would come within a three-mile perimeter of karl rove's groups no matter what they do wrong. >> well,s part of the issue here because as you pointed out earlier this is a manufactured crisis by and large, a crisis that feeds into the republican narrative that the i.r.s. is evil, and that government is very much guilty of over reach and it creates this bubble around roves organization crossroads gps and crossroads america to keep them at bay by playing offense to make a good defense. the more you harsh on democrats for this being a political scandal, the more you insulate rove's groups and others like them from getting fully investigated when it's become very clear through some reporting, especially on pro publica that roves group was quite close to breaking the law and should be investigated along with others. not to mention the fact if they're qualifying or conveying themselves as part of this 501c3, four universe, they jut spent almost 2-1 in the last election, even though the democratic rove's organization dumped tons and tons of money into the election, ads, those things qualify a

thank you. >>> coming up, a rove by any other name. from an election night car wreck to the driver's seat? we'll explain. >> now, here are the guys. this is the decision desk. now we're in the heart of the decision desk room. you head this place up. chris, you've been doing all the number crunching. these guys behind you. you tell me whether you stand by your call on ohio given the doubts karl rove just raised. >> we're actually quite comfortable with the call in ohio. we're here at nashville's renowned jimmy kelly's steakhouse, where tonight we've switched their steaks with walmart's choice premium steak. it's a steakover. it's tender. good flavor. it just melts in your mouth. mine's perfect -- man! we're actually eating walmart steaks. are you serious? fantastic! that was a good cut of meat. [ earl ] these are perfectly aged for flavor and tenderness. i would definitely go to walmart to buy steaks. walmart choice premium steak in the black package. it's 100% satisfaction guaranteed. try it. and i have a massive heart attack right in

and here's why the carl rove move was so brilliant. those 501c4s, the welfare organizations, helping the unemployed or building stadiums, not only do they not have to pay taxes, they don't have to disclose their donors. carl rove figured out how he could have his cake and eat it too. went around the country looking all of us straight in the face telling us he had started up a social welfare organization. never mind it was dumping $70 million into partisan campaign ads. it's not just carl rove, it's also bill burton on the progressive end, they also have a 501c4, which is supposed to be a social welfare organization. pretty much every super pac has its own exempt 501c4 group fueled by secret donors. and this, my friends, is the context for the untold irs scandal. suddenly this distinction between political campaign groups and social welfare groups which the irs is tasked with patrolling and maintaining is effectively obliterated by the citizens united decision. people are running around the country making an obvious mockery of the socia

there is no campaign going on. >> bill: joining us from austin, texas to reply is karl rove. and you say. >> a. agree with bill it is not a campaign. first of all let me say i have great respect for bill kristol and work at the "weekly standard." i have a lot of friends who write for the standard. it does great work. in fact, stephan hayes has done great journalism on this particular issue. this is our sixth video from crossroads which, incidentally, bill, i don't run. i'm a supporter of it. i helped organize it, but i'm not officer of it. this video was the sixth individual joe we have run on the issue of benghazi in an attempt to make it clear what the links are. we had very compelling testimony from greg hicks and this video as you saw you in a very sober low key fashion puts that testimony in context with hillary clinton's comments made a couple of days later that this was all a video at 2:00 a.m. of the morning of september 11th. the morning of september 12th, hicks briefs hillary clinton and tells her it's an act of terrorism and two days later she is saying it's a vide

the doors to the roving room, firmly closed. meanwhile, in the royal gallery we have the arrival of the heralds. they are the men who keep records of heraldic arms in england, wales, and ireland. followed by the other heralds. medievalnt in their uniforms. unchanged for centuries. the heralds will make their way to the norman porch, ready for the arrival of her majesty in a short while. more processions to come in the royal gallery in a short while. we will also have some of the key political players involved. we will have a look at them in a short while. what happens here, lots of people congregate at the top of the stairs. there is a kind of welcoming party for her majesty and the duke of edinburgh. the heralds are there and we have seen the calvary. you also have the lord chancellor, the lord speaker, this figure of the commons. they all congregate there for that welcome. i did not ask you about your views on the process of transition we're seeing. do you think it the right pace? >> i agree with the points that have been made

