there is one about ross perot. can you believe this guy? he is an egomaniac. a debate with him would be a gd circus. >> ms. crowley: he first believed thatted -- that perot would make the race colorful and people relate to him. and there is no way he can win the general election but he can spice up the race and make bush and clinton better candidates. and ross perot seemed willing to talk about crucial issues neither of the other two seemed to talk about like deficit reduction. nixon thought he was making a positive contribution there. but disagreed with isolationist strains in his platform. and perot exited the race and jumped back in and this disappointed nixon because he thought he was treating it like a game subject to his own whims and nixon thought the country couldn't afford to have an erratic character as a vice president nominee. >> host: how did you get random house to buy the book? >> ms. crowley: i worked with evan thomas on the last book and i had a simple outline and asked him if he was will to read it. he was, he liked it and that is how it came

troubling i liked ross perot -- donald trump: i liked ross perot , i think he went off the deep end,nfortunately. had he not existed, you're not talking about bill clinton. i don't know, i think i voted for bush. i respected perot. i think he hit something. had he not gone out and come back in, a lot of crazy things happened, i think he would've had a number that was substantial. mark: you said probably. you don't remember? donald trump: i don't like talking about who i voted for, in this case, bush. in 2004, do you remember who you supported? donald trump: bush. john: wife? w --hy? know. trump: i don't i became more conservative. who wasn't? bush was somebody that i was disappointed in. and 2004, i said iraq is a mistake. i am a person who believes strongly in the military. i believe that no one will mess with us. to do iraq was a terrible mistake in my opinion. the way we got out was a mistake. we should have kept the oil, these are things i say and people agree, some don't agree at all. i was very disappointed in him, but i voted for him. mark: you are going to stay right here. we

perot.[laughter] >> i won't mention donald trump. [laughter] >> and, no, i've heard nothing from -- i think at one point several years ago i heard a statement by jim webb saying, you know, he didn't have any problem with it as it was now laid out. as far as my impression is that the memorial has been totally embraced by the veterans, vietnam veterans community. i mean, judging by the fact that we have 50,000 motorcycles come for rolling thunder every memorial day and there continues to be, you know, tremendous public acceptance of the memorial, i think it's, i think it's served its purpose very well. >> i would echo that. >> all right, thank you. >> hi, bob. >> hello -- >> do you feel that the memorial really achieved its objectives? do we have further to go in terms of healing those wounds from the vietnam war in our society today? >> well, you know, now you're getting into, you're getting into as we say subjects above my pay grade, but i'll take a stab at it. >> go ahead. >> i mean, i thin

perot. >> i won't mention donald trump.aughter] >> i've heard nothing and i heard a statement from jim webb years ago and he said he didn't have any problem with it as it was now laid out. as far as my impression, it has been totally embraced by the vietnam veterans community. judging by the the fact that we have 50000 motorcycles come for rolling thunder every memorial day and there continues to be tremendous public acceptance of the memorial, i think it has served its purpose very well. >> i would would echo that. >> thank you. >> hello bob. do you feel the memorial really achieved its objectives? do we have further to go in terms of healing those wounds from the vietnam war in our society today? >> well, you know, now you are getting into, as we say, subjects above my pay grade, but i'll take a stab at it. i think we've done enough. the memorial has done as much as any memorial could do to heal the wounds of the vietnam war. i think one of the major healing elements is that the public embrace, has embraced the veterans f

perot spent $108 million inflation adjusted dollars remember he lost.hen there is election law. ohio for example has what is called a sore loser law. meaning a candidate who runs for a party's nomination and loses cannot then run as an independent in the general election. so officials there have already ruled. from is either a republican or he's off the ballot. all of that suggests if trump gives of on his hope of becoming the republican nominee and goes independent, he is almost ser tser -- certain to lose. but could be a factor shaping the election, pushing issues and deciding who wins. kate? >> he sure can. out front for us tonight. sal russo, political director for ross perot's historic third party presidential run. sal, thank you for coming in. you know third party runs. and you know donald trump. can he pull it off? >> i don't think so. i don't think he is going to attempt it. he is a smart businessman. the prospects for a third party are remote. i think he sees himself as leading the polls as a republican he is going to give it his best shot. if

