pete: rob smith saved my credit card last night.pete: still had. it has been two years since a teenage girl participated in pfizer's vaccine trial, and today, her mother joins us in the next hour. so you only pay for what you need. contestants ready? go! only pay for what you need. jingle: liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. after advil. let's dive in. but, what about your back? it's fine. before advil. advil, dual action bites, pain, two ways. advil targets pain at the source. acetaminophen blocks, pain signals, advil, dual action. ever get a sign the universe is trying to tell you something? the clues are all around us! not that one. that's the one. at university of phoenix, you could earn your master's degree in less than a year for under $11k. learn more at phoenix.edu. in one second, sara yes! will get a job offer somewhere sunnier. relocating in weeks. weeks? yeah, weeks. gotta sell the house. don't worry, sell to opendoor, and move on your schedule. yes! request a cash offer at opendoor.com if you have copd, ask your doctor a

rob smith joins me now. this is going to be a complete hostile takeover of the new school.omplete reversal from progressive to conservative. you've got a smile on your face. do you approve? >> absolutely. when you look at what is going on this is another example of governor ron desantis playing offense. he played offense when it came to covid policies, he played offense when it comes to weaning woke stuff out of k-12 educational system and he is doing it with the college and university system. conservatives buried their heads in the sand over the last 30 to 40 years and ignored the college and university system which allowed liberals and radical leftists to take over this entire system to promote their agenda. the craziest thing to me is conservative and republican parents would shell out tens of thousands of dollars to these institutions to send their children to be indoctrinated and this is a good first step at conservatives taking back some of that. and so when you look at people who were on this board like chris rufo who was a conservative, a well respected academic who

joining me here at the table rob smith. great to see you both. what do you make of this?> that that argument biden is in a hard position look at the past two administrations one he was the vice president obama and trump negotiated with the other side so the american people as the congressman pointed out to agree with the democrats senator manchin pointed out as well. people have budgets everyone is responsible republican or democrat and everyone wants people to get the job done and the president needs to negotiate. >> this is interesting because look at the amount of spending that happens to say the spending is for the greater good in helping out all americans senator rand paul puts out the sexual report listen to a couple of these one.$1 million for the starbucks espresso machine at the pentagon. $9million for construction action of a park in austin texas. was wasteful spending keeps getting worse and these are not necessarily making the lives of the average americans better and the institution for me to take out whole departments because they generate. switching to a to

steve: are closer tonight is rob smith i want to talk about the political implication of the documentn though she might expected to be an apologist is the political director. >> i have heard a lot of democrats have said wait on joe biden and let's see how this plays out this is where he considers to launch the campaign for president and more say look at the political fallout and who is responsible and then to lose control of the presidency we're going into a lot of uncomfortable weeks for the white house of them potentially to be the most vulnerable. steve: then listening to donna on the same show. >> was it sloppy that there was one document if there is a drip then you have something else going on. steve: what could she mean? >> she's been doing this for a long time so she says something like that i think she probably has some knowledge that isn't public knowledge yet. that's what i think is going on but the question i would ask the democrats if not joe biden then who? kamala harris if she was at the top of the ticket she would win california and new york then it would be a bloodbath

does rob herr or jack smith coordinate on the law and whether or not each one of the folks should beed and president biden has the department of justice policy that you can't indict a sitting president and he has a statute of limitations that's probably currently running and may expire when he's president. stuart: could this turn out to be a tempest in a teapot, much to do about nothing? >> i don't spend a lot of time in washington dc but when i do i realize reality surrounds it but there's no reality in washington dc. it is all politics all the time, and it is a sport played with blunt strums and obviously this is a -- instruments and this is a way to bash each other leading candidate heading into 2024 and try to weaken them up and losen them from their base. stuart: it's quite possible the public voters are get tired of investigation after invest after invest. investigation fatigue could settle upon us. >> everywhere i go that's not washington dc, there's a serious concern that there was a two-tiered system of justice where donald trump and his associates are always investigated an

