longtime federal prosecutor, andrew weissmann, who served as a lead prosecutor for special counsel robert mueller breaks it all down. - remember, it's not just a prosecutor who makes the decision, jurors have to find that there's proof beyond a reasonable doubt and they have to be unanimous. - [margaret hoover] how strong is the manhattan da's case? will it help or hurt the other investigations? and what does this mean for our justice system? what does former federal prosecutor, andrew weissmann, say now? - [announcer] "firing line" with margaret hoover is made possible in part by robert granieri, charles r schwab, the fairweather foundation, the margaret a daniel loeb foundation, the asness family foundation, jeffrey and lisa bewkes, peter and mary kalikow, and by craig newmark philanthropies, the rosalind p walter foundation, damon button, the center for the study of the international economy, inc., the pritzker military foundation on behalf of the pritzker military museum and library, and the mark haas foundation. corporate funding is provided by stevens inc. - andrew weissmann, welcome to "fi

and they've come out on th other side plus, andrew weissmann was robert mueller's top prosecuto duringgation. now, he is the person we all turn to for legal analysis which we've needed a lot o lately we pay a visit to his apartmen in manhattan to talk about his weekend routine. stay with, us we'll be right back paradontax blood when you brush could lead to worse over time. help stop the clock on gum disease now. parodontax toothpaste... ...is 3x more effective at removing plaque bacteria, one of the main causes of bleeding gums. parodontax. the gum experts. i'm your overly competitive brother. check. psych! really? dude, that's a foul! and now you're ready to settle the score. and if you don't have the right home insurance coverage, well you could end up paying for all this yourself. so get allstate. want a worry-free way to kill bugs? zevo traps use light, not odors or chemical insecticides, to attract and trap flying insects. they work continuously so you don't have to. zevo. people-friendly. bug-deadly. need relief for tired, achy feet? or the energy to keep working? there's a dr. s

msnbc political analyst, and michael zeldin, former federal prosecutor, former special counsel to robert mueller's so great to see all of you. this is a huge development, ken. what do we know about what pence might have said behind those closed doors? >> good morning, we believe former vice president pence was inside that federal courthouse in washington, d.c., for more than seven hours. and while we don't know exactly what was said, we know the basic contours of what he experienced on january 6th because a lot of other people have talked about it and testified about it, but there are some things that only pence can speak to including his private conversations with donald trump that day, and that makes him an absolutely crucial witness in the doj's special counsel investigation of whether trump broke the law in trying to overturn the election. pence was the central focus, we all recall, of trump's efforts to stop congress are from certifying joe biden's electoral college victory that day, the day rioters breached the capitol. when pence refused to go along with trump's scheme, trump tweeted abou

there was never any evidence of russian collusion or any other crime as robert mueller admitted in his final long redacted report. those that say well, the gag order would just be narrow. it would only relate to these charges. these charges are politically motivated, this is part of the campaign against donald trump. >> tucker: yeah, if you can't speak in your own defense in public and only your critics have the freedom of speech, i mean, at that point darkness has descended. roger stone, thank you. >> thank you, tucker. >> tucker: so the big and fundamental things matter at the very top of that list is energy. the most valuable thing this country owns. it's our strategic petroleum reserve. joe biden has sold it in part to china so we need to refill it. oh, that's a little harder than it looks. more on that next. >> tucker: the strategic petroleum reserve may be the single most hardest asset the u.s. government owns. that's a concern when you consider it's at its lowest level in 40 years that is true because the biden administration has sent this oil to foreign countries including chin

it is fighting, whether it is fighting to grab the newspaper in the morning or it is fighting robert mueller business venture has always been fighting, fighting, fighting, so you are going to see a very defiant donald trump, he will probably raise a tremendous amount of money tonight, he will use the keywords that will get everyone triggered and we are off to the races and it is just going to be a crazy presidential election cycle. 50 be a crazy presidential election cycle.- be a crazy presidential election cycle. so we could hear an — election cycle. so we could hear an explosive - election cycle. so we could hear an explosive speech l election cycle. so we could - hear an explosive speech from donald trump tonight, you are saying. donald trump tonight, you are sa inc. ~ , donald trump tonight, you are sa in. ~ i, donald trump tonight, you are sa inc. ,, ., donald trump tonight, you are saying-_ let's i donald trump tonight, you are i saying-_ let's get saying. why stop now? let's get stehanie saying. why stop now? let's get stephanie and _ saying. why stop now? let's get stephanie and davi

