paul ryan was sort of unique. he was a conservative. he came up through the policy world and through the committees rather than through leadership. he had a lot of support from the most conservative members of the conference at the time. he had a lot of support, he had been the 2012 vice-presidential nominee. he was see whrepbgsly -- essentially, he was friendly with the leadership and establishment. he was a consensus pick. he was unique because he was the only person who could fill that job. who could get support from across the conference. he didn't want the job. it was too much fundraising. he didn't like the idea of t he wanted to -- of it. he didn't want -- he was interested in budgets and tax policy. tax policy is where he wantses to be. as speaker that's what he ended up having. once ryan left congress, this -- when the situation seems inevitable, even with kevin mccarthy's support, it wasn't broad enough. he didn't have the trust that even paul ryan did at the time. i think without paul ryan we would have had this conversation

now paul ryan is throwing down.as far as it goes i've called his office repeatedly because he acts like a 5-year-old. i invested over and over to quit. he keeps doing it he wants to punish people that is not his job. his first gates ago i respect the man immensely we are political prisoners here in the united states are doing nothing for them. i don't hear anybody talking for them. i am f sorry the man should nevr have beener speaker. we've got paul ryan because of it. so thank you for your time. i think that the common view may not be the that we need somebody fromhy the right flank to be the speaker currently was notit sufficient. not unanimous what we need to do is find some way to bring people and people who disagree but are still republican and say what can we agree on? and that is what i'm saying is not been done. people want to pretend things are not emotional are not important enough. they're important enough they brought on the speaker the house. speaker of the house. and until you say the republican party

>> there's no paul ryan in this race. if you remember back when kevin mccarthy decided not to run, they brought paul ryan up and he had a good brand nationally and had a decent inside game and could raise money but there is no paul ryan. there is no close second to jim jordan. >> if jordan does not make it, it gets more complicated. >> i do think jim jordan will make it this week. >> do you see mccarthy making a comeback or throwing his hat in the ring? >> about does not mean you will be speaker. >> mccarthy has eight people. >> kevin mccarthy is behind jim jordan. he has a lot of people who were going to vote for him today. i think he will talk to the ones who did. if scully's and kevin mccarthy is voting for jim jordan -- if school lease and kevin mccarthy is voting for jim jordan. >> tax relief, other things. >> this is the reason jim jordan is the only viable speaker we have -- viable speaker candidate we have. and i support kevin mccarthy. but he had so many arrangements and deals that they became almost mutually exc

now paul ryan sits at fox news and is destroying that. as far as don bacon goes, i called his office repeatedly because the act like a five-year-old and i have asked him over and over to quit but he keeps doing it like he wants to punish people. that is not his job. i respect the man immensely because we have political prisoners here in the united states and we are doing nothing for them. i hear no one talking for them. i am sorry, the man should never have been in speakership. without paul ryan because of it and of the whole country is paying. guest: i think that is a common view among republicans. it not be the majority view but it is a widely known view that we need somebody from the right flank to be the speaker and that mccarthy wasn't sufficient. the thing is it is not unanimous in what you need to do is find some way to bring people like the caller and people who would agree with them to say what can we agree on. that is what i was saying has not been done. people want to pretend these things aren't emotional and these differences

and then there was paul ryan. h donald trump's election, and a new era of politics and the republican party, for that matter. ryan reportedly told friends that serving as speaker during the trump administration was, quote, agonizing. trump went after ryan with public insults in addition to trump's near daily controversies that ryan had to govern through. about 30 months into the job, paul ryan opted to vacate the speaker's chair and also to retire from public office entirely. and now, as of today, kevin mccarthy, the parties for the speaker this century, served for 269 days before being ousted by members of his own party in a historic vote. by our count here, as my friend chris hayes pointed out to me, arguably the most successful republican speaker of the house and the 21st century was a serial child molester. now to be fair, it is only 2023. the gop has 77 more years to burn its legacy, but wow has the trajectory so far not look great. coming up, we'll try to and pierre's steve inskeep about how republicans used

when paul ryan took over, he said look, i'm not going to live this way. i'm not going to be speaker of the house with this gun pointed at my head all the time. basically arranged a handshake agreement with the freedom caucus to say you're never going use this against me and that held for as long as we were there. mccarthy knew this day was coming. you can't govern like this when just any one member or five members, i guess, can set the, can make a constitutional change. a constitutional officer change hands. when teaming up with democrats. it's absurd. it's why he was pushed so many times to the right, to the right, to the right, making promises he knew he couldn't deliver on. if you want to give some credit to some of these guys who are trying to push him out, there is some truth to the fact he made some promises probably in the beginning of this term and couldn't deliver on. couldn't promise to deliver certain spending levels. couldn't promise the rules would always be followed the same way. eventually, that's going to catch up to you. at the same time,