karl rove is here and will react to obama's house of scandals.president be implicated in the irs enemies debaukus yell? and white house's obsession with attacking little old fox news channel and little old me. >> i'll put mr. burgess up against sean hannity. he'll tear him up. >> and one of these will air at the close of the show. here is a sneak peek this, is your option number two. reunited with the man that will saved his life. it just happened moments before giving the honor of throwing out the first pitch in a boston red sox game. i'm very excited about making the shrimp and lobster pot pie. we've never cooked anything like this before. [ male announcer ] introducing red lobster's seaside mimatch. combine any 2 of 7 exciting choices on one plate for just $12.99! like new cheddar bay shrimp lobster pot pie, and new parmesan crunch shrimp. plus salad and unlimited cheddabay biscuits. combine any 2 for just $12.99. [ stewart ] for the seaside mix & match, we're really mixing it up. there's just so many combinations to try. i'm stewart harringto

and karl rove is skirting the law. i even say he's cheating if he wants a tax -- i don't want karl rove to get a tax-exempt status. but you can't defend the i.r.s. when they go on their crusade to crack down on political organizations that are not really what they pretend to be. you can't defend the fact they only looked after conservative or republican or right wing organizations and not democratic. that turns the i.r.s. into a political machine. >> announcer: this is the "bill press show." guys that do reverse mortgage commercials? those types are coming on to me all the time now. (vo) she gets the comedians laughing and the thinkers thinking. >>ok, so there's wiggle room in the ten commandments, that's what you're saying. you would rather deal with ahmadinejad than me. >>absolutely. >> and so would mitt romney. (vo) she's joy behar. >>and the best part is that current will let me say anything. what the hell were they thinking? >> announcer: chatting with you live at current.com/billpress this is the "bill press show

end of thesite roving room. it gives you a sense of the geography of the building. the gentlemen at arms, another of the royal bodyguards getting ready for the procession. on the right, lord hill who is the leader of the government in the house of lords. what is happening now, we have s invery key participant the procession. they will go and retrieve the sword of state. they will be carrying those important elements of royal insignia in the procession itself. outside the look palace of westminster. glinting armor, breastplates of .he blues and royals cavalry making their their way past the palace of westminster. very soon, the band of the west guard and the royal salute. ♪ the queen in the duke arrive at the palace of westminster. with first and second divisions of the sovereign escort. all the troops on duty today and the command of general george martin -- norton, the commanding officer of the london district. through the sovereigns and -- sovereign's entrance. when the queen set foot inside the palace -- ♪ sounding the royal salute. duke arrive. the union flag is

>> well, first of all, i think karl rove has lost his mind.w a little bit of him losing his mind on election night when he wanted to call for a recount in ohio. and for him to put out an ad attacking a potential candidate who may never run three years from now, karl, get a life, take up tennis or do something. that's number one. number two, hillary clinton's stint as secretary of state, she'll be like a pitcher who had 20 wins and 2 losses during her stint as secretary of state. you know, if this is a blot on her record, her record was almost perfect in the eyes of the american people, and this won't have any long-lasting effect. i guarantee you three years from now if hillary clinton is a candidate, less than 5% of the american people will remember this. look, this is all about spin. it's not about cover-up. it's about spin. if there was a cover-up, let me repeat, the president of the united states, whose administration is supposedly orchestrating this cover-up, wouldn't have admitted it was a terrorist attack. he wouldn't have used those wor

. >> sean: karl rove will break down the political implications of the three scandals. two member of of the house judiciary committee here live with an update on the investigation into whether or not eric holder lied under oath and if he did what would be the consequences. tonight you get to pick the video of the day. log on to hannitylive.foxnews.com. we will show you a a preview of each throughout the show. the winner will run in its entirety later this hour. a sneak peek. do you think this is the video of the day? is this even possible. can a trash truck crush a car. if you want to see how this turns out, cast your vote for this one. [ male announcer ] erica had a rough day. there was this and this. she got a parking ticket... ♪ and she forgot to pay her credit card bill on time. good thing she's got the citi simplicity card. it doesn't charge late fees or a penalty rate. ever. as in never ever. now about that parking ticket. [ grunting ] [ male announcer ] the citi simplicity card is the only card that never has late fees, a penalty rate, or an annual fee, ever. go