over the ensuing three decades including buchanan, chuck hegel, judith martin, miss manners, ross perot, elizabeth taylor, john warner and web. a few passages. this starts off in april of 1979 and i attended the meeting called for the purpose of generating publicity for vietnam veterans's needs. suddenly the lone wolf it hadn't otherwise said a word stood up and threw out his idea. what about a memorial? in view of the discussion he came totally out of left field. what do you mean? someone said. i mean having a national memorial for vietnam veterans. vienna on veterans don't need a memorial, they need better benefits, a few others made joy similar remarks and some smirked while the man stood silently. no one spoke in support and i felt sorry for him. the idea didn't deserve contempt. after the man sat down i kept looking at him and thinking about his idea. some vietnam veterans truly needed more benefits, most didn't. what all did need is some recognition and acknowledgment of their service in the war. i hadn't faced combat and hadn't been injured but many had. i met some of the best pe

point about it's, you know, perot got 19%. and so people were willing to vote for him. >> and, john, people -- we actually have some people, you remember that, ross perot got 19% after quitting the race saying some crazy things like the black panthers were scaling the walls to try to disrupt his daughter's wedding. >> stockdale, who am i? why am i here? some bizarre things. you could actually go back and say if ross perot had kept it in the middle of the road, that 19% could have been 35% or 40%. i think you're right. i think ross perot is the correct analogy here. >> and so then to play the historical irony game, guess who is at the other town hall is a very buttoned down man named bush who's being bedevilled by this larger figure. >> oh, my lord. >> just compare the images, kacie hunt, yesterday what a day. what a day in new hampshire. >> it was, joe. those image that's you're talking about were exactly the thing that stood out the most. i was in the room for donald trump and this ruckus town hall. this atmosphere is unlike

the book, we did did not want to go through another weekend with the threat of an injunction by ross perot over our head.

george bush, bill clinton, ross perot? mr. trump: i actually liked ross perot a lot. thought he was great, but he went off the deep end. i will say this -- had he not existed, you are not talking about bill clinton. mark: did you vote for him? mr. trump: i don't know, i figure probably would've voted for bush. but i respect perot. i think he really hit something. had he not come out and gone back in, i think he would've had a number that was substantially better. john: you said probably, though. so you don't remember who you voted for? mr. trump: i do remember. i don't like to talk about who i voted for. in this case, i voted for bush. mark: what about 2004 versus the other bush? do you remember who you supported in that election? mr. trump: bush. mark: why? mr. trump: i was hoping he would do a good job. mark: what didn't you like about gore? mr. trump: i became more and more conservative. he was certainly more conservative, who wasn't, then gore. but bush was somebody i was very disappointed in. as you know, in 2003 and 2004 i said iraq was a mistake. i am a person

>> when bill clinton ran against poppy bush, remember ross perot was in the race. >> jimmy: poppy bush. >> he doesn't mind if i call him poppy. i named my dog after him. i have a dog named poppy. >> jimmy: i'm sure you do. that's great. >> he's more named after david ortiz, but we don't talk about him. [ light laughter ] but bill clinton ran against poppy bush, made w's dad a one time president and ross perot was in that race. >> jimmy: yeah. >> and everybody, like, sort of though maybe that ross perot was the reason bill clinton won. it's interesting, in that race he really took equally from the democrats and the republicans, because ross perot ran this campaign that was neither right wing nor left wing. donald trump is running a a totally right wing campaign so and so if he ran as an independent he would take a lot of votes away from the republican candidate and i think it would guarantee that the democrat would win it. guarantee it. jimmy: really? >> yeah. >> jimmy: and if he went republican and won for the republicans then they would owe him -- >> well, i f he -- [ laughter ] >> ji

ross perot, ross perot. you know the best thing about summer? summer pizza. and you know the best thing about summer pizza? it tastes light. it tastes fresh. and it's pizza. this summer, try our new grilled chicken margherita pizza. with roma tomatoes basil pesto sauce mozzarella and grilled, all-white meat chicken. all on our thin crust. get a large for only $12.00. and save room for dessert with our chocolate chip cookie for only $5.00 more. better ingredients. better pizza. papajohns.com. >>> certainly, i think going third party is a death wish. i don't think that's any secret at all. i don't see that happening. you win an election against hillary clinton unless you're running as a republican. donald trump gets that and so we do, too. i've had great conversations with him and that at each step of the way, he's getting more and more comfortable in his process. i'm just telling you my own personal opinion experience in working here with donald trump. i think things will be just fine. >> welcome back to "hardball." that's chairman of the republican national c