and then of course paul ryan who announced hey, you know what, i don't want to do this anymore. this one involuntary. even though we're focused on the eight hardliners, i fail to see how the bigger problem is going anywhere for the republicans in the house. >> another name we haven't mentioned, donald trump is also being floated for speaker. >> probably unrealistic, but it does say a lot about the climate. >> he says that he is open to the job, he is dealing with a lot of legal challenges. he is traveling around the country running for president. but i think that trump is the elephant in the room even though he is not here. he has divided in party for cycle after cycle since 2018 because of people who are extremely loyal to him and more moderate members. the white house is definitely exploiting that. that is why they are using this maga term to tie certain republicans to his brand. they feel like that is going to eventually play in their favor. >> and i do think -- we probably haven't even talked about trump enough here on this set this morning because it does really hang over e

paul ryan resigned on his own, i don't think he got pushed out. keep these people together, when you have a normal sized majority. when john boehner and paul ryan were speaker, we had 20, 30 seat majorities. kevin mccarthy was dealing with a four seat margin. we've only gotten more conflicted. there's a big trump split right down the middle of the party. people want to get past trump, and people who are very happy to be in the middle of trump. they don't get along very well. plus, it's really hard to get things done in any circumstance, as speaker of the house. so, whoever, that's the issue, whoever becomes speaker right now, still has a huge problem ahead of them. they've got to fund the government, they've got to pass it for israel and ukraine. all of those things could end up being fireable offenses, we might be right back here again trying to figure out another speaker. >> michael, switching gears, former president donald trump was fined $5,000 yesterday, and threatened with jail time for violating a gag order in his new york fraud trial. mean

paul ryan stepped down and resigned because he was so fed up with them.boehner was like, i'm done. he stepped down as well. we know dennis that'sert hard his issues with child molestation and he had to go. newt gingrich stepped down after disappointing midterm elections and scandal. that's their last five speakers. is there a way to change the incentive structure, the decent people, people who are not nuts and don't want to overthrow the government can actually have some power on the republican side? or is it too late. >> well, it's really hard with gerrymandering in the house. what you don't have in the senate. every senator represents a whole state. and there are still states that will elect either a democrat or a republican. those members have an incentive to find common ground. but let's look at nancy mace. you know, her name should be on everybody's lips. give me a break. she can't decide who she is. she barely won her congressional seat. defeated an incumbent democrat by a hair in 2020. what did the republicans do? they gerrymandered south carolina

who is not the worst guy i -- i am paul ryan is a long-time friend of mine. conservative, b matt gaetz argued in you dump ryan, you will co cause the instability, why couldn't you say the same them about kevin mccarthy today. >> it is the same thing, larger argument he is talking about, talking about single issue legislation and regular appropriation process, i agree with that, most republicans do, i would love to see, if the result of this is this gets more attention to those very important issues, about how to run congress, then i think that is a positive thing. but at -- again at the end of the day, you have to have an option. he is not pretending to have an option, but that he says we need a better speaker, well who? ilhan omar, that is not going to work out. that is where you get into this thing, is this guy a charlatan raising money for himself. and trying to gain attention? and if that is what he is doing, he is wasting our time, one last point, if the other result of this is that we talk 'government shut downs, our, likes to talk about how dangerous a

it wasn't with paul ryan or john boehner. these are the guys that don't like the realities of governing. there are some things you have to do when you're in the majority, like keep the government open. like raise the debt limit. like fund the government for the long term. deal with democrats. basic things like that. those are fireable offenses. it doesn't make any sense. they set a bar that he can never meet. the next person is going to have to meet that same bar as well. it's the problem being speaker these days, you are basically running around, trying to make the fantasies of some of these members become realities. when that's the game, you can never win. i understand, maybe the idea that he should stick up to the more. fight back. all that stuff that you talked about in the open, was enough to save mccarthy. but it was required to get to this point. that's the reality of being a republican speaker right now. you have to do so many things or they will throw you out. it works really well for them, in their own political wor

he was succeeded by paul ryan, who took that job reluctantly. paul ryan found himself fighting many of the same battles and the election of donald trump. and then you have someone like paul ryan who, don't forget, was the party's vice presidential nominee and he also left congress, left politics altogether. so what you see, jose, over the last two, potentially three decades, is the evolution of the gop. a conservative party that once defined conservatism as preserving a traditional sense of steadiness and strength, it has evolved over time to a party, this is made most evident by what is happening in the house gop, a party that elevates the loudest voices in the room. voices who aren't invested necessarily in governing, but in the case of matt gaetz, who are invested in score settling. you have matt gaetz, who has no real legislative accomplishments, he was able to topple his party's leader with no plan for what comes next, no plan for ukraine funding, no plan for getting beyond the next government shutdown, which happens in november. and now yo

