to be extremely vigilant. they've rolled out the heat wave emergency plan advising people to stay at home, stay in the shade and keep very hydrated in the it's not that he'd weighed on coleman and from the usually they are several years hard climate change. experts say that because of the changing temperatures, what we are seeing is he wave for the more intense and more frequent this heat wave . in fact, is the 2nd one in just a few weeks. well, this is making the situation in the south west of france, particularly difficult thousands of fire fighters trying to tackle blazes that have destroyed a lot of forest. thousands of people have been evacuated from camp sites from holiday homes. it is mary very popular with for it, but some fruit fight is on the horizon. say, meteorologist because temperatu