boone pickens.pickens plan only call for reducing dependence on foreign oil. >> well, it's really even narrower than that. i want to get off mideast oil. i want to get off opec oil. because i think it's a security issue for the country. but you know, it's exactly what the president said. when he got the nomination at denver in july of '08, on energy, he said in ten years, we will not import any oil from the mideast. and i cheered him for that when he said it. and that's the oil we have to get off of first. >> larry: okay. all right. mr. predictor, who has been right, take me ahead 20 years. it's 2030. how much dependence on oil from the middle east? >> according to what the leadership wants. >> larry: what do you think? >> i think we've got to go to our own resources. and we have resources to go to. >> larry: nothing from there then? >> i'll take out the opec first. the oil from canada and mexico is fine with me. but north america is okay. but i just as soon get rid of the rest of it. >> larry: natu

pickens what they're used needles for sterile ones. -- they can swap their start use needles for sterile ones. critics say moving the service away from the city center puts their success in jeopardy. >> i think the program will still be used. if it is not, we will act immediately. it is our main task. >> but others who work with drug addicts are less optimistic. fewer needles are being exchanged since the authorities say it used to be 8000 per day. now it 6000. >> this will boost hiv infections. the dramatic fall in the number of exchanged n ndles wilt ultimately kill people. >> the fact is many attic still exchange needles in vain. >> don't be surprised if results is needles lying around in parks and other places in vienna, or addicts sharing needles or using the same needle several times. is disgusting this is happening -- is discussed in this is happening. >> the subway station may be cleaner, but if the number of hiv infection climbs as a result, it is a high price to pay. >>> that wraps up "the journal." thank you for joining us. captioned by the national captioning institute --www.

pickens is one again attempting to get subsidies -- and these are subsidies -- not tax provisions butrect subsidies -- for conversion of diesel powered trucks that move goods across the country very efficiently, and convert those to natural gas by saying that -- we nacelles off of foreign crude oil. unfortunately again this is one of the things that the american taxpayer -- and i believe he was asking for something like $65,000 per trucker as a subsidy so they can go out and get a new truck -- that would cost more than that, to use natural gas. this is, in our opinion, fraught with both technical and economic consequences. host: would that hurt the refinery industry? guest: well, we sell a lot of diesel to trucks. but the problem is, not to worry about it hurting the refining industry but what will it do to the american consumer? what is that going to do for the taxpayer? what is it going to do to the cost of goods and services? is it efficient, is an affordable and reliable? yes, natural gas is reliable. no question about that. but is its best intended use in the engine of a semi? it

boone pickens' stock about -- talks about is for use in vehicles.here is a sense here that if we do this massive expansion of gas drilling that we will see some environmental contamination. that question is front and center in the ongoing epa study. host: in this article in wednesday's talks the "usa today." towards the end he writes this would be obama's best chance to enact anything close to a comprehensive energy legislation if the midterm elections fall into historic patterns. after president clinton failed to pass the health care bill in 1994, it took 16 years to get it done. if this does not pass and there are major gains in the house and senate on the republican side, could we see a 16 year gap between now and when they pass any sort of major energy legislation? guest: yes and no. but it depends the question is about energy or climate. energy bills come around under both parties every the years. it is not the end of energy legislation, i do not think. whether or not we will do anything that specifically mandates reductions in greenhouse gases

pickens is one again attempting to get subsidies -- and these are subsidies -- not tax provisions but direct subsidies -- for conversion of diesel powered trucks that move goods across the country very efficiently, and convert those to natural gas by saying that -- we nacelles off of foreign crude oil. unfortunately again this is one of the things that the american taxpayer -- and i believe he was asking for something like $65,000 per trucker as a subsidy so they can go out and get a new truck -- that would cost more than that, to use natural gas. this is, in our opinion, fraught with both technical and economic consequences. host: would that hurt the refinery industry? guest: well, we sell a lot of diesel to trucks. but the problem is, not to worry about it hurting the refining industry but what will it do to the american consumer? what is that going to do for the taxpayer? what is it going to do to the cost of goods and services? is it efficient, is an affordable and reliable? yes, natural gas is reliable. no question about that. but is its best intended use in the engine of a semi?