for jack smith and rob her, they are conducting independent investigations. they will go in effect the -- week the recommendation based on what they find so i don't anticipate the existence of two special counsel's is going to influence the way either one of them goes about their drop. >> and new tonight, sources tell nbc news that biden has grown frustrated with the ongoing backlash to his documents controversy. the president is particularly annoyed about what he views as probable subpoenas by the a.i.d.s. responsible for packing up those items. and now, to impart to how his administration has responded, biden fears that republicans will conflate his case with trump's. there is an argument to say that has already begun. let's begin by sunday night panel, -- host of crooked medias what a day podcast. susan del percio is a republican strategist and msnbc political analyst and also danny cevallos, he is an and msnbc legal analyst. great value three wish us on the show. danielle, start with you. some fear that the special counsel jim jackson's disappointment wil

there could be more, but right now it doesn't fit within the purview of what jack smith has or rob hur. but you can imagine that with this reporting that merrick garland will be curious, and there is a good chance they don't know already. john durham would have had to have told them about this and laid out all the facts. maybe he did. but if he didn't, they will look at this and decide whether it is something that needs to be pursued and whether for instance the scope of what jack smith is supposed to look at gets folded into that. >> this is the danger of appointing a special counsel, right? >> exactly. >> you've seen the politicization of the doj under bill barr's stewardship. i was still shocked by it. it was out there to be seen. but the idea that he is back there drinking scotch with john durham and that the atmosphere becomes poisonous and part is an enough that prosecutors are leaving the office. i mean, you've been on the inside of an investigation. what does it take to get people to resign in fury like that? >> is -- by the way i think my view of bill barr, the reason i wasn't

right now, it doesn't fit within that purview of what jack smith has, or rob her. you could imagine that, with this reporting, that merrick garland, or lisa monaco, they're going to be curious if they don't know already. there's a good chance they don't because, you know john durham would've had to have told them about this and laid it all the facts. maybe he did. if he didn't, they're going to look at this and decide whether it is something that needs to be pursued, and whether these, for instance, the scope of what jack smith is supposed to look at gets folded into that. >> it's the danger of appointing a special counsel, right? you seem sanguine about far and the politicization of the doj under his stewardship. i was still shocked by it. you know, it was out there to be seen, but the idea he's back there, drinking scotch with john durham, and the atmosphere becomes poisonous and partisan enough that prosecutors are leaving the office. you've been on the inside of an investigation. what does it take to get people to resign in fury like that? >> by the way, i thin

smith having the top positions. rob is going to stay. he better stay. [laughter] trent kelly is positioned to be the chair. i expect to be ranking member. there is a lot of carryover in terms of the people that i think are going to head up some of these committees. one thing that is of concern to me is -- and for a good thing it was not in the rule adopted yesterday -- but the talk about trying to rollback the top line of the federal government to fiscal year 2022 is, in my opinion, a completely unrealistic policy. it is going to put downward pressure. there are ways that people are talking about to backfill to protect defense. but we went through this with sequestestration and that is a fools errand. we have got to come to grips with a realistic framework for what budget is going to look like for 2024. which will create the space so a lot of new starts that are still waiting to begin, you know, landed the navy it is the fast forget program. if we want to get three subs a year, the coast guard needs the new icebreaker program. that was not funded in fy2

smith having the top two positions. see power, rob is going to stay. he better stay.laughter] trent kelly is positioned to be the chair. i expect to be ranking member. there is a lot of carryover in terms of the people that i think are going to head up some of these committees. i have to say one thing that is of concern to me is just that even though it was not in the rules adopted yesterday and for a good thing, but the talk about trying to roll back the top line of the federal government for fiscal year 2022 is, in my opinion, a complete lee unrealistic policy. it is going to put downward pressure. there are ways that i know people are talking about trying to backfill to protect defense, but the fact is we went through this drill with sequestration. that is at the end of the day, just a fools errand in my opinion. we really have to come to grips with a realistic framework for what budget is going to look like for fiscal year 2024, which will create space so that a lack new starts are still waiting to begin. in the navy it is the fast frigate program. we want to get

they won looking at the mar-a-lago case, jack smith, and the news special counsel who has been appointed, rob don't have a time in history where you have had the former president and the current president being looked at this way, but there are -- the smith investigation and her investigation are two very different investigations, laura, and the one case, you have a sweeping investigation of a former president, who refused to return documents back, and documents that are reported to be -- contained some very serious information over, alternately, over 300 classified documents, including more than 100 that were held on to it had to be obtained through a search warrant? here you have full cooperation, the kinds of documents that if it's just what jamie gangel is reporting about, i saw these documents every day when i was in the white house, and when i was ambassador. never, i had a rule -- >> evan, it was a corvette and the garage was locked. >> we do not know that biden put them in the garage, a vice president of staff by a lot of people, i had a rule when i looked at a document, i read it at