paul ryan. >>> when we come back, a lot more on "squawk." -miss interview on the markets, global tensions, the recent rise in interest rates and washington dysfunction, all of that, paul tudor jones will be with us at the table in just a moment. nice footwork. man, you're lucky, watching live sports never used to be this easy. now you can stream all your games like it's nothing. yes! [ cheers ] yeah! woho! running up and down that field looks tough. it's a pitch. get way more into what you're into when you stream on the xfinity 10g network. >>> coming up, we're going to talk about the state of the markets in the midst of the volatility and flaring geopolitical tensions with investing veteran paul tudor jones. plus, the satori fund's dan niles will join us with his view of tech ocstks as we get ready for earnings in the next couple of weeks. stay tuned. you're watching "squawk box" on cnbc. the changing landscape to stay ahead. when you partner with barclays, every change leads to a bold possibility. you have the vision. we have the insights,

paul ryan is a long-time friend of mine. he is a conservative but may not be a modern conservative. through that another time gates gaetz dump ryan from speakership, give instability and democrats advantage. why couldn't you say the same thing with mccarthy. >> exact same thing. but the larger argument he is talking about, talking about single issue legislation and regular appropriation process, i agree with that. i think most republicans agree with that. i would love to see it. if the result of all of this, this gets more attention to those very important issues about how to run congress then i think that's a positive thing but at the, again at the end of the day, you have to have an option. he is not even pretending to have an option. exempt he says we need a better speaker. who? ilhan omar? i don't think that will work out. that is not a better speaker. he is not able to answer that. you get into this thing, is this guy a charlatan, trying to raise money for himself, gain attention for himself, if that is what he is going, he is wasting our time. one last point if the utter result

that's why paul ryan is gone. he talks about he doesn't always agree with the direction his party is headed in, doesn't support the standard-bearer donald trump. would prefer someone else to be at the top of the presidential ticket. when push comes to shove, kevin mccarthy decided to time and time again make decisions that emboldened that hard-right faction and decided to make it so they could only have one person bring the motion to vacate. and even yesterday during his meeting with the caucus -- or the conference when he decided to say i'm not going to run for speaker again, the fact that he said, i'm not going to sell my soul to the democrats shows he was willing to do what the extreme republicans wanted verps us negotiate a little bit with democrats. >> one thing that strikes me is that the eight people who voted to oust kevin mccarthy were the same people who on friday when the speaker was offering them, not every single member but it's generally the same group of people when the speaker was offering a short-

amna: kevin mccarthy, paul ryan. how did we get from that to this?nnocent days when we were young and naÏve. they were sort of the next generation of reaganism. paul ryan was a serious policy guy, eric cantor was a pretty serious policy guy and kevin mccarthy more of a politician. but they never updated their philosophies from the 1980's. even though in 2010 -- never caught up to where the republican party was headed. eric cantor, a representative from virginia, he was shockingly ousted even though he was in leadership, that was one of the first early signs the party was shifting. paul ryan did not get the news and even when he was speaker, he could not survive. i'm reminded -- a republican senator told me about six months ago he would go to rallies and look at the crowd and said i don't know any of those people. a new constituency had come in and they wanted a complete lead different party and they didn't adjust. amna: let's look at the three individuals that are the likely new speakers of the house, two of whom who have declared candace easy, steve

communications strategist and former aide to house speakers paul ryan and john boehner, brendan buck,nk you very much. >>> thank you for getting up "way too early" with us on this thursday morning. "morning joe" starts right about now. >>> all right. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is thursday, october 26th. we have a lot to get to this morning with the deadliest mass shooting so far this year in america. it happened at two locations last night in lewiston, maine. we will have a live report from there in a moment. >>> plus, republicans finally have elected a new speaker of the house after

number two with kevin mccarthy same thing with paul ryan. is he teenager. john boehner he is the worst. kevin mccarthy oh my he has got to go. only with the republican house can you have 94% approval rating and not be good enough. >> lawrence: 9 #. >> brian: i was low balling it. talk to somebody next, burkett who also voted against it nancy mace because women's rights weren't front and center. we this have happened at all if matt gaetz didn't try to blow this up. no oneish united stated with matt gaetz voted along with every single democrat to oust kevin mccarthy. waste another week to find out what was next. now that mccarthy is out and won't run again what is next for the house. >> ainsley: hillary vaughn is on capitol hill with the latest for us. hillary? >> the house remains in limbo until republicans vote on a new speaker next week on wednesday putting the people's business on pause until they figure it out. former speaker kevin mccarthy saying congressman matt gaetz who triggered the motion to vacate has a personal vendetta against him and ultimately

