and paul embry of firefighter trade union firefighter and trade union alongside me too.one of the big stories today, we know that the nhs is in an absolute mess now about 7.6 million of us on the waiting list at absolute shambles and a disgrace. notwithstanding it though , the notwithstanding it though, the junior doctors have gone out on strike again today for days. this time we know the details by now, don't we? they are wanting pay now, don't we? they are wanting pay restoration back to 2008. that would be a whopping 35% pay rise . now, the junior doctors rise. now, the junior doctors have been given 6% plus £1,250, which works out on average about 9. so i'm asking you tonight a couple of questions. should doctors be able to go out on strike like this? steve barclay the health secretary, he's saying that the now risking lives . and i also want to get lives. and i also want to get into the fact that i think there's a bit of a political element to these strikes to you at home. all of your thoughts coming in on that, but also joining me tonight for this debate , a regist

tomlinson broadcaster tomlinson and author broadcaster and firefighter embry , one and firefighter paul embrys messaged in to say, have you been living under a stone? for goodness under a stone? bev, for goodness sake, everybody knows that paul is fireman and a double for is a fireman and a double for the ginger winger. >> prince harry yeah, i get that too. >> is that what you get as well? well, i'm sorry that i didn't know that. >> i thought paul felder from the ufc actually, i. >> oh, yes, yes, yes. >> i think you're not a winger at and you look much at all, paul. and you look much more harry more handsome than prince harry as tell you, steve as well. let me tell you, steve says on the economy, we are well and martin and truly stuffed, martin said. unless on unless people, especially on lower wages, are given, decent pay lower wages, are given, decent pay as so many people pay rises, as so many people will discretion will stop any discretion spending, will stop any discretion spendingeconomy , that occurred services economy, that occurred to me, martin, especially at christmas where people

but with me in the studio is claire pearsall and i also have paul embry with me.ard to know where to start with all this, but we'll start with all this, but we'll start with the tragedy yesterday. clare what lessons should we learn? should the government learn? should the government learn from what happened in the channel this is not going to stop and i think that's the really stark reality of this as much as the government wants to stop the boats and it's putting it on podiums and it's making it one of its five pledges, it isn't going to stop just by speaking to france, for example i >> -- >> it needs much more communication with the international community. there aren't any simple answers. and anybody who says that this is really simple to solve it shouldn't be allowed to have that conversation because there are so many parts that need to be looked at. there are so many complicated and probably unpopular need unpopular decisions that need to be the government be made, and the government doesn't to be keen doesn't really seem to be keen on making any of them. >>