it's incredibly wea is to misstate the facts this reminds me an awful lot o what he did with robert mueller, when mueller first rolled ou his report and he spun it as a complete exoneration of donald trump. he talked about how there wa no evidence of conspiracy, there was no collusion after all this investigation you know, there is a bunch o nothing. even a federal judge in that case accused william barr of distorting the record in tha case and i think he's doing the sam thing again. now, someone who has his credibility can convince people so, if people watch that people of good faith saw, wow, that guy is a former attorne general of the united states he must know what he's talking about. and if he says there's nothing to the case, there must be nothing to the case. and yet, he has not even see it it is not unsealed yet and so it's really quite a bit of hubris to be able to issu that kind of opinion on a case that he has not even seen yet. i >> susanne craig, you have known and covered donald trump for years and years and years. what do you think this is like for him? he's weathered a lot o

what strikes me is that alvin bragg is bringing a gun to a knife fight and unlike robert mueller, he'sushing back and he's calling out jim jordan very clearly for a move that is pure political retaliation it is attempt to retaliate and obstruct justice and it is abuse of congressional power. and also, for political view, going back to glenn's earlier point, think about what jim jordan, the chairman of the house judiciary committee is doing. the willingness of jim jordan to put the work of the house, to s subordinate the work of the house this early to donald trump's term they have all the other things on their plate right now, all of the other thing this could be cog, and jim jordan apparently has such a short leash from mar-a-lago, that he is going to take this committee, this hearing, to new york city. it is interesting that alvin bragg is pushing back so hard and hitting all of the keynotes, including the fact that this is a campaign to intimidate and obstruct it is an abuse of power. so this is not a trivial or a technical point that alvin bragg is making. >> charlie, this was jim

the bide white house should, receive -- doj memo that says you can't indict a sitting president robert muellerly. couldn't agree with you more m friend thank you as much, as always great to see what matty. enjoy the rest of your evening >> - new details on the trump indictment in just a moment i, will speak with lanny davis michael cohen's attorney, beau unreported information tha cohen handed over to manhattan prosecutors and what his forme fixer might do at the trial. plus, how many handier alvin bragg made his case for do senior official, andre weissmann will join me to talk about that he says charging trump was required by the rule of law. after the break, the other major story this week, tha wisconsin's state supreme cour race, -- we'll explain why this electio should matter to every america and a whole lot more i may be in mohyeldin. let's get started. oh >> tonight, we have a muc deeper sense of -- and the reason it has taken so long to get to this moment thanks to a pair of stunning new revelations. breaking earlier today, lann das,ic

others for more on all of, this i'm joined by andrew weissmann, he served as lead prosecutor fo robert mueller'snsel office and the general counsel under the fbi unde mueller. he's also the author of, where law ends, inside the mueller investigation. so i want to start with, you andrews pass if ugly on what are we seeing the difference between trump of august when h refused to answer thes questions, and pled the fift over 400 times, to now where i seems like he was talking lot. >>,,, the reason that is important is if you do the fifth amendment, the jury ca be told that you did that an they can use that as an offers in france, they can say, gee i you had nothing to hide wh didn't you speak that does not and cannot happe in a criminal case because there is a constitutiona right. to remain silent in a criminal case so when donald shrimp -- before the civil charges wer brought, took the fift amendment so many times, he wa basically handing the case t letitia james because she ha whatever proof she hat and she could rely on the fift amendment assertion. but what has changed since the is a number of