paul ryan was in a quite different position in 2018 and you are not seeing factions divide.er of fact, you saw brian fitzpatrick, someone who doesn't hold my view on a lot of things and a moderate republican endorse jim jordan, my hero and mentor and judiciary chairman. so i think we're actually going to come together quite soon. i think we've got two great choices and i think that you're going to really see an invigorated republican party. we were in the doldrums with kevin mccarthy. we had no budget and we've not had a budget in this country for decades. it's time we follow the law and work with the senate and the president and divided government to meet our priorities. >> there's no guarantee that either of the two candidates running for speaker that they'll get a new budget, given that you are dealing with a divided congress and that you don't have the number, quite frankly, congressman. >> we have the numbers to pass appropriations bills to fund 70% of the government and for the criticism that i'm knowa agent of chaos, i voted for those appropriations bills, for our mil

massie: there's no paul ryan in this race. remember mack when kevin mccarthy decided not to run after running for a while, they brought paul ryan up. he had a good brand nationally. he had a decent inside game. he could raise money. but there's no paul ryan. there's no close second to jim jordan now. reporter: if jim jordan doesn't make it, are we talking about -- it gets more complicated. mr. massie: i think jim jordan will make it this week. reporter: if he doesn't, does mccarthy make a comeback? emmer? emmer got a vote, mccarthy got some vote you got a vote. mr. massie: just because you got a vote doesn't mean you'll be speaker. if it does i'll throw my name in there. reporter: mccarthy has people talking about the speakership, 20 say no to jordan right now. mr. massie: mccarthy is behind jim jordan. he had a lot of people who were going to vote for him who didn't vote for jordan, he'll talk to them. if mccarthy is behind jordan and scalise is bind jordan. reporter: do you think he can cut deals with new york delegation, wi

that's his b and, to top it all off, l his predecessor, former speaker paul ryan, mike johon wants toely cut the social safety net. particularly social security and medica. perhaps most signify, for our purposes here, mike johnson 's a hard-core election denier, who played a key role in the effort to overthrow e 2020 election. he recruited house republicans to support a lawsuit, seeking -- he, quote, was also it clear our prot republ objections to certifying biden's election on january six, 2021, 146 of his republican colleagues, johnson voted to overturn the election results. in the end, that vote was make-or-break for the speakership. tom emmer, a former number three in leadership, his vote in favor of democracy, ratifying a free and fair election, voting, the person who won enough votes to actually be the president, that was disqualifying in the eyes of the one person who matters, donald trump. and any so-called moderates in the caucus, emphasis on so-called, we spent a lot of time over the last few weeks going on cable news shows, talking to microphones, talking to reporters about

i came in when paul ryan was speaker, and i can tell you for transparency, there's more communication, we're working together under kevin mccarthy. my colleague thomas massie said it best on the floor, i agree with everything he said, i didn't serve with boehner but i served with paul ryan and i think we had made some positive changes. at the end of the day, and i said this on newsmax last night, i'll say it on fox tonight, it's hard to get to 218. it is hard to get to 218. and, for me, i would vote for the most conservative spending bill anyone could put forward. but if you can't get the 218, then you have to adjust. so the problem with the 6 to 11 is if you can't get to 218 in the house, it's a problem. >> reporter: can anyone run this conference? >> i think we're going to have to be a little more realistic. but there are a lot of people that can run the conference. we're all replaceable. >> reporter: there are members who will just never go along with certain things. >> we're going to have to. and i think that people will go home and hear from their people. and at the end of the da

being floated, but given what's happened to mccarynd even those before him like john boehner and paul ryan job worth the headache? joining us now nbc news senior political reporter sahil kapur, cofounder of "punchbowl news" anna palmer, and committee spokesperson for republicans kurt bardella. sahil, last night you talked about witnessing this exchange between senators tim kaine and lindsey graham, one democrat, one republican, the senators talking amongst themselves. kaine says to graham, quote, hey, lindsey, you know you don't have to be a member of the house to be chosen speaker. graham responds, yeah, but you got to be sane, and i'm sane enough to say no. so there are real reasons not to want this job. talk about that and who is in the mix? >> that's right, ana, it's a very fluid situation right now. there has been no succession plan in the event kevin mccarthy was toppled as he was yesterday, and there's no official roster of candidates running yet. republicans are expected to discuss that at a forum next week. there are a number of names in the mix. let's put that visual back up. thr

