joining us now is rick wilson, a co—founder of the lincoln project — a political action group set upformer republicans to oppose the re—election of donald trump. thank you very much for your time here on newsday on the bbc. now we don't yet know what the tangible repercussions of all of this will be, but do explain why testimonies like the one we saw this time are very crucial. i like the one we saw this time are very crucial-— very crucial. i think it's vital that the _ very crucial. i think it's vital that the testimony - very crucial. i think it's vital that the testimony today i very crucial. i think it's vitalj that the testimony today be very crucial. i think it's vital - that the testimony today be seen in the context for what it means about where the republican party stands in this moment. there are very, very few mike bowers or brad raffensperger�*s in the republican party today. men who would stand up to donald trump and say, of no, i will not cheat, i will not give you the selection, i'll not violate my oath of office or the constitution, or violate state and federal law t

melissa murray, joan walsh and rick wilson. joan, all start with you. this idea of the heel, the rule breaking villain everybody loves to hate. trump and pence aides seems to be making john eastman the heel here. and your latest piece, all these insiders who told eastman that he was crazy, proposing an illegal scheme sanctioning violence, where were their voices in the lead up to january the 6th? why weren't they sounding the alarm publicly, saying, hey, this is happening behind the scenes, we've got some bat crazy people in here trying to get the president to carry out a coup. >> well, yeah, john eastman is donald trump with a law degree. he's a pathological liar. he literally reminds me -- had a character on saturday night live in the 80s -- [inaudible] one line after another, oh, that's the ticket. that's what eastman sounded like. they were indulging him and he would come back, day after, day and contradict himself in, say oh, no, we shouldn't do this. yeah, that's a risky. we actually should do that, yeah, that's the ticket. but, you know, yeah. i

i agree with my colleague, rick wilson, on this.ause he's actually on tape and you hear his voice. and you hear that he was defied at that point there, they're telling him no basically. and donald trump doesn't take too kindly to that. he didn't get his way. but there's really no disputing what he said and who he said it to. what he was asking for. he can't be us is way out of that one. although he has tried, as we've seen. i agree with rick in that this is the most difficult for trump and his minions to defend. because he's right there as glenn was talking about, you just press play and you hear it all right there. they say the quiet part out loud which they seem to be doing more and more often. which to the horror of those of us who are watching, the details of january six in the lead up to it. as we watch that unfold. a lot of this reporting was very interesting because. at the time contemporaneously but now we're seeing from the jammer six hearing that a lot of that reporting was correct. -- supporters. they have an awfully quie

rick wilson, a co—founder of the lincoln project — a political action group to oppose the re—elections the testimonies on tuesday form a body of evidence for a conspiracy to subvert the election results. i think it's vital that the testimony today be seen in context for what it means about where the republican party stands in this moment. there are very, very few mike bowers or brad raffenspergers in the republican party today — men who would stand up to donald trump and say, "no, i will not cheat, i will not give you this election, i will not violate my oath of office or the constitution, or violate state and federal law to illegally pretend that you won this election and declare that to be the case." but it also gave you a window into the kind of intimidation and threats, and the violence that are inherent in the maga—trump republican movement today against everyone — from the individuals themselves in high office to folks like shay and ruby, who were revealed to have been intimidated and threatened. these were people who you would never have heard their names, you would've never kn

state democratic party, kyle cheney is with us, the senior legal affairs reporter at politico and rick wilson republican strategist and cofounder of the lincoln project is also here. welcome all. let's get into all of the shortly, because this power packed panel who can unpack this. but, that's, you first because you heard -- and i do think the fact that it strikes me that the committee must effectively demonstrate to the american people that the assault in our democracy really didn't and on january 6th, because again, as i said, the people at the capitol went and -- do you agree? >> i absolutely, agree and that is one of the reasons i don't call it the big lie. i call it the big criminal conspiracy. you and i have been on campaigns, we understand the infrastructure that needed to move people to put talking points into folks mouths, and you can have members of congress of trump enablers, candidates for office that are talking, and using the same talking points that are -- the same ideas suggest to me there are much larger concerns involved that is moving financial resources and other types of