attorney-client privilege is being pierced -- >> it's such a different strategy think back to the way robert mueller operated, the other special counsel investigating this former president. it was so conservative they never wanted to take these court fights anywhere. it'll be delayed, tied up in the courts courts are moving fast on these issues they're wasting no time. >> because you don't live at 1600 pennsylvania avenue anymore. themes the breaks. laura jarrett, thank you for your time, my friend good to see you. still ahead tonight voters in wisconsin have elected a new justice for their state supreme court. it could mean massive change in terms of how politics in the statute are run, and republicans are already trying to put a stop to it. i'll talk to wisconsin governor tammy baldwin about just that. stay with us the virus that causes shingles is sleeping... in 99% of people over 50. it's lying dormant, waiting... and could reactivate. shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. and it could wake at any time. think you're not at risk for shingles? it's time to wake up

attorney-client privilege ha been pierced it's a totally different strategy think back to how robert muellerthe special counsel investigatin this same former president he was so conservative, they never wanted to take these court fights anywhere, because it was always if it would be delayed, tied up in the courts they are moving very fast on those issues, they are wasting no time. it's a completely differen strategy >> because you don't live at 1600 pennsylvania avenue anymore. those are the brakes lauren jarrett, thank you fo your time, my friend, it's goo to see you still ahead tonight, voters in wisconsin have elected a new justice for their state suprem court, it could be massive change in terms of how politic in the state are run for republicans, they ar already trying to put a stop t it i'll talk to wisconsin senator tammy baldwin about just that, coming, up stay with us. weeds... they have you surrounded. you're just gonna stand there? or are ya gonna take your lawn back. we're gonna take it back. we're gonna take it back. with scotts turf builder triple action! it gets three jobs don

we saw attacks against the likes of robert mueller, it wa not until after the muelle report came outorters to delegitimized if he were to be held or found guilty. or they found wrongdoing to delegitimized any of thos findings or potentia convictions in their eyes fo later down the road, ali >> both of you standby, we wil take a break and considere continuous on the other side we will be right back. that's why you choose vmware. with flexible multi-cloud services that enable digital innovation and enterprise control, vmware helps you keep your cloud options open. r really and enterprise control, been offered a beauty campaign when i was in my twenties or my thirties or my forties. it wasn't until i was 48 years old, when i thought that was way behind me. here you come along and ask me to join you on this journey with meaningful beauty. announcer>>> no matter what your age, now is the perfect time for beautiful, younger-looking skin with meaningful beauty. join ellen pompeo and millions of women who use the age-defying super treatments that have kept supermodel cindy crawford looking s

and robert mueller is a former special assistant at the department of justice, michael always great toee you. so what will you be looking for? when the details of the charges are announced tuesday? what he's charged with . i think we can be pretty clear that he's gonna be charged with multiple misdemeanors for the false business record entries. which reflect payments to michael cohen of legal fees, which really was just the repayment of the stormy daniels payment that cohen made the tricky part. fred will be how do they turn those misdemeanors into felonies? because that's what i would think they would want to do. the two options they have is to say those misdemeanors become felonies because they were part of a scheme to evade federal election campaign requirements reporting requirements. or or and or. they violated new york tax law because they were there was a deduction taken for legal fees when they really weren't legal fees, and the deduction therefore isn't improper. so how do they get to a misdemeanor to a felony is what interests me most. is there an issue with statute of limita

andrew weissmann, nbc lega analyst and senior member of special counsel robert mueller's took to -- whymp should face the same penalty for the crime that michael cohen was prosecuted for. writing in part, quote, it would be anathema to the rul of law not to prosecute th principle for the crime when a lower level conspirator ha been prosecuted. andrew weissmann joins me now. andrew, great to see you again thank you for making time fo us this evening. with what you wrote in tha guest essay in mind, i want to get your reaction to what we have heard today from cy vance he revealed to my colleagu chuck todd that the southern district of new york asked him to stand out in the hush money payment case, even thoug michael cohen had alread pleaded guilty what are the implications of this, do you think >> sure. it is great to be here i think one thing that peopl need to understand is it is no that unusual for state prosecutors with other state prosecutors, or federa prosecutors with state prosecutors, or federa prosecutors with federal prosecutors, to have what ar known as turf disputes that is, t