there was other efforts to do that in 2018 then speaker paul ryan. here is matt gaetz, listen to this. >> if we take paul ryan off the field right now instead of being able to finish strong in the 115th congress we will shatter into a bunch of factions shattering into power. we have enough of that in washington right now. paul ryan can be a caretaker of the speakership. >> we can have a leadership election. we can go into the midterms strong. and i don't think pushing him out early if he doesn't want to go-is advantageous. >> bret: it's not one-to-one, obviously. but it's interesting to look back at that time. what do you think happens to your caucus? it's still a slim majority. >> it is a slim majority. one thing i know there won't be a democratic speaker in all likelihood we will work through this. again, if kevin mccarthy were to say that he wants to compete for it again i don't have any doubt that he has the votes to do it. there are a lot of our members that will move away from supporting him. they appreciate the fact that he created this majori

kevin backs out and guess who they get, paul ryan. it took two months before they didn't like paul ryan. whoever will have narrow majority, democrat controlled senate and democrat in the white house. you will have a new face and nothing will change, except the eight images you put up will become famous thachl is what republicans crave, they crave fame. democrats change the country and republicans claim fame. you got it, fame and minority is what you will have. >> brian: congressman tim burchett was upsets, he said, i will pray on whether to vote for kevin mccarthy. really? you voted for me 15 times last time. he thought he was mocking because he was praying, that is why he was on the ring of eight. this is about matt gaetz. if he didn't come forward, they don't stand up. what does it say about matt gaetz? he doesn't want to lead, he just wants to blowup things. >> trey: he's had a personal vendetta against kevin. i was there. i'm not a ps psychiatrist, he can't stand to see others succeed. matt gaetz def defended katie and has a crush

have a lot of enemies, he has good relationships with right and is as policy driven and wonky as paul ryanares about issues. >> emily: that would be refreshing change from everything demonstrated, the house is comprised of individual royalty and consensus does not matter, constituents do not matter, all that matters is myopic views. mccarthy was ousted due to chaos, what have we seen ever since? weigh into reports that emmer was jettisoned because of pressure of president trump and far right faction? if true, what does that mean for johnson and for congress moving forward? >> i don't know about the trump issue here, he endorsed jim jordan and jordan didn't get it, he was jettisoned by math, not by trump. >> harris: that is interesting, let me get this in here then. former president on truth social, he says he torpedoed him. >> of course he would say it. >> truth social, totally out of touch with republican voters and globalist rino. that is what he was saying about tom emmer of minnesota. he certainly says he took him down, you are saying it was numbers, as well. >> yeah, i don't think pre

and then paul ryan took over for him and presided over the largest shut down in american history. so this has been in entered 12 royal inside of the republicans that has been absolutely brewing. so he is, he's correct. it is institutional and it's been there from i'm, but he's seen is that swan creature he said, is that person that sign you and goes with everybody who can break them a deal. so both sides ended up again. let's hope shaka us policy analyst. thank you . say you all. the winters of the 2023 nobel prize and chemistry have been announced and sweden, us based scientists, monkey venti fluid bruce and alexi, s came off one the prestigious award for their work on tiny quantum dots. they will be awarded $1000000.00 for their achievements. swedish media outlets reported that the names of the winners were leaked several hours before the official announcements. the route nobel jury says that they deeply regret the leaks which are rare, given the great length undertaking to keep the winters names and routes on the x are confined into. you're watching dw news still to come on dat

seem to have a reasonably good time as speaker, i'm inking about paul ryan, john weiner, kevin mccarthys almost like a management, harvard business school. what did you understand about managing your restless party that they don't understand why did you seemee to have this argument? >> the thing is, i always say the candidates were elected, no your wife. know why you were there. if you know whyou you are there, then all of the work that goes into getting the job done is much easier and that is satisfying. i do know that i would call f ia good time or fun but it is what we call fun, being successful and my thing is for the children. it's gone from kitchen and speakers for the children. there is funding for children. and it is for the children so i would say i will quote a president and he said when he talked about being in the arena, you know you should r

joining me now is brandon, a veteran of capital who worked with james and paul ryan.the city college of new york first, big picture. how has the toppling of mccarthy emboldened extremists like matt gaetz? it has, not just immaculately -- domestically but internationally as well. republicans are torn into disarray. we have elections coming up next year, the stability of our democratic republic is called into question but we have moderately meeting republicans who don't seem to exist anymore or they are deciding not to run. the entire party, the first time in modern history, we have seen a party in complete and utter chaos. we are going to see this posting again and again. it's not just destabilizing about the public, we care about young people and getting them involved but has effects internationally when they say what is going on? they can't figure out who their leadership will be and what is i mean for productivity not just for the american people about how the president and chuck schumer will work to make policy to go dc to do? >>> it seems like this chaos is going

