you have written about adam clayton powell, sammy davis junior, sugar ray robinson. how does that fit into the pantheon of great african-americans about whom you've written? where does thurgood fit? >> i think my books are about american and african-american history. they're told to re -- they're told through a lens, and all these people are rebels,, for freedom. and that the good angle to shape your writings around. it's drama. these are great stories. marshall -- of that group marshall was the supreme figure. no doubt about it. but you could see eye-to-eye with adam clayton powell, surgery way robinson, mr. allen, the butler, and powell. i think it's best summed up like this. on the day marshall was nominated, he was in the white house and there were three african-american butlers serving tea and refreshments. one of those butlers was eugene allen. mr. allen lived and worked -- lived sometimes, slept overnight a lot, at 1600 pennsylvania avenue. the most powerful address in the world, and the '50s, muc of the '60s, we could go back to his native virginia and couldn