the best or nothing. >>> joining us now is paul fishman. he is the former u.s. from new jersey. he is now a law professor at seton hall. thanks for your time tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> so i am trying to figure out a thing. what did the trump transition and the early trump administration tell you about your fate as a u.s. attorney or the fate of u.s. attorneys generally in the new administration? >> well, we never spoke directly to the new administration. but we were -- we knew those conversations were taking place. we had heard that the transition team was recommending that we be permitted to stay in place to assure an orderly transition. and then as you just said before you went to commercial on the tuesday before the inauguration, a conference call was convened with all the united states attorneys to let us know that we would not in fact be asked to eleave precipitously. we would ask that we would be permitted to stay until of course we wanted to leave on our other own or until some succession plan was put into effect. >> they told you that on the 17

attorney for the district of the state of new jersey, paul fishman. he was in that lowell until president trump asked for the rez ig nations of 46 u.s. attorneys back in march. counsel oar, thank you very much for coming in. let's start with this. we saw a mixture of three -- >> four terms. >> people ask me the difference between special counsel, special prosecutor, independent counsel and int pent special counsel. how do we delineate these? >> i think it's maybe because we've had all those different flavors over the last 30 or 40 years, brian. what people tend to think of independent counsels, they tend to think of the statue that was in effect for 20 years or so in the 1980s and 1990s which led to kent star investigating whites water. that was a statue passed by congress that provided that the attorney general or the acting attorney general went to a three judge court and asked for a special counsel. >> just a good lawyer that they knew of? >> a lawyer they knew of. ken starr, flrp a whole bunch of them during the reagan and bush administration and

attorney for the district of the state of new jersey, paul fishman. he was in that role until president trump asked for the resignations of 46 u.s. attorneys back in march. counselor, thank you very much for coming in. and let's start with this. we just saw a mixture of three or four terms. >> right. >> and people ask me the difference between special counsel, special prosecutor, independent counsel, and independent special counsel. how do we delineate these? >> i think it's maybe because we've had all of those different flavors over the last 30 or 40 years, brian. so what people tend to think of independent counsel is they tend to think of the statute that was in effect for 20 years or so in the 1980s and 1990s, which for example led to the appointment of ken starr to investigate white water and related matters. that was a statute passed by congress that if the attorney general was recused, the acting attorney general could go to a three-judge court and ask that court to appoint an independent counsel to investigate certain matters related to the adm

. >> paul fishman, former u.s. attorney from new jersey, now law professor at seton hall. can i put you on the spot and ask you to please come back and talk to me more about the process. i know you're not going to talk about any of the investigation you were involved in. >> no. >> but this process to me is a real question mark. and i'd love to talk to you more than. >> i'm happy to do that or to talk about special counsel or some other topic of the day. >> thanks a lot. former u.s. attorney in new jersey. that does it for us tonight. we'll see you tomorrow. now it's time for "the last word with lawrence o'donnell." good evening, lawrence. >>> i think we basically have open invitations to federal prosecutors and anybody who knows anything about special prosecutors, how they operate in the justice department. with a special prosecutor announcement, you to figure we're on the special prosecutor story, rachel, for at least two years. that would be in the recent records of special prosecutors. quick that would be fast work. >> yeah. >> from that, if it goes two years, we're rig