host: republicans have had a reluctant speaker before, paul ryan. guest: they have. if you don't want it, that makes you more appealing than those who do. host: let's get to kathleen, democratic caller. caller: i need to know this answer, as well as some of your republican callers blaming the democrats about them helping to give mccarthy out. i was under the impression that if you got the majority, like the republicans, it is 220 and eight weight against him. why are you -- blaming democrats for getting rid of mccarthy when you have 220 republicans? it is not the democrats' fault because these eight republicans went against one of their own. i hear people talking about why do the democrats not vote to keep a speaker in? since when is a republican speaker going to keep a democratic speaker in? why could not four or five of those republicans who did not want mccarthy come over with the democrats? host: we will take your questions. guest: you make a really good point. that is the argument that the democrats on the hill are making. democrats never vote for republican spe

however, that is why i think the longer this goes, just like paul ryan did not want the job initially and then he did, you never know. maybe mchenry could get it. in the last congress, we had the same small majority for democrats as we had four republicans, but nancy pelosi's track record of being able to lean on her caucus and if you process, she will punish you. that is usually the case. you do not want to vote against the likely speaker because he or she could get revenge. host: let's have our viewers join us. republicans, (202) 748-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. independents, (202) 748-8002. you can text us as well at (202) 748-8003. you can also go to facebook.com/c-span or post on x. i will send it back to you and where this contest stands between jim jordan and steve scalise. guest: jim jordan has gotten a big endorsement in some ways, from former president trump, who was toying with the idea that you do not have to be a member to be speaker, but we have not seen that. jordan has gotten more endorsements, but mostly republican conference is undecided. a lot of them, they will

and remember when you talk paul ryan out of ways and means. that's all they wanted to do.egged him to leave it and be a speaker. next thing you know what, no one is listening to me i'm out of here. >> ainsley: become almost like a hero for the republican party on investigations in hunter and biden family. >> brian: do you want him to leave that and be speaker and let somebody else do that that's what you are losing if he becomes speaker. >> carley: jimenez says he is not supporting anyone for speaker until they change that motion to vacate. he wants more than one person to be able to do. they called what happened to mccarthy a coup and said it's despicable. matt gaetz wrote on x the way they want to punish me. make it harder to remove speaker jordan and speaker scalise oh no anything but that. >> brian: he lobbied hard to put that in. >> steve: with the 118th congress, there is this rule and this would apply to donald trump because donald trump, you know, if he is toying with the idea, apparently he can't -- the argue is in the "new york post" this morning. donald trump ca

in 2015, you may remember when kevin mccarthy was taken down, paul ryan didn't want the job.were in chaos. we did not have a consensus candidate. i never really talked about it publically, but i was approached by democrats to -- would you be interested in taking the job? we will get you votes. bring x number. this is what we need. we never got off the ground because paul ryan decided he was going to run. >> wasn't that a more reasonable time? >> it was. but i could still see a power sharing arrangement. susan and i were talking about the senate was 50/50. you could do some things to entice maybe some democrats -- maybe just vote present to thrower the threshold. they could do things to facilitate a speaker. >> clearly, a vote of present would give them the power. they could have done that before. they could have marginalized matt gaetz and company easily if anyone had figured this all out or had been willing to do that. susan, let me show you something that jim jordan was asked by ali vitali about how he could -- having gone for impeachment, pushed impeachment and been such a

whoever they choose is going to be another paul ryan. i am interested in the functioning congress, that is why i am an and did and i want to see my country back on track working for the american people. these guys are prima donnas. there going to come and go. the american people will stand forever. host: that is nancy in ohio. as we noted, one of the key votes here could be don bacon, republican of nebraska. according to most lists, he is in the know category -- the no category. his name being high up in the alphabet, it will be an early tell. don bacon spoke with reporters yesterday about where he was. [video clip] >> your concern about of vote for speaker? >> i think people can disagree on this. very few things are zero or 100. on one side, we need a speaker. we have israel that needs help. we have a november deadline and i feel all of that. i don't feel any joy saying this and my heart is broken. i cannot overlook the fact that there is a small group of people that violated the rules in january and then vacate the chair and then ski s

paul ryan had a problem with the hard right. kevin mccarthy does, but this vote tonight, there has not been a vote like this for over 100 years. barbara: that is right, but john boehner almost faced one. there was a motion to vacate, that is remove them from office. it was put forward by mark meadows who became chief of staff for donald trump it -- for donald trump. that never came to a vote. mr. boehner resigns. shows -- there has been this division for some time, but it is very start in this case. the right wing has become radically right, very hard-line, wanting to slash government spending, being a thorn in the side of mr. mccarthy from the moment the vote for him started. there were 15 rounds for him just to get elected. it has become a sign that the party is deeply fractured. if we see that mr. mccarthy is removed, then there becomes a question of who can leave the house? christian: you almost preempted my question. ven the chaos, what happens if the shares vacated? do you have to have anyone sit in it? barbara: no one kno

