so my binding memory of the university of pennsylvania is being introduced to philip roth and he had these people like norman mailer and other people who would come through the class and that was just fantastic. >> rose: you make your way to "time" magazine. >> yes. >> rose: and you write about steve jobs. >> actually before that, i did write about steve jobs. before that i went to detroit, for a year of battle hardening in 1979 as the automobile industry was collapsing. and it was-- and that was where, actually, i co-authored a book about the chrysler corporation and lee iacocca who was this larger-than-life figure who obviously was a house hold name 25, 30 years ago. and that was my introduction to mainstream journalism. and then i moved to california. first to los angeles. and where i found myself gravitating to northern california to do stories about all these little companies that nobody had heard of, you know, genentech was private. apple was just about public. microsoft was still private company. and i started writing about them and gradually got more interested. and then even

more about this bill is and how it benefits organized labor is the bill's sponsor state senator philip roth author of the book the acts president senator birth walking to the program. good to be with you tom it's been a long time i've been listening to you both thank you it's great to great to meet you great to see it to begin with what is your bill do. this was a bill that was designed to bring all the communities in the state under the same regime which is to say. everyone who receives benefits from collective bargaining would pay a sheer of the costs to do that bargaining the way we had it for the last fifteen years was that some groups were grandfathered enjoy the benefits without paying any of the costs and then other groups had a bigger share proposal in their collective bargaining agreements other groups didn't so this was designed to level the playing field for everyone and to make sure that there was equity in all the corners of the state is that when you say grandfather do you mean preen one hundred thirty five wagner act national labor relations act or are you talking about a tim