dave thompson and i at orbital formed a company called orbital energy corporation and we really pioneered the commercialization of high resolution imagery from space that you see now and what peterand others referred to as the google earth and other things. that's where policy can really be important in marshalling the resources of the government to helping the private sector capitalize on the entrepreneurship and the technology that's sitting out there 'cause the government cannot do it all itself. so we have to rely more and more on creativity and capturing the genius that this country has in meeting some of these goals for the future. >> i'd certainly echo that. i think what the fundamental problem has been trying to do the same thing for too long. because space programs are hard, because they're expensive and we had success early on because we went from nothing and landing on the moon and coming back, 12 years, you know, by contrast operated the space shuttle and done the space shuttle since the mid-'70s, first launch in '81, 30 years, it's a remarkable achievement but it doesn't allow for dynamic growth or change or a learning curve where, you know, new folks come in. they