he is a former federal prosecutor and a former special assistant to robert mueller at the department of justice. always great to see michael. hi fred. all right, so that the special counsel prosecutors would be asking witnesses for details about how trump paid for their lawyers. are we talking about, um in the beginning stages of an investigating of witness tampering, potentially. well, it could be, but we have to back up one second to say in investigations of corporations or other organizations. it is not unusual for the corporations to pay for the lawyers of individuals. you'll see it where the ceo or the cfo, but organization is being paid by the corporation for his or her attorney, but that is that his or her attorney individually must represent the individual. i should say it differently that individuals loyalty is to the individual solely not to the corporation. and so in this case if the prosecutors have a belief that these lawyers are not representing their individual clients, but rather trying to shape their testimony do you favor the trump organization or trump? individuall

republicans in congress, whether it be republican governors, whether it be the media, whether it be robert mueller, whether it be those who are leading the impeachment proceedings against him or whether it was even his own vice president what you're seeing now is social media posts over the last 24 hours, one particularly overnight in which he suggested the manhattan district attorney alvin bragg should be removed from the case. that can't happen without a formal proceeding initiated by the democratic governor of new york, kathy hochul he also called the judge a trump hating judge, which there's no evidence to show that. this is the same judge that oversaw the plea deal agreement of allan weisselberg the former trump organization cfo. this is going to be a moment that will likely bring several witnesses for marred, including stormy daniels who just this weekend in an interview with "the times of london" said she'd be willing to take the stand also, likely, michael cohen. i want you to hear from what michael cohen anticipates is going through his former bosses head >> this is his worst fear, being

congresswoman omar from your state, michigan governor gretchen whitmer, and former fbi director robert muellerew that he has called to be locked up. how do you explain this doubl standard >> well, hello reveren sharpton. it is so nice to b with you. call me old fashioned, but i don't think it is ever good to be indicted. and i hav been involved in a lot o campaigns, and i have never ha one of his campaigns heard anyone say, boy if we coul just get indicted this is goin to be great for our prospects. it is, i think, a sign of ho low the republican party has sunk. and donald trump, this i donald trump's republica party. but, as i was listening to what you are saying, yo think of this rhetoric as of witch hunts and the calling fo the arrest of his opponents. tearing down the media, tearin down our judicial system and our legal system. those are th hallmarks of authoritarian and extremist movements that w have seen in history. and it i playing out exactly along thos lines here in the united state with these followers of trump. so, i continue to you thin that we are in a very dangerou time >> are y

there was never any evidence of russian collusion, wikileaks collaboration or any other crime, as robert muelleradmitted in his final long, redacted report. and those who say, well, the gag order would just be narrow, it would only relate to these charges. these charges are politically motivated. this is part of the campaign against donald trump. >> yeah, but if you can't speak in your own defense in public, in only your critics have the freedom of speech. i mean, at that point, it darkness has descended and i don't think it's an overstatement. roger stone, thank you. thank you, tucker. so the big and fundamental things matter at the very top of that list is energy. the most valuable thing this country owns is our strategic petroleum reserve. joe biden has sold it in part to china. so we need to refill it. oh, that's a little harder than looks. >> more on that next. guys, ready this spring. export everything fox nation has to offer for one ninety nine month when you sign up for a yearly plan, what a privilege it is . for you to have me here this evening to see what change experience, new stories

you know, oh, look, robert mueller, this, you know, great. you know, this is this is the £800 gorilla. this will put a stop to it. you know, it happened throughout 2020. you know biden was supposed to win fairly comfortably. he didn't. i mean, trump got 70 million or so votes despite a whole hell a lot. i mean, a terrible economy, covid, you know everything he did. so look, still there. i mean, we were all in washington after january 6th. i there was a there seemed to be at least 72 hours, at least a critical mass among republicans that we all talked to. okay. this is it. this is a bridge too far. we finally will move on from trump. and lo and behold, you know, starting pretty much that day when, you know, large numbers of republican to not certify biden's election, you know, people were falling line and i don't know again if it's fear what but look, we're still there i think trump has a big, big hold on one of our two major parties. and as major said, like one of two people are going to win in 22. the democratic nominee or the republican nom