the second time around when ross perot ran. is some commonality there in the kind of characters they are. mark: tomorrow morning, our new national poll about the republican field comes out. we will see who is at the all-important top 10. it will be released at 6:00 a.m. tomorrow on bloomberg politics.com. we will have that for you tomorrow, and we will be back, right after this. ♪ john: 6:00 a.m. tomorrow, the big poll we have coming out on the republican field. here with us tomorrow, to run through all the results of the republican national poll about the presidential ticks of republicans. john's piece about joe biden, what is your bottom line about joe biden, whether he will run and what happens if he does? john: a little less and 50-50. as i said before, i don't think it's good for hillary clinton. joe biden is not very happy with the clintons right now. remember we are on twice a day. until tomorrow, sayonara. ♪ emily: twitter shares close at their lowest since their opening. does it make them an easy acquisition target? i'

i respected perot. i think he really had something. think he probably would've had a number substantially better. john: so you don't remember which of those three? mr. trump: i do remember. i don't like to talk about it. i voted for bush. mark: 2004 versus the other bush -- who did you support? mr. trump: bush. mark: why? mr. trump: i was hoping he would do a good job. choose bushd you over gore? mr. trump: i became more and more conservative. who wasn't? but bush was someone i was very disappointed in. in 2003 i said iraq is a mistake. i would have a very, very powerful, strong military. nobody would mess with us. but to do in iraq was a terrible mistake in my opinion. the way we got i was another mistake also. we should have kept the oil. but i was very disappointed with him. john: mr. trump, you will stay right here. we have two more questions -- there is more where that came from. we will be back after this word from our sponsors. ♪ mark: we are back with donald trump in trump tower -- thanks for hosting us. earlier today, jeb bush

the difference, i think, was that perot put together an actual campaign, he had people like ed rollins who had worked on national campaigns before. the trump thing, at least right now, is more of a media large. he goes from one tv interview to the next. he is coming into shows. he is putting up twitter assaults on his various opponents. k, at much more of a lar least at the moment. i think there are differences. we are in more of a celebrity culture now than we were in 1992. i think people tune in just to see what trump is going to say. i want to hear what he has to say about the border where our trade challenges. it is more like, what is this guy going to do next? charlie: anne joins us. thanks for doing this. anne: nice to be with you. charlie: after months of remaining above the partisan fray, quentin has started landing punches against public is the the most -- clinton has started landing punches against republicans. are saying they found her trustworthy. we talked about that here. is that, do you think, something she can overcome? anne: we are already seeing if not a derailment, c

i'm not equating perot with trump but perot was a businessman. his basic message was, i'm a businessman. i know how to run the country and how to give you straight talk. and this, trump is in that line. but now in the second decade of the 21st century, with so much coverage, so many channels, trump is just, he is taking the field by storm. the rest of the candidates, the rest of the candidates were sort of like, i don't know. bird dogs. they are restless and don't know what to do. and trump dominates. i'll say it again. i wouldn't under estimate. he is beginning to say to myself, i think i might be able to win this thing and that change the dimensions. >> and him taking all the coverage must feel like a disaster to all the other candidates. on the other hand. it is early yet. him taking all the coverage means they can make their mistakes right now. >> that is a good point. you notice he attacks jeb bush more than any other candidate. he thinks jeb bush has the staying power. jeb bush's campaign looks like something where the wheels are off and th

. >> we could be looking at maybe two all over again because perot was in the lead when he pulled out. >> if trump has a commanding lead who is most likely to peel off in the republican party? >> my point is perot was capturing everyone's imagination before he went crazy. >> he keeps threatening at the republican party doesn't treat them right he will go full perot which you were never supposed to go anything someone like rand paul would run as a libertarian. we don't even know them anymore. much more coming up a little later in a quick programming note to donald trump himself will be on in the flesh mornings with maria tomorrow at 7:00 a.m. eastern time on a foray in pacific. make sure you stick around in the panel will talk shortly about lady. first the judge on donald trump's immigration policy is kicking out millions of illegals does it violate the constitution? who will talk about that more with the judge coming up. technology empowers us to achieve more. it pushes us to go further. special olympics has almost five million athletes in 170 countries. the microsoft cloud allows us