. >> karl rove is fox news contributor and white house former chief of staff.lose to the romney campaign. >> both side micro targeted. the democrats took it to the next level. >> rove says republicans base their analysis on a single snapshot while obama constantly updated their data. >> the brill yens of tiance of campaign is we need to dynamically do this so as event came into a campaign so we can exploit the openings. >> on election night the romney cavern h camp had no idea what was hitting them. i wonder if that was behind the evenings most talked about television moment. >> one of the biggest blocks of votes in the state are republican suburbs. >> rove was talking to the romney campaign they still believed their man could win. >> they believed it. >> and they believed it. as a matter of fact you are absolutely right hamilton county historically democratic party went into the obama column. >> rove insists republicans can compete and will even win this new political arms race that will excite many gop partisans who just want a victory. but will this new way

filed its application. >> bill: like karl rove. >> bill: right.es this -- you filed a lawsuit against the i.r.s. so now the burden you believe lies on the i.r.s. >> well, the i.r.s. filed a motion to dismiss our lawsuit and in fact, tomorrow, we're filing a response to that. and their argument is we don't have standing to bring the suit. that we can't argue about this. we can't tell the i.r.s. hey you need to fix this. this is why there is room for congress to do something. congress can insist that this regulation be changed. congress can get rid of this. congress can insist that 501(c)(4) organizations no longer be involved in political activity and say hey, move it over to a 527 if that's what you want to do. >> bill: last night the president steps into the east room and he said they've accepted the resignation of acting commissioner steven miller. and they put new safeguards in place. does that fix the problem? >> it doesn't remotely begin to fix the problem. you've still got the primary purpose language in the regulation. you still have no def

and karl rove who starts this with cross roads gps has apparently defined primarily 49.9%. and i would ask is there any adult in america who has had a romantic relationship who thinks 49.9% of the time is exclusive. >> this is a sexy segment. >> yeah, that's what i'm trying. trying hard there, toure. if you go to the page for cross roads you won't find social welfare or sink, or any of those terms. what you'll find is a lengthy attack on president obama. i'm glad people want to challenge president obama. but it's not with the tax here. the real scandal here is that these organizations should not be allowed with a tax exemption to engage in this behavior. and the problem faced by the irs workers is, the irs in real terms has been trumped 17% in the last ten years and its work burden has gone like this. guess what, people are trying to find out ways to get around this. you don't have to ask the irs for permission to be a 501 c-4, you can self-declare. some of the groups that did, we now know from their documentation basically put a target on themselves, we'd like approval to

the biggest blocks of votes out in the state are the republican suburbs inside hamilton county. >> rovealking to the romney campaign. and they still believed their man could win. >> they believed it? >> they believed it. they believed it. as a matter of fact, at the end of the night, hamilton county, historically republican county gets carried by republicans in most elections went into the obama cal um. >> rove insists that republicans can compete and will win the new arms race that will excite gop partisans who just want a victory. will this new way of politics just give us better manipulators better than leaders. >> what happened to trying to sell an idea to people and convince voters this idea is worth voting for? >> you put your finger on a good thing. if you rely on the data to dictate everything to you, you make no room for leadership. responsibility of leadership is not simply to follow but to mold public opinion in the right direction. >> as we've just seen, data is power. so how would you feel about a new government data center big enough to collect and store every phone call,

we will check in with karl rove.fox news has obtained tonight what the whistleblowers will be saying during tomorrow's explosive benghazi hearings. when we come back, the father of tyrone woods. remember he was a brave hero and one of the brave americans sadly killed in the benghazi terrorist attack. ice father joins us in studio. also tonight we are getting incredible feedback on the video of the day options. take a look at your third option tonight. you choose the video of the day. former u.s. marine standing up and confronting senator joe mansion. >> right now you are spending money at an alarming pace. if somebody doesn't do something to stop it, we will sink. sure that we were on schedule. the first technology of its kind... mom and dad, i have great news. is now providing answers families need. siemens. answers. a great cup of coffee should be easy as one, two... well, just one. new single serve cafe collections from maxwell house now available for use in the keurig k-cup brewer. always good to the last drop. w