trying to find lawyers to represent them after rob rosenstein had appointed the special counsel robert mueller and a lot. you know, he went through the list of big names. in fact, i was on a phone call, um, with him where he was asking me about lawyers and, um they won't represent him because he's erratic. doesn't pay his bills doesn't follow directions. um undercuts his own lawyers by, you know, shopping for advice, and it seems like he likes this sort of team of sort of game of thrones like no, but it's part of it. yeah i mean, that's part of the you know the his his manipulation of the situation wants to manipulate the situation as he wants to hear what he wants to hear, which is part of how you know he's getting himself into trouble in other places like the mar-a-lago document. he's talking to a non lawyer getting advice about about whether he gets to keep these documents that he took from the federal government. it's just is no way to run. it's no way to run a criminal defense or any kind of defense program. you know, the campaign says their fundraising on it, miller says he's raised $7 m

republicans at the very top who had suggested this was all prosecutorial efforts from the likes of robert mueller to the impeachment proceedings on capitol hill to the january 6th select committee. all in effort to not only take down donald trump, but the republican party that is where they're sort of in this weird position now because these are allegations that stem before 2015. it was mike pence who while serving as vice president called them quote baseless allegations. so he's really in a bind here. and the other republicans find themselves in that and for donald trump, getting on that trump branded plane, it harkens back to 2016, 2015, when he put the pressure on other republicans. talking to asa hhutchison, has required the republican candidates to support their nominee. i know that's an issue in which the former arkansas has taken up but really as bill cassidy said it best this weekend he is somebody who actually voted to convict donald trump after the january 6th attack in the senate he said what this does outside of whether it's right or wrong or whether he actually committed these acts o

georgia, it's about your intellect and qualifications that is different than what he said about robert mueller or jack smith look when bragg was a federa prosecutor, he specialized and public corruption. you know house a stream team o experienced assistant district attorneys who have been workin this case for two years. bragg has already beat the trump organization, on criminal case. he got a big fat guilt conviction against a corporation and his former cfo but the black prosecutors ar used to being underestimated ali. it happened to me all of the time when i was doing public corruption cases what th department of justice. trump and his allies underestimate bragg as the peril. >> there was also the second part of, it we talk about th antisemitism consulate quoting george soros or calling hi soros, the man's never met george soros and, soros neve contributed to him, he can attributed to a fund tha supports liberal prosecutors that's at the implication of the jewish puppet master, also by implication is that progres that's about enough to figur this out on his own. >> exactly, again it's thi con

i remember there was several hundred page report issued b special counsel robert mueller and one half of it was devoted to trump's efforts to derail the investigation. he is perfectly capable of committing crimes, felonies to avoid nothing, which was probably what he had don before he started the muelle investigation. he certainly - willing to try to commit crime to avoid being convicted of misdemeanor. it is just - he does not know when to stop. >> and coming up on morning joe, a seismic victory for liberals in wisconsin in the most expensive judicial race in american history, stev kornacki will join us from the -- to break it all down for us. e's my little marzipan! [ laughs ] oh, my daughter gives the best hugs! we're just passing through on our way to the jazz jamboree. [ imitates trumpet playing ] and we wanted to thank america's number-one motorcycle insurer -for saving us money. -thank you. [ laughs ] mara, your parents are -- exactly like me? i know, right? well, cherish your friends and loved ones. let's roll, daddio! let's boogie-woogie! you need to deliver new apps fast usi

