. >> ambassador hunter, two strong examples mentioned there by peter van buren. iraq in utter chaos right now. libya was supposed to be strategic. how did that turn out? some superpower. >> let's start with libya. the europeans have more at stake in libya than we do, particularly with the most -- biggest challenge right now in europe and a foreign policy and domestic area is immigration coming from north africa and elsewhere. they dropped the ball. we also i think dropped the ball by not doing what we should have done to help the libyans themselves do things after the toppling of ghadafi. people walked away from that. that's different from what peter is saying. we should try to go into a society and rebuild it. the whole idea that we can come in and help countries that are very different from us without understanding them, rebuilding them like in afghanistan and iraq where we've spent something like $3 trillion lost a lot of lives. there are some things we can't do. that doesn't mean we are not still a great power in the world, able to protect what is necessary f