and if i had my dream ticket, ross perot is still alive.he one spot and jeanine pirro in the second spot. so it can be perot and pirro get the country back to parro. >> i have to show you this from the university of alabama, a sorority. go. ♪ ♪ >> watters immediately joined that sorority. are you angry about that? >> everybody is angry about everything. so young girls who are pretty want to look pretty. young girls in the cave times wanted to look pretty in cave wall drawings. if they want to get off the hook, they ought to say they're a male fraternity and they're transitioning into becoming a female sorority as we speak. they'll end up on the cover of "vanity fair" magazine. if trump is listening, i want to be your press secretary. give me a call. >> oh, man, that's a great idea. have you out there introducing trump. >> i want to get in that press room. >> dennis miller, everybody. a quick reminder, with the sellout in charlotte, we have just five don't be a pinhead shows this fall. all brand new material because of the political situatio

surprise hit came from conservatives including powerful and influential individuals like billionaire ross perot and james webb was now a presidential candidate. pat buchanan, a tall wolf some congressmen or senators from the heritage fund asian for from the secretary of interior. they had envisioned the memorial in my opinion is the vehicle to justify the war and to celebrate heroism and glory they saw that competition designed as a betrayal. f first glance the negative perception may have been understandable after all in contrast with the washington monument to was black in it in the ground. second, it constituted a contemplation rather than an object or a building or any other monument of glory. it my view, the controversy over the design that almost sank the ship constituted a perfect store visit was intensified to tsa and touched unresolved fault lines in american society which was still present after the war including the question of the war itself was right or wrong or a question if it was ill-conceived from the outset or due to the activities of domestic power with the backstab also if t

i think in a higher level analysis, the effect of pero running-- perot, he was to defeat bush.is voters in the end split evenly, i think it had a corrosive effect. >> four million republicans voted for bill clinton. if they would have voted for bush, he would have been the president. charlie: the republicans had the attention last night. what do you make so far of the campaign? >> if we didn't have donald trump, the biggest story would be the decline of hillary clinton's candidacy. judge her from when she left the secretary of state's office to today, it has been a remarkable collapse. and all the negative news stories that have eroded her pularity are not going to go away. i don't sense any concern about her winning a nomination. if she bounces back, that's a good thing. if these stories continue to take a toll on her, it's a problem for the democrats. >> who knows what would happen if she was facing the kind of field these republicans are facing, but she's not. her biggest competitor is bernie sanders. i think what is interesting in our most recent cbs news poll when we asked

they remember, george bush senior, junior and jeb bush all remember perot and blame perot for their father'sah. gloria, we saw hillary clinton and jeb bush going at it on twitter last night over women's health funding. they seem more interested in attacking each other than going after any of their primary opponents. do they want to face each other in the general? is that part of it? they canceled the dynasty argument out for each other? >> first, always easier to attack somebody in the other party than to attack somebody who is in your own party. you know, while they're facing primary opponents. but i think, there is an interesting thing here about hillary clinton and jeb bush. they are dynastic candidates. very different kind of dynasties, anderson. hers is more of a boutique operation, stemming from her husband. and jeb bush is really from a serious dynastic political family. it will be more difficult i believe for him to look like change than it will for hillary clinton because she is a woman. so she can be married to bill clinton but just by virtue of her gender she looks different. and

now there is the ross perot parallel when ross perot made it to the home state of bill clinton and you have a bush, clinton, eccentric billionaire, it's telling me this. donald trump ran for president, donald trump ran for president in 2000, i think he wants the gig and believes he can win it. lou: chris stirewalt, as always, we thank you for your views and your time, and delighted to talk with you, have a great evening with the debate. i know you will. >> we'll do a good job for you, lou, thanks. i know you will. all the best. chris. >>> coming right back with much more on tonight's debate 9:00 p.m. eastern on the fox news channel. stay with us. much more straight ahead right here. >>> all the republican candidates get to show off their wears tonight. what's the winning strategy? civil discourse or a lot more aggressive approach? >>> and the guy who brought you the amazing jump from space has a new death defying stunt. close in, and much lower to the ground. when a moment spontaneously turns romantic, why pause to take a pill? and why stop what you're doing to find a bathroom? cialis

