we had james baker and richard gephardt before the joint committee on taxation. they both said you have a better chance of getting the fundamental tax reform you want if it is revenue-neutral. >> would a tax increase the call for? >> no. >> the president took some hard swipes at paul ryan's plans. you are taking swipes at him wanting to raise taxes. we talk to alan simpson briefly after the speech and he said to pray for the gang of six. [laughter] i know you had a lot of issues with balsam cent. that was the senator simpson statement. is he right? >> i pray for many of my colleagues. [laughter] -- the deficit is the symptom and spending is the disease. the president talked about shared sacrifice. the problem is on the spending side. we know that in the postwar era, revenues have averaged 18.5% of gdp. they have been temporarily down through the recession which has been exacerbated by the president's policies. in all the models, revenue comes back and marginally increases beyond that point. spending goes from its historic 20% of gdp to 40% over the next generatio

but james baker and richard gephardt, before the joint committee on taxation, they both said you have a much better chance of getting the fundamental tax reform if it is revenue-neutral. >> the president took some hard swipes at the rye and plan i've talked with senator simpson after the speech. his statement was "pray for the gang of six." [laughter] i know you had a lot of issues, but that was senator simpson's statement. is he right? is the only solution here is to pray for the gang of six? >> i pray for many of my colleagues. [laughter] here is my point. again, the deficit is the symptom. spending is the disease. the president talks about shared sacrifice. the problem is on the spending side. we know that in a post-war. , revenue averaged 18.5% of gdp. they have recently been done because of the recession. we believe it is exasperated because of the president's policy. revenue comes back and largely increases beyond that point. it is spending that goes from its historic 20% of gdp to 40% over the next generation. you have to double taxes on the next generation, crush the economy,