as you know, paul ryan was a darling on the right.when he was in power, you have to start doing things. all of a sudden, you're a rhino, your a swish, nobody can trust you. jim jordan's going -- would have to fund the government, working with joe biden and chuck schumer, there's no way around the. it's funny, he is actually making a pitch to moderates to say, i have the ability to do some of the governing things, and we can get away with it. whether he would actually work that way, i don't know, but he has at least become aware that the job requires getting things done, whether he could do, it i am pretty skeptical. >> -- >> he's rooting for his time in the borough. >> i can't, chris. >> we'll see, we'll see. >> you can't trust that jim jordan will step up to the rule. this is the same philosophy that got us donald trump in 2016 but republicans in the establishment. oh, he'll grow into the job. jim jordan is not gonna grow into becoming an adult all of a sudden. he is incapable of the, and he's demonstrated that time and time again. >

paul ryan said he didn't want the job and after an awful lot of arm twisting by republicans, they finally got him to serve as the speaker of the house. of course, the house flipped back to the democrats. i continue to watch down the way here to see if we have any traffic, any members coming down the way here. again, members of congress, they don't quite know what the to think at this moment. we've not been to a stage like this where they voted out a speaker. we've seen a lot of things happen the last few years, multiple impeachments and now an issue where they kicked out their own speaker. it's remarkable. the one time that they came close to this, this was in 1910 and joe cannon was the speaker of the house. you sometimes hear about the cannon house office building across the street. it's named after him. he had a lot of infighting with members of his own party. they threatened to vacate the chair. joe cannon said, you want to kick me out, i can win that vote. he did. he put the motion the vacate the chair up on his own and prevailed with democrats. >> neil: matt gaetz is talking to repo

this is something that john boehner dealt with and what paul ryan dealt with.hen democrats came in and not on one occasion, several occasions, saved the republican conference from self destructing and destructing the government at that point as well. i do think these are incredibly interesting times to be there, to say the least. but it is not the job of democrats to elect the republican leadership, and i think democrats should sit back and take this all in. >> obviously speaker mccarthy is not in an enviable position in any way you look at this. congressman curbelo, the deal only funds the government until mid november. it kicks the can down the road. are we in for the same kind of drama? >> i think what happens this week will help determine that. again, there's a big opportunity here for centrist members, both republicans and democrats, to ban together and kind of take over the house. this is a power vacuum in the house. this is something pretty rare in the house. the house is a majoritarian institution. the speaker in most cases acts like a dictator. this is

they supported paul ryan. they gave money to paul ryan and john boehner.or them to write checks to jordan especially if they think the house will flip anyway. there's only a five seat majority republicans have. this may give democrats the advantage to win. they may be able to hedge their bets and say even though they are in the majority right now, we are not going to give the same kind of money because they will not be here long. geoff: speaking of fundraising, we got third quarter fundraising totals for the 2024 crop of nominees to include president biden, you see him at the top with $71 million. mike pence raised $3.3 million . what we don't see is his campaign is apparently $600,000 in debt and he had to lend himself $150,000 of his own money. it reflects the lack of traction he is getting in the primary. the fundraising totals in many ways reflect the polling challenges. tamara: if you look at the graphic, it looks like there are two incumbents and then everyone else, and they are way behind. someone like mike pence has struggled to gain traction in th

congressman charlie dent of pennsylvania is here, and brendan buck, former aide to house speakers paul ryan and john boehner, he's an msnbc political analyst. i mean, i understand that tensions are high. sounds like tempers are high as well. what do we know about what happened here? >> the tension and tempers are aren't new. we're seeing it spill over once again behind closed doors behind kevin mccarthy and the man who started this entire thing, congressman matt gaetz, the person who three weeks ago motioned to vacate the chair. he ended up giving seven colleagues on board with him, which put us in this lengthy situation, which is confusion is queen over here. i have to tell you as much as we have been talking between democrats and republicans, people trying to figure out if there's some kind of a bipartisan path forward on a resolution that would empower the speaker pro tem, one key member just left the republican meeting, and speaking to my colleague scott wong said reading the room, i think this thing is dead. the thing is the empowering mchenry bid. it was never going to be easy to sell