. >> reporter: in 1992, ross perot captured 19% of the vote.hat affected bill clinton's win. trump has made his thoughts clear. i think every single vote that went to ross perot came from bush. second, the money. obama, romney and their supporters spent close to a billion dollars in 2012 so trump without a party behind him might have to pony up close to a half billion. as a point of reference, perot spent $119 million inflation adjusted dollars and remember, he lost. there's this. republicans hold a go governor's chair in 31 states, both chambers of the legislature in 30 and they control the house and senate, which means they could throw up many legal roadblocks if trump goes rogue and goes independent. >> tom foreman, thank you so much. david gergig joins us to discuss. in order to compete in the south carolina primary, he needs to rule out a third-party run by september 30th. that's the hard deadline. could he win the nomination without competing in south carolina? >> he could. he could. but it would slow him down, especially if there's other

ross perot almost could have within that race.d rollins, republican guru, rollins quit after two months. and did it in the same classy way roger stone has the. but anderson, when you are one of the strategists, political consultants, riding a horse. jockey on a horse. some horses are run away, you can't stay in the saddle. >> i mate say what they are, if they're narcissist, they're all yuge. >> yuge. exactly. david gergen. drew pinsky. update on breaking news. state of emergency in ferguson, missouri. after new violence, protesters taking to the streets still demanding changes a year after michael brown's death. after a scathing report from the justice department months ago the police and city have not made some crucial changes ahead tonight. imagine - she won't have to remember passwords. or obsess about security. she'll log in with her smile. he'll have his very own personal assistant. and this guy won't just surf the web. he'll touch it. scribble on it. and share it. because these kids will grow up with windows 10. get started

the difference, i think, is that perot was somebody who put together an actual campaign. recall he had people like ed rawlings, others who worked on national campaigns before. for trump, right now, he's more of a media lark. he goes from one tv interview to the next, calls into shows, putting out twitter assaults on his various opponents. it's sort of much more of a sort of lark, at least at the moment, charlie. so i think there are differences. frankly, we're in more of a celebrity culture than we were in '92, and i think people tune in to see what trump is going to say. it's less, well, i want to hear what he has to say about the bored around our trade challenges. it's more of what is this guy going to do next? >> rose: anne gearan from the "new york times" joins us. thank you for doing is this. >> hi, nice to be with you, charlie. >> rose: "after months of remaining largely above the partisan fray and appearing caution to the fault, hillary clinton has taken risks. clinton suffered erosion in her public image with more potential voters saying they view her unfavorable

those kind of ross perot style voters. the first question a lot of these people ask when they come to the trump bus is, what is a caucus? they're not even participating in previous cycles. >> this is trump from earlier, this is part of the shtick here too, with the kind of insult comic shtick. this is him on the mayor of boston, marty loft. take a listen. >> on a lighter note, boston mayor marty walsh has challenged you to take the ice bucket challenge. >> he's a clown, marty walsh. i don't even know who he is. he spends all this time and effort and money on an olympic bid and then goes out and is talking about an ice bucket challenge. get a real mayor. >> dave, i love the fact he's like, i don't know who this guy is, and proceeds to show, of course he knows who he is and exactly what he's doing. >> also, trump has done the ice bucket challenge. i know this because i watched the video in which for some reason trump bottles of water are added to the ice bucket, even though that is water in a different form than ice. you kno

that's the greatest analog in my memory between donald trump and ross perot.hese are phenomenon. >> part of the phenomenon is people were dissatisfied with bush, a high disapproval rating and people are dissatisfied with both parties. i think they're looking for some alternative. the tea party, elected republican congress and they're very unhappy with what's happened with the leadership in the congress. and to a certain extent he's tapping into the unhappiness in america. lou: is he likely a catalyst to reform the republican party or is that implausible? >> i think it's implausible, the republican party is an establishment party, there's no old bosses that make it happen anymore. my sense is they'll do everything they can after a period of time to stop him state by state, county-by-county and may not do so. lou: that may blow up in their face? >> could easily blow up in their face. lou: hillary clinton has got to be excited to hear you say that. >> we know how important hispanic voters are to us long-term. if we're going to be any party, and i think the immigr

a couple of reasons, 11 is ross perot, ross perot comes in and takes some of the vote two thirds which should have been bushes. he spends a fortune pounding bush on television without ever commenting on bill clinton. but the second two reasons are even more interesting than that, they are sort of historic. the first is that since 1952, 1952 when eisenhower took office no party has held control of the white house for more than eight years except once and that's when bush succeeded reagan. so, if you will the pendulum of a history wanting to swing the other direction had built up a lot of pressure to go back and toward the democrats. the second reason is a very interesting one it's what i call the churchill effect. if you remember winston churchill, by his personality and leadership had led england during world war ii to hold itself together and to defeat with the help of the u.s., to defeat nazi germany. he is the hero of world war ii to the brits, yet before the war is finally over they hold an election and the brits vote churchill out. now in terms of what we're talking about at the e