the one looking at the mar-a-lago case, jack smith, and the new special counsel, who has been appointed, robn history where you had the former president and the current president being looked at this way. but the smith investigation and the hur investigation are two very different investigations. in the one case you have a sweeping investigation of a former president who refused to turn documents back. documents that are reported to be containing very serious information. ultimately over 300 classified documents including more than a hundred that were held on to and had to be obtained through a search warrant. you have full cooperation. the kinds of documents if it is just what jamie is reporting about, i saw these documents every day when i was in the white house. >> did you put them in your garage? >> never. i had a rule. >> it was a corvette and the garage was locked >> i had a rule with these documents. we don't know biden put them in the garage. a vice president is staffed by a lot of people. i had a rule when i looked at a classified document i read it at my desk standing up and then i

bianna, there's a lot of talk about special counsel jack smith, his poimth in november, now his new appointment of rob hur on the biden investigation. but this investigation into the handling of presidential records and national security information after donald trump left the presidency, that criminal investigation has been going on for a year. part of that investigation is an obstruction of justice investigation, whether trump and his team could have obstructed justice or wanted to obstruct justice after there were classified documents discovered being kept at mar-a-lago in florida a year ago. we also know that the justice department still to this day they're investigating that criminal probe. they're also trying to secure the national security secrets, make sure there's nothing else out there and to finish or at least to continue that investigation, kaitlan collins and i confirmed they want to interview the two people the trump team hired in november to do searches who found two classified documents just this past november. it's likely those people will talk to the justice department but we know th

rob yourself of fashion. okay, let's go back and forth. smithsting of the device would begin. no, sir, not yet , but we believe that it will be the next couple of days, the customer is worried all the time waiting. deadline confirmation. so he 's got no more than two days, sir, we can guarantee. you can't guarantee anything when you work in russia don't hold up the wall.

i think rob is the right guy for the job. i think jack smith is the right guy for the job. i think all of this could have been handled within the normal channels and mechanisms of the department of justice. i'm not convinced we needed special counsels but now that we have them, i think we have two good ones. >> ken, what more have you been able to learn about the handover of this investigation and do we have a timeline? how long might we expect it to go? tell me what we know at this point? >> all good questions, chris. on its face it doesn't seem like a complicated investigation. not nearly as complex as the january 6th investigation that special counsel jack smith is conducting. probably not even as elaborate into the inquiry of mar-a-lago, there's a limited universe of people with access to the documents. but let's remember here, the u.s. attorney in chicago and the fbi have already been reviewing this matter for eight weeks. and we've reported that they've been interviewing some of the people who had their hands on these documents yet they were not able to get to the bot

rob hur first of all staffed this matter. again, when we were talking about the trooper investigation, special counsel jack smith inherited a lotle working on this investigation from florida, from the district of columbia, and merrick garland made it very clear that jack smith would inherit those folks to work on his investigation. really what it was was a hand-off of control at the highest levels. here on the other hand john lausch, who is the u.s. attorney in the northern district of illinois in the chicago area, it's not clear that those folks who are assisting him in his preliminary investigation will continue. rob hur has a choice. does he pop up in his tone's office and stop it or does he pull from the department? those staffing choices may tell us something about the speed that the investigation will move at and will also tell us whether or not rob hur will be impartial or is really a creature of the swamp. >> we have a lot to look at in the weeks ahead. msnbc legal analyst lisa rubin. thanks so much for starting us off this morning. >>> meanwhile the seditious conspiracy trial will continue for the proud boys and others

