we decided that given the passage of statutory paygo and a shift in the framework that it made sense to shift our baseline in light of that. so we're not actually taking credit for that extra trillion. that, you know, under other circumstances might have been perfectly reasonable credit for. the problem with the cbo baseline i don't think anyone thinks it's remotely realistic to think all the tax cuts, the amt, the sgr, you know, every one of those things is going away. so we try to make a set of adjustments largely grounded in statute that congress passed statutory paygo, some additional adjustments for monies beyond that but the most significant adjustments we made were based in a law that congress passed and the president signed. but regardless none of that changes the basic story which is that we stabilized the debt to gdp ratio, which is knots where we are today. >> richard, two quick questions. we've heard it said by the president's opponents at both countless times that before the stimulus unemployment would be capped at 8%, if it were enacted and the answer is, well, the econ

the last time the debt limit occurred in the last session paygo was attached to it.as the engine is sort that sort of drove the trained through congress and the president was perfectly complicit with this. it was obviously in favor of it and he assigned it. the fiscal commission itself was attached and pastor executive order in exchange for the debt limit, so let's not say that we are only for clean debt limits when just a year ago the president was fine with attaching things on debt limit. that is the point i want to make last thing, the corporate tax reform. it is a little vague in corporate tax reform in the budget. what do you mean exactly and then i assume you are talking about deferral. i assume you are talking about foreign tax credits as one of your revenue raising or face positions. wouldn't going to a territorial system fix those problems and what is your position on going to a territorial system and then i would like to turn over to mr. van hollen. >> we are suggesting it is best and easiest and cleanest and most responsible to do a clean debt limit extens

we decided, given the statutory paygo and a shift in the p framework, we are not taking credit for that extra trillion, that under other circumstances could have been reasonable to take credit for. the problem with the cbo baseline, nobody thinks is realistic to think that all the tax cuts, everyone of those things is going away, so we try to make a set of adjustments, largely grounded in statute congress passed, additional adjustments. most significant we made were based in a law that congress passed and the president signed. none of that changes the basic story, which is that we stabilized the gdp ratio, which is not where we are today. >> we heard it said by the president's opponents over -- count of times that the plan was before the stimulus and a plum it would be capped at 8%, and the answer was the economy was much worse than we thought. we are going to hear it countless times more, included in what ever debate the president has in the fall of 2012. is that his best answer, that the economy was worse than he thought? two, competing claims of why these trillions of dollars are sit

right now is not paygo with tax cuts. can decrease taxes and not show where the revenue is coming from. host: who has the upper hand in the budget process right now, if there is such a thing? guest: i been the president always has the upper hand because budgets are incremental. let me explain. each year it is a discussion of the increment or decrement, slight reductions or slight increase. probably 90% of the budget is uncontrolled from year-to-year. 60% our entitlement programs and unpaid debt, interest. you get down to about 10 to 12 -- 10% to 12% that can be controlled. you are talking about a battle over the percentage. right now, the president has the upper hand because he has the veto, the senate democrats and you need 60 votes frequently on things. not all budget bills, but on bills where there is a threatened filibuster. they can use that. at the action of the house, the action of the kati group people, which is very impressive -- of the tea group people is very impressive. host: the numbers are on the screen. law

with the budget enforcement resolution and statutory paygo and the bowles-simpson committee, all of those would have a good effect. you need to get 218 votes to pass something. austin is worried about passing something in the how. it is really a challenge. to get 218 members to vote or something is the equivalent of trying to herd cats. it is like trying to herd squirrels. it is difficult and i wish you luck with it. >> at the beginning of my remarks, i always say i will not -- i do not know what the biggest obstacle will be. but we will fight it. there are enormous challenges. we are trying to work through the continuing resolution. that affects what your discretionary spending is 40 -- if that what your discretionary spending will be for the year. we got the president's but it's late. that is a huge challenge. we have to find historical highs on deficit and debt as a share of the gdp. that it is were hired during world war ii. that was an extraordinary -- higher during world war ii, but that was an extraordinary situation. as we are talking about out of, i will look at my boss, the chai

you could put out a paygo for the commission. if you don't like one piece of it no problem. offer a different way to achieve the same savings. i think what you saw with the warne warner chapel blils bliss group is remarkable. it's a dramatic pivot from where we were recently. >> all this optimism is great. what do you think, tom? even if tom coburn and dick durbin and all these giles get together and say this is what we do, there's this house that has nancy pelosi led republicans and john boehner led republicans it would be like no thanks. we'll shred it. >> we're actually starting to h kumbaya. austin and i are going to be holding hands with our bosses as we walk down that beautiful path. i like to share your optimism. i tend to be an optimist. i've been staff director of the budget committee for 14 years and on capitol hill longer than that. i think the problem is this. i think the problem is many americans like the idea of cutting spending in general. the concept that government spends too much is something that i think many americans agree with. but when you get into the

-- paygo statement be read, the bill be passed ushes the motion to reconsider be considered made and laid on the table. that upon passage, the senate insist on its amendment, request a conference with the house on the disagreeing votes votes of the two houses, and the chair be authorized to appoint conferees on the part of the senate, with the ratio of 5-4, all with no intervening action or debate. the presiding officer: is there objection? mr. reid: mr. president? the presiding officer: leader? mr. reid: no objection? the presiding officer: no objection having been heard -- mr. reid: mr. president -- the presiding officer: the leader. mr. reid: i ask unanimous consent to set aside all pending amendments so i may call up my amendment 79, the grand canyon economic impact study, and that be in order notwithstanding to order 22. the presiding officer: is there objection? mrs. hutchison: i object. the presiding officer: objection is heard. mrs. hutchison: mr. president? the presiding officer: the senator from texas. mrs. hutchison: mr. president, until the senator from oklahoma is ready