who helped set up the debate commission in 1986 working then with the democrat paul kirk. he is a washington lawyer who was president of the gaming association. the other co-chair is mike mccurry, a communication specialist and professor of public theology at wesley seminary here in washington, d.c. he was also the spokesman at the white house and the state department under president bill clinton. martha, we'll start with you. the two candidates of the 2016 debate, donald trump and hillary clinton, were not your run-of-the-mill candidates. they were in their way very special, so i'm asking you, how did that -- martha: yeah. marvin: how did that specialness affect the way in which you prepared for the debate? martha: whatever you prepare for a debate, i approached it in the same way i approached the vice-presidential debate. it is the super bowl of debates. without question. all the networks had done primary debates, but when you go into a general election debate and the candidates as you said are special, think you have to think about i do that. you have to think about how

paul kirk and alan simpson on the board said that's a ridiculous criteria. the only question is who you want to be president. there is a problem here and the problem is no poll asks the american public who they want. it's a very specific question. >> investor question. >> no i haven't. >> no poll is asking the american public who they want to be president. >> what is your question? >> that's a different question. why aren't you abiding by your criteria? >> we are. we been sued in every election cycle other than to fascinate with the question of what the criteria is and whether or not we are following the standard. i must be candid with you. we constantly look at criteria between every single series of debates. there's some on the commission who think it should be higher. some think lower. others have volunteered that everybody on enough ballots to conceivably get to the electrolyte to be included. we decided to go with the league of women voters who in 1980 is at the 15% rule. as the debate most people forget what people forget what the president of the unit

the then head of the commission, or actually it was paul kirk and alan simpson, who was on the board, said that's a ridiculous criteria. the only question that matters is who you want to be president. there is a problem here. the problem is that no poll asks the american public who they ant to see it -- to see. marvin: sir, you asked your question. >> no, i haven't. no poll is asking the american public who they want to be president. every poll asks -->> ask your question. >> every poll asks who would you vote for? why aren't you abiding by euro criteria? -- by your criteria? >> we are. frank:we have been sued in every election cycle other than 2008 with the question of what the criteria is and whether or not we are following the standards that the commission was set up. i must be candid with you -- we constantly look at the criteria between every single series of debates to determine. -- to determine. there are some of the commission who think it should be higher. some think it should be lower. others think that everybody who is on the ballots and could conceivably get 270 electoral