. >> and jack smith quickly jumped in on this case and was quickly read in as well. now we have robur catching up to speed here. evan, is it too soon, especially given everything that we know and we're being told from the president and the administration that they are cooperating, they are the ones who proactively reached out to the doj, again there's a lot more to learn here, but is there any liability at this point that the current president could face? >> yeah, there absolutely is, in the order that the attorney general signed to appoint rob hur, they talk about the possible crime that would be prosecuted or investigated here, and it talks about the unauthorized -- the possible unauthorized removal and retention of classified documents and other records. and that's the crime that is being investigated here. the question is, was this willful, was this something that the president or anyone else may have done on purpose? that is the pursuit here by the fbi and rob hur, the new special counsel looking into this. the white house has made clear in all of their statements that the pres

one, jack smith, although he inherited investigation that was far more mature than, for example, the investigation that rob her as the special counsel in the biden situation, is about to commence, it's also much more complicated one, and he of course has two investigations under his mandate. but part of the problem for him also is the volume and the willful-ness of president trump's conduct in that situation, and trying to understand a host of questions, including the former presidents involvement in packing up his materials, when he asked people to say, one of the first 15 boxes return over the national archives, in february of 22. and the continued obstruction of the former president, over things make it far more complicated. that having been said, alex, we are at the very beginning of this biden situation, and with each day, particularly thanks to the intrepid reporting of people like charlie, we get a new and developing understanding of the situation. and so based on the facts, as i know them, now my expectation is that the trump investigation may take longer to resolve. that having been, said it is no

smith in that last week. lunatic, frog, mentally deranged. i want to know, what is joe biden been saying about robn the past week? has he said anything like that about him? >> not one democrat has said that. congresswoman omar, our friend was an msnbc yesterday, that she was placed special counsel was appointed. i'm sure not all democrats agree with that. all democrats i have heard say you should look at -- why classified documents in someone's homes, the one thing when you look at this language of donald trump there, i want to remind people, after the mar-a-lago search in august, donald trump called the fbi -- they found documents there that kevin mccarthy -- marco rubio did. we had a terrorist attack at an fbi office. the gunman was killed. there was a legion of threats -- fbi agents as a result. we can look at that and go like, wow, donald trump is mentally unhinged. there is no -- radicalized more of his followers. that's why the gop is a fascist movement. it uses thugs and donald trump never denounced the attack on the fbi. i wrote about it last august. he never denounced it. >> very good. i'

rob rosenstein and christopher wray before ray became the head of the fbi. so does disappointment make it easier or more difficult for special counsel, jack smith to indict any mar-a-lago case? earlier this week, the new york times reporting that jack smith might bring charges by this summer. do you think that is realistic now? >> i think that the question becomes, are you talking about the court of law or the court of public opinion. i think when you talk about the court of law, it does impact jack smith to the extent that it is not going to change a yay to a nay or aa to a nay and as much as what he has already decided to do or decides to do will not be impacted by this. however, it is going to ensure that jack smith was already a nerve prosecutor is going to dot every i across every t in terms of how it goes forward. in terms of the timeline, it could bump it up to a small degree. in terms of the overall scope of whether he is going to decide to indict and prosecute donald trump for this, i don't think that will make that much of a change. the biggest change we might see is that it might accelerate his timeline just a bit. >> okay england, speaking of the

smith, and i'm sure probably felt the same way. but once he had done the first one, he absolutely knew he had to do the second one, which is rob hur. i will say, though, that there is an effort here to make clear in the appointment document, which the attorney general announced, in which he specifies what specific crime is being looked at. there is, of course, language that says any additional matters or krcrimes that may arise, especially if somebody was trying to obstruct or anything like that. one of the copkey parts of this going to be the personal documents found alongside the president -- the classified documents, right? one of the things that we heard in the last few days from officials is that these documents were found with purely personal things having to do with the vice president's family and so on. the question is the dates of those documents, right? they're going to want to know -- the fbi will want to know how far back are those documents that might indicate an intent to try to conceal the classified documents. those are the things that are going to be key here. the co-mingling of the personal with the classified doc

rob hur will have to assemble his team and get his office set up. special counsel operate in a separate space, and that is the case for robert durham and jack myth smithe'll be overseeing a criminal investigation into classified documents found in three locations connected to a sitting president. he will have the ability to review these documents, he could subpoena either witnesses or other evidence, as he tries to examine whether any criminal charges are appropriate here. now in erm terms who have could asked to sit for an interview. the u.s. attorney in chicago who is tapped to review this matter and make a recommendation about whether thud should be a special counsel. she interviewed kathy chung, a former assistant to president biden during his time when he was vice president. we know she was interviewed. she's an official at the pentagon. now other people who could potentially be interviewed, other people who were involved in the transition who may have packed those boxes. and anyone who could have been in any of these three locations where the documents were found. so kate, we'll be busy and probably be talking often. >> yeah. it is good to see y