you think robert mueller was going to go to rod rosenstein and get a subpoena to put mike pence beforeloves come off on a trump investigation in a way that we didn't see before. some people may say it's aggressive some people say this is how a justice department investigation proceeds at the end of the day, a lot of what's going on in this investigation never would have happened if donald trump was still in the white house >> let me -- how much of it is the absence of the protections or the protectors in bill barr and rod rosenstein, whose role as a protector is a known unknown, how much of it is the egregiousness of the crimes? he plotted an insurrection in which hanging mike pence was the mission statement and hoarded classified documents >> in the mueller investigation, the obstruction prosecutors went after it as hard as they could they had a real time cooperator in the white house who was providing them with element real time readouts of what trump was saying, including in what is probably the closest obstructive act trump took i don't know, but the fact that trump was in the whit

throughout th night tonight, andrew weissmann, who is of course when th senior prosecutors on robert mueller's special counse investigation. he also served as fbi genera counsel, also crossed than christian, who is a veteran of the same manhattan distric attorney's office that brought these felony charges against the former president today he's a former special assistan da from that office. thank you all to our legal firepower here for being here. and join catherine, let me jus with you guys. we have been pontificating ove here at the table here as if w are lawyers. and we absolutely are not. have we gotten anything wrong, or is anything important tha you think we are missing in terms of understanding th law here and what we learned >> well, it's going to start b saying i thought we are at the children's table because obviously this is the adults - but, with all due respect, i will say that i didn't think there was anything wrong i actually wanted to maybe focus everybody on an issu that is sort o forward-looking. because one of the things that -- interesting was the timefram going forward. so

he is a former justice department prosecutor, former senior member of robert mueller's special counsel investigation. charlie is back, he has epic backgrounds, editor at large of the bulwark. watching you get mic'd up, made me nis one thing about covid, seeing inside everyone's homes we've sort of walked up to this point this week, i think, in seeing stephen miller and seeing the mostly secret court proceedings yield legal defeat after legal defeat after legal defeat so far for donald trump in terms of withholding some of this testimony from jack smith i wonder what you make and if you could take me through what your colleagues are reporting about where things stand for jack smith. >> yeah. so what we are seeing is witnesses finally have to testify. it gives him an opportunity to create the fullest account we have seen of the events leading up to january 6th and the former president's role in those events now, keep in mind for the january 6th committee they knitted together a narrative but weren't able to compel all the witn witnesses they may have wanted to talk to the panel jack smit

know, the justice department, under donald trump, jeff sessions appointed a special counsel, robert mueller, to get to the bottom of whether russian coordination with the trump campaign impacted the 2016 election it seems that it is at least not a novel notion to get to the bottom of threats to democracy would you like to see whether or not this justice department looked at it from that perspective before they decided to pass on snit >> that's a real toughy, because the general policy is you don't want to comment when you say no. i take your point, there is an exception to the policy when it's very important, public issue. so i can certainly see that now. but what's on the other side is the comey debacle. you know, and that he is now potentially being vindicated so the reason for the decision, yes, i guess so. but, you know, but to me the most important thing is we are now actually litigating it i want to say one more quick thing, i'm confused generally about the point, and maybe your guest can answer what vance said he was told to stand down, because i thought he did pursue the investigati

the entire second volume of robert mueller's report is about his efforts to obstruct the investigationat's covered in the first volume. it's longer. >> sure. >> i want to read what that was like for e. jean carroll e. jean carroll acknowledged people have suffered worse than being the target of donald trump's wrath online but said the toll is nonetheless devastating. it hit me and it laid me low i lost my reputation nobody looked at me the same it was gone, e. jean carroll said, sounding anguished people with no opinion now thought of me as a liar and hated me the force of that hatred was staggering she described receiving at least ten serious threats, including being emailed death threats. she said she also received terrible messages through her ask e. jean mail bag she got supportive messages but they were outweighed by the harmful ones, she testified. the violence and the dirt and seedy language and people describing what they think i did and why nobody in the world would touch me because of my enormous ugliness has sort of swamped the heartfelt letters i received this is a thing ab

