for some perspective we have ronnie castrels, former member of the african national congress, antiapartheid caves. activist, we are glad to have you with us. why is it many searches identify with the palestinian -- south africans identify with the palestinian struggle for self determination? >> well, this is a just cause. stealing people's land, repressing them. that has to be answered with resistance. the palestinian resistance is being courageous, of course as a noble cause supported by the people. and we see in the way the israeli government occupies the territory to denude people of their human rights, does all these absolute barbaric things that we have seen on your very good program today, i mean, you're talking about ethnic cleansing. we're talking genocide -- we're talking infantocide -- >> there is a security problem that allows them no option but to deal it in this way? >> let's -- sorry, i know you've got to put the balance . let's put that aside. that is balderdash. this is a people who have been stripped of their rights. who have their land taken from them. who are occupied by