he's not a paul ryan or someone like that who caught the brunt of republican attacks. they want to get this over with. and many have said that publicly. those concerns were brushed to the side. >> looks like they're going to have a news conference on the steps of the capitol. when he starts speaking we'll go to it. give a little more about who mike johnson is. >> reporter: he wants to answer the questions millions of americans have, who is this guy. he has a chance to introduce himself to the country, and he started doing that in that speech from the speaker's chair, making a big point about his own personal back story. growing up in shreveport as the son of a firefighter, describing himself as a man of great faith, and suggesting that's the way that he wants to lead the people's house. as you pointed out, he's also going to be the first maga speaker of the house. this is someone who won in 2016, along with the group that came in with donald trump. he has always been a strong trump supporter. while stylistically, he couldn't be more different than donald trump and jim

ali vitali on capitol hill, and steve kornacki, brendan buck an aid to former republican speakers paul ryan and john boehner who's an msnbc political analyst, and david drucker, senior writer at "the dispatch." okay, al what now? what are the conversations? what happens? >> reporter: once again, back to the drawing board, chris, and we're waiting to see what happens next. initially our understanding was that jordan knew he was going to lose votes on this balloting round, that's exactly what happened, even jordan allies were forecasting that. now just in the last few minutes apparently he has left the chamber. people are of course asking him the obvious question, which is what do you do next? do you drop out? do you stay in? initially our understanding was that jordan was willing to go through this for several balloting rounds. that very well may still be the case. as he's been dealing with all day and frankly over the last 24 hours, there's this new cross current from people who are just so fed up with the fact that they keep hitting the same brick wall over and over again when they try to

paul ryan, john boehner, kevin mccarthy. they don't seem to have as good a time. it is almost like a management question. like a harvard business school. why did -- what did you understand about managing your restless party that they don't understand or why did you seem to have a better time doing it than they do. >> it depends what you mean by better -- fun. the thing is that i always say the candidates elected, whatever, know your why. know why you are there. if you know why you are there, then all of the work that goes into getting the job done is much easier. and that is very satisfying. i don't know that i would call it a good time or fun, but it is what we call fun, that is being successful. and my thing is for the children. everything -- that's why i ran for office. that's what got me from kitchen to congress to congress to house speaker, for the children. you can't imagine, right now they are trying to cut title one funding for children. when you have a goal and you respect the values of the who even you have a disagreement with, to put something together

brendan buck was an aide to former republican speakers paul ryan and john boehner and tim miller is writer at large for "the bulwark." brendan and tim are msnbc political analysts. steve, in the end, there was a lot of analysis i listened to all morning. some folks said it could be as many as 10 or 20 against jim jordan. in the end, it was the higher number. break it all down for us. >> if you think back to january when kevin mccarthy had the first round in his ultimate 15 round march to the speakership, how many republicans voted against him in that round, the number was 19. so you take a look here, this is as we said at the beginning, we were kind of a big list of republicans who would -- might potentially vote against jim jordan here. it started with don bacon from nebraska, the second district of nebraska. bacon is one of 18 republicans who represent districts that voted for joe biden in 2020. so these were thought to be the republicans who were maybe going to to be the most squeamish of voting for jim jordan, whose potential democratic opponents were eager to use this vote against him

and then paul ryan took over for him and presided over the largest shut down in american history. so this has been in entered from royal inside of the republicans that has been absolutely brewing. so he is, he's correct. it is institutional and it's been there from i'm, but he's seen is that swan creature he said, is that person that's fine and goes with everybody who can break of the deal. so both sides ended up not trusting him. let's sort shaka us policy analyst. thank you . thank you all. here's some of the stories making headlines. in iran, a 16 year old girl is in a coma after being assaulted by the morality police, according to curtis rights group pen ga. the group says that our meta garra event was attacked in a to run some way for violating the islamic republics, his job rules. the media released this edited video. ronnie authorities deny the claims a similar incidents last year sparked mass protest in wrong. you have to triple mother, she's a former russian state tv journalist who protested against the ukraine war live on air has been sentenced to over 8 years in prison

your paul ryans and your eric cantors. and if you're too young to remember those names, then that's part of the problem, but because they didn't make it. they didn't become the next generation of leaders. they became the next generation of ousted leaders. and kevin mccarthy is the final one of that group to effectively get up and say i didn't get the job done. now as that speech gets longer and he tries to massage what his political legacy and write-up will be, we heard a lot of other ram rambles. we heard about the treaty offer have say. it's a narrative that said look, i tried and did my best. it's going to take a couple of days because who the heck is going to want this job after watching this. >> ementioned wilt chamberlain. i thought he with us going to take a turn into appeasement. but he did not. >> he did not. >> stick around. we're going pick this back up in a second. we have congressman mark alford, a republican of missouri. we spoke earlier before this went down. congressman alford, you voted for kevin mccarthy