also joining us andrew weisman, former prosecutor and senior member of robert mueller's special counsel investigation. with us from washington, "new york times" congressional reporter ari, i told you a minute ago, i heard boris and thought, ari, you're sort of the person who has interviewed him before jack smith will get a chance at that. i wonder if you could tell what's that line of questioning would be like. >> i think you laid it out so well, nicolle. this is someone who is central not many people go back to '15 and make it all the way to the arraignment. ivanka trump hasn't made it that far. >> it's like dawn to dusk, right? just down the elevator, all the way through the arraignment, you're right >> two reasons for that, one, boris is incredibly persistent, loyal or committed person for donald trump, and people can debate whether that is a good commitment, but it is certainly evident. two, he is a lawyer and trump needs lawyers more than other people some of these political aides or even bill barr who was a government lawyer, different role, they've changed over time. but he needs

a former justice department prosecutor and senior member of robert mueller's special counsel investigationngresswoman, i start with you. take me through -- just in a big picture manner, the import of having access to mike pence's firsthand testimony of why he ran down the stairs, what he knew when he woke up that day, and his experience on the other end of the line from donald trump. >> i think this is a key piece, something that we would have liked to have heard directly, as the january 6th committee from the former vice president. but his firsthand impressions, assuming he's going to be truthful and honest and not vague, as he's been in his book and other questioning and interviews. to really lay out what he heard and what exchange he had in his conversations from the president. but also how that shapes what was the former president's state of mind at the time. that is something that we have clearly understood. it was mentioned how he intended to just, you know, leave it to the -- him and the other republican congressman to essentially change the results of the election. but mike pence,

he woul lay his body on railroad tracks before he would let donald trump speak in person with robert muellerd letitia james being able to make any sort of negative use of his assertion of the fifth amendment at trial this is a civil fraud case, not a criminal matter. the rules are a little bit different. in a criminal case, you -- a prosecutor cannot tell the jury that the defendant had taken the fifth amendment. that is telling the jury the defendant -- what he says would inkrip nature himself. the rules are different in civil trials it's not clear she -- it's not clear she would have been able to do that even if he would continue to take the fifth there's more leeway for that some of this might be strategy he might think and his lawyer might think, maybe he can get away with just sort of saying, i don't recall, i wasn't there, i was busy being president, i don't know, without actually taking the fifth that's risky it is donald trump as rick said. he gets aggravated i'm sure he will get aggravated during depositions when he is being asked questions and to keep him from going ahead and just

there was a several-hundred page report issues by special counsel robert mueller and one half was devoted to trump's efforts to derail the investigation he is perfectly capable of committing crimes, felonies, to avoid nothing, which was probably what he had done before he started trying to obstruct the mueller investigation. he certainly -- he's willing to try to commit crimes to avoid being convicted of a misdemeanor. it's just that -- he just -- he doesn't know when to stop. >> and speaking of not knowing when to stop john heileman i thought it was fascinating yesterday, every democrat -- people will get mad at me, i'm good with it every democrat i talked to, every lawyer, da, i was making calls through the afternoon, they were all disappointed by bragg's -- by the actual indictment itself. they were all disappointed with the charging papers and were saying so. so, you know, advantage trump. disadvantage desantis and the entire republican field. if donald trump was sane, if we were rational, he would have said i'm going to go to bed with the win. but as we all know, donald trump can't k

presidential campaign never happened before in history where there is a former fbi director called robert muellertrying to prove for 20 months that there was so—called russian collusion that failed as well. then one impeachment, then to impeach him and then the fbi raiding his home in mar a lago . this is just home in mar a lago. this is just another example of political persecution. if there were justice, this would not be happening. there's only one reason this is happening isn't just the former president . reason this is happening isn't just the former president. he is the leader of the opposition. he is the putin's candidate for the republican party . this is all republican party. this is all about one thing preventing my former boss from running for the presidency for a second time. sebastian, i've been meeting some of the quotes that have been coming out overnight. some of the quotes that have been coming out overnight . we've been coming out overnight. we've got daniels saying and got stormy daniels saying and the is apparently at the lady who is apparently at the lady who is apparently at