ramesh: well, i mean, i think the u.s.antee has been something that europeans have relied on. and, unfortunately, that has led them to underinvest in their own defense. i understand the impulse among a lot of americans to get the u.s. to -- and europe to rebalance these commitments. what i don't see from the never really seen from trump is any acknowledgement that nato is the most successful alliance in history and that it still serves an important role in keeping the peace in europe and around the globe. geoff: in the time that remains, let's talk about gavin newsom, shall we? because the california governor, he's broken with many elected democrats by saying he thinks it's deeply unfair to allow transgender women and girls to compete in female sports. take a listen to what he said in this podcast. charlie kirk, founder, turning point usa: would you say no men in female sports? gov. gavin newsom (d-ca): well, i think it's an issue of fairness. i completely agree with you on that. it is an issue of fairness. it's deeply unf

david and ramesh, great to have you both. also, an update on tonight. speaking of elon musk, we are seeing another spacex launch failure that we're closely monitoring this evening because get a look at this. the faa has lifted a ground stop that had stopped all flights going into several airports in florida because of falling space debris. for what you saw here, that space debris is the starship spacecraft, which exploded during its eighth test flight. that happened this evening. it's an uncrewed mission, but it lifted off a few hours ago from texas. spacex then lost contact with it a few minutes into the flight. you can see here this is it. flying over the bahamas before it appears to explode. now, the faa says this evening that spacex has to conduct a mishap investigation after the loss of that starship aircraft, which musk says will one day, hopefully, in his view, take people to mars. we'll continue to update you on that and that investigation. up next, what we are hearing from the white house on tariffs backtracking. again, there's an update from w