ross perot had no alignment within a party. cannot build majority coalitions within their own party, they are not going to be able to do it at the national level outside of their own party as well. basically the reason those two might go independent because they cannot get their majority coalition internally. that is not a good first step. host: republican line, this is john. caller: thank you for c-span. very interesting. college -- the electron or a call is in the states that all of the winner, when you come up with your polls, do you wait these states differently? and also, does this not say some having a president who represents everybody? i want to know what you think about a popular vote as opposed to the electoral college. , atas it not also speak least to some extent, of having possibly ending up with the republican president and a democratic vice president? be thrown out. for college is the thing i'm most interested in. would we dry sample, we draw based on what the population is. what that distribution is roam the cou

ross perot, the forgotten people out there. the silent majority. they're not a majority really but there's enough of them to give trump enough votes. i think this whole cast of characters of the republican party, four of them will get out of new hampshire. it will be weeded down in florida and super tuesday will probably give us an nominee. donald trump demands the time and he gets it. >> when you as a person of color hear silent majority, i'll give him the benefit of doubt, do you hear something different? >> i hear something completely different. on this coupled with all of the bertherism comments he made about president obama early on in his presidency, i'm absolutely unwilling to give him the benefit of the doubt. if you go back and look at the history of the the way richard nixon used the term silent ma jurorty, the intent by everyone ever analyzed that speech that the intent was to galvanize white people who were angry. this is no different than ronald reagan using the term states rights and taking the country back when he announced his presi

with ross perot, there was this whole notion of running the government as a business. people love this idea of trump because he can be either the guy who takes the nomination and the bull in the china shop, or becomes a third-party candidate like ross perot. those two scenarios both delight liberal journalists. host: what do you make of barb's sentiment is that there is this antiestablishment, and in that, against the established media. it is not just what is happening in congress or the white house. it is skepticism and cynicism towards the mainstream media. guest: the media has a lot of power. one of the reasons we do what we do is starting with john kennedy, television became a big factor in who becomes president. now, we are at a point where the media seems to want to say who the president will be, but when they become president, the issues are too boring. i don't expect there will be too much heavy coverage of the epa regulations. this is not the kind of story they like to do. they would rather have, what did trump say about megyn kelly's time of the month. to som

much like ross perot did in the '90s. in fact, go back to george wallace when he took votes away from democrats. i think trump has some staying power here and he's got the money to stay in and the rest of them can't find oxygen. >> michelle bernard, does he have enough saying power to ultimately capture the gop nomination? >> i don't think he has enough staying power to ultimately capture the gop nomination, but he has enough staying power to continue to do a lot of damage, at least some people would say damage, other people would say that what is happening within the republican party because of donald trump is a good thing. and what we're seeing is donald trump quite frankly might be the product of a republican party that didn't the electorate. and thought when voted in repeatedly their constituency wanted republicans to come into office and basically be in charge of making sure nothing happened during the presidency of barack obama. and so many republicans are saying, we are tired of you promising this and this and this

then there are people who have a different point of view on that and they think ross perot kept towardsush from winning the presidency. there is some dispute on that. i accept that that data is accurate. i do think, in a higher-level analysis, the effect of growth throughout the campaign was debilitating to bush -- perot throughout the campaign was debilitating to bush. i think he had a corrosive effect on the bush presidency. ed: 4 million republicans voted for clinton. if they had voted for bush, he would have been the president. what do you make of the campaign so far? have trumpdid not around, the biggest story of the summer would be the decline of hillary clinton's candidacy. to judge her from when she left the secretary of state's office till now, it has been a collapse of report -- support and all of the negative news stories that have eroded her popularity will not go away for a long time. she still has a huge lock on the democratic party. sense any concern about her winning the nomination at all. bad thing. and a if she bounces back, that's a good thing, but if she continues to

i think if you want to give donald trump a true comparison, et he's like ross perot, a billionaire with interesting ideas tapping into what we call the third party energy of the united states. but trump at least had -- perot at least had pie charts and was trying to explain in the a real way whereas fareed points out trump wings it. so there hasn't been anybody like donald trump because he's a genius at brand building and very media savvy in his own way, not a traditional way but in the new social media world. i think if the republican party sees him as a danger, a rat snake, a poison toad they have to get rid of somehow because he very well may lurch into a third party run if they don't treat him with respect. >> what would it mean, fareed, to think of a donald trump in charge of being the liaison between the u.s. and other countries? >> i think would be so many problems that foreign policy would be the least of our concerns. look, part of what we're trying to figure south is this all an act? does he recognize that he's tapping into a certain kind of anger that is so frustrated with th

