and then the carbon removal expert, robert hoagland. a very responsible and safe way so that you're taking carbon and you're actually storing it permanently, i would say there's very little doubt about that. it's solid tonnes. the question is more, is this a pathway that we want to see on a very large scale? charm wants to build thousands of these units on farms and forests. they have lofty ambitions. however, angela has heard grand ideas like this before, but she's not convinced. i think sort of the smaller scale portable type of operations would be very useful in the santa cruz mountain. i'm hopeful that something will happen soon. you sound slightly sceptical. yeah, i probably do. for now, all this unwanted biomass will either rot or be burnt. perhaps one day, though, if charm industrial succeeds in its ambition, it will end up deep underground. meanwhile, we're back on the farm, along with bear, clover, willow, and the big donkey's called hazel. hazel�*s a horse. technicality. but let me tell you, the piece of farming technology tha