>> i most admired phil graham, there are voice whose say this is not possible.hillary care was being debated. and there were a lot of people that came forward that said we'll partially fund hillary light. phil graham said, i know you will remember this, he said this will pass over my cold, dead political body. and a whole lot of republicans who were scared, they looked over, he was not killed. they ran behind him and they said yeah, yeah, what he said. look, the power of leadership can change debates. we saw that just a month ago with syria. when president obama said he was going to launch attacks on syria, you had leaders of both house support him. and then the american people spoke up in overwhelming numbers saying we don't want to get involved in a sectarian war in syria, where there is no clear reason for the united states to do so and what happened, the federal government turned. we didn't get involved. we didn't launch the attacks, and just weeks earlier conventional wisdom in washington said it is impossible. >> do you regret comparing the future of obama

. >> neil: i talked to former texas senator phil graham, and one of the things he has been echoing to me is, i like what ted cruz is doing, what sarah palin is saying. there are better ways to gets the same result. that is, if you're going nowhere with the math, as he sees it, trying to defun obamacare. you might have a far better shot at delaying it. that's why be puts more credence in attaching a delay in obamacare to raising the debt ceiling. >> tell the soldiers that who had to storm the beaches. on omaha beach. those who have fought physically and in a political arena for the sovereignty of america and for our economic liberty, and our national security, tell them, oh, wait another day and perhaps the battle will get easier tomorrow. no. again, that's waving the white flag, and time is short before our country is fundamentally transformed. exactly as barack obama had promised. he also promises things like energy costs necessarily skyrocketing under him. promises there we be bankrupt coal plants if they dare start up. all those things he promised we see, not to change the subject,

and then phil graham strode out there and he said, and i know you'll remember this.d political body. >> ooh, texas senator at the scene cruz harkening back to the good ole days when his party was able to block universal health care. the only problem with cruz's argument, of course, is that his side has lost the health care battle and the only dead body we're going to see is the house continuing resolution when it arrives tomorrow on the senate floor. but speaking of the '90s, not only did republicans block universal health care, they also did shut down the government. back then something senator ted cruz remembered fondly earlier this summer. >> the great many republicans who were hunted by the ghost of shutdowns past. it is received wisdom in washington that the 1995 government shutdown was a terrible loss for republicans and we should never go there again. i don't believe the evidence supports that conclusion. >> now, senator cruz may not care about the political con kwenss his party suffered in the 1995 government shutdown, but you'd think that he and the cuckoo c

when phil graham said that it was fairly loanly. he didn't have a whole lot of allies when he marched out and did that. as you know, because you were port of thapart of that fight ae scars, but that leadership ended up -- you saw republicans kind of look all around. gramm was standing there and he didn't get killed. and they all essentially ran behind him and said, yeah, what he said. but i'm convinced if we hadn't had a handful of leaders back then who had the courage to not read the papers and believe, oh, we've got to concede; the papers say they've already won, we're going to hillary care -- if we hadn't had just a handful of leaders willing to buck the conventional whic wisdom and sae can win when they're being told, no, you can't, obamacare would have passed 19 years earlier and it would have been called hillary care instead. that's the power of leadership. so everyone in this body who said two months ago and says this morning, we can't win this fight, i will point out that history is replete with example after example after e