and it is a phenomenon in politicize have not seen since ross perot.. >> you know, you are right. i always say if anybody is running for president, for office. i always take them seriously. always taken donald trump seriously. i think people have underestimated him. did you watch the interview earlier, the fund raiser to night? what did you think? >> i watched it. i was just stunned. look the -- trump is getting money. forget this thing for a second. who ever that dude that sells cars. the fact of the matter its that trump is getting money from blue-collar workers who send him checks for $250. why? who is donald trump. it's not who he is, it's who he isn't. not what he is for, what he is against. that is everything washington is doing. and he defies gravity in politics. because there is this group of people in the republican party who are so tired of the republican establishment. trump has gotten into that. like perot did. like george wallace in the 60s and 70s when he split up the democratic party. trump is going to be around a while >> don't you thin

say nader and perot, though, were in party primaries, right? they weren't doing this two-step. how early, in your view, would trump have to start doing things as opposed to just claiming the leverage? >> well, if he's serious that he really wants to keep the independent route open, if i were him, i would not file in the presidential primaries of ohio or texas or south dakota. but we have precedence that the sore loser laws don't pertain to presidential primaries, and the reason is a sore loser law says if you are defeated in the primary, you can't run outside the major parties in november. the trouble with that theory is no person has defeated a republican or democratic presidential nomination in any one state's primary. presidential primaries are different. the national conventions decide who wins the nomination. that's why until 2012 no third party candidate in the entire history of the country had ever been kept off the general election ballot because he or she had run in a presidential primary after major party and there's been 12 people in

>> there's a lot of perot but perot was folksy.no, flashiflash ing lights wherever he goes. what is similar is the ability to say, i'm not a puppet. i have my own money. i'm not a beggar. i don't have to go asking. i don't owe anybody anything. i think ross perot did not run a sophisticated campaign. if you recall, chris, he entered the race, pulled out, got back in. thus far, trump isn't making lot of mistakes. i thought, personally, he made a lot of mistakes out of the gate with kelly and john mccain. i was proven wrong. he's riding tidal wave of sentiment right now. >> from the impact of negativity to a true need for perspective on a positive, president carter, he is fighting a fight that is as dire as was first expected. the way he is presented himself seems so strong and a window into what this man is really about. >> this is quintessential jimmy carter. he wants to be a teacher, help us. when it comes to medicine, carter is on top of it all. the carter center has been weighing in on public health issues, trying to eradicate d

trump is financially independent and therefore he is the only one i can name -- kind of like ross perotwill stand up to the entrenched interests. he doesn't need super pacs or billionaires to finance him because he is a billionaire. >> i was reading a jeff toobin article that he wrote about you in the new yorker in 2008, donald trump was quoted in that article calling you a stone cold lo loser. >> he then hired you again. >> we had a falling out over a fellow who i believed was corrupt. i would remind you he took a prostitute across five state lines which a new york state supreme court judge has just gotten to out of jail for. we had a brief falling out regarding spitser and my acting to remove him from public life. >> you were willing to overlook that. >> we reconciled and i remain a trump supporter. >> how do you see this playing out? he hasn't ruled out a third party challenge. >> let's review what he said on the stump. at least three of the major candidates according to the new york times were in discussions to boycott the fox debate if he was taking part of it. if he is treated fai

clearly he finds the campaign has gone off track it reminds me so much of what happened with ross perot he was running this renegade third party option against clinton. remember this? it was the last time someone ran against a clinton back in 1992, and ed rollins and pam jurgen came in there, a major republican a major democratic campaign strategist, and within two months, ed rollins resigned, and in a similarly classy way i might say, it hurt perot, it gave people pause, you can't keep ed rollins and he finds you're running the campaign something that's amiss here, there's something wrong with the candidate and the people around you. i do think that this roger stone thing was -- it's -- people like roger stone are hired like jockeys to run a really good horse. and the problem for roger stone or ed rollins, you have i arunaway horse, it's hard to stay in the saddle. that really speaks to the temperament of the candidate and why that person can be very susceptible and not win at politics. >> who will replace stone. stone says he doesn't know and he tells me he's not going back. david ger