principles which is like enforce the law the way congress wrote it but i'm not going to find karl rove into a terrible job with this last election ok you know with all that money it didn't do anything but we do voting age tacoma park maryland a small city outside of washington d.c. as voted to lower the voting age to sixteen and the council ordered that the motive behind this was to to get more people involved in government the democratic. process this is the first time in i think the history of the united states although i don't know maybe early on there wasn't a voting age all of that but people just assumed adulthood but maybe by sixteen you were adults i don't know but any oh right now you get a driver's license of fifteen in some states most states though universally at sixteen if somebody can drive you know six thousand pounds of steel down the highway to eighty miles an hour why shouldn't they be able to go i mean it's i mean people have been questioning driving it i mean i have an eleven year old i'm thinking oh my gosh in five years he's going to be able to drive i mean it jus

we will check in with karl rove.lso fox news has obtained tonight what the whistleblowers will be saying during tomorrow's explosive benghazi hearings. when we come back, the father of tyrone woods. remember he was a brave hero and one of the brave americans sadly killed in the benghazi terrorist attack. ice father joins us in studio. also tonight we are getting incredible feedback on the video of the day options. take a look at your third option tonight. you choose the video of the day. former u.s. marine standing up and confronting senator joe mansion. >> right now you are spending money at an alarming pace. if somebody doesn't do something para mis blancos solo uso el detergente tide vivid y el boost. traducele. she only uses tide vivid detergent plus boost for her whites. y me de los blancos viendose como nuevos, lavado tras lavado. that part's true. ese es mi tide, cual es el tuyo? that part's true. are you still sleeping? just wanted to check and make sure that we were on schedule. the first technology of its k

what has karl rove done to improve the social welfare of the united states? >> hmm. wait. nothing.e end of the day, the tea party movement was an astroturf movement that moved from state to state, city to city. they were built on the same social and financial model so there was a template going around. how do you raise a tea party movement in your community? and so when you investigate one, because they've stepped over the line, they have endorsed candidates, they have gotten involved in outright political speech rather than simply public education. when you investigate one, then it opens up all others because they followed the same model. you know, i'm not saying that the irs can't be overly intrusive. i've been subject to audit, myself. they certainly can be. but to this selective outrage, please miss me with that. you know, at the end of the day when you look at the tea party and you look at what, you know, people like karl rove did, the very united states that they wanted to take back, they did want want to share their hard-earned dollars with. they were using these tax shelter

at they did with karl rove, with all the conservatives in the tea party. this was targeted and a political weapon. you ed to do away i with it. >> toby, that's to the point. this is not just about taxes. this w targeting a specific political group, and we've seen it, you know, for the last decade different types. >> i also found it interesti that the president mad the speech at ohio state a uple weeks ago saying how, you know, there's going to be people who tell you that, you know, tyranny is right arnd the corner. don't believe those people because they're making it up. they weren't making it up. it's probably deeper. if this was the only thing, i'd be very surprised, brenda. right. the flat tax takes that power away, nmber o. number two, we'll be all so prosperous and working so much, we wouldn't have time to care about this ma lar key. >> steve, go ahead. you're laughing again. >> yes. you know, you're talking about eliminating deductions. you're not talking about taxing capital gains at the same rate that you tax interest on bank accounts. >> sure i am

rove. thanks and directly ahead. hillary clinton for president? will that scenario be affected by the benghazi hearings? brit hume has some thoughts. redneck day in arizona. those rep >> bill: hume zone segment tonight. latest polling has clinton way out in front in the nomination in 2016. it's hers if she wants it. widely believed that president obama will help mrs. clinton get off to an early and fast start in her quest to be be president. right now the only negative on current resume is the murder of the u.s. ambassador in libya. joining us now from washington fox news senior analyst brit hume. do you know where hillary clinton was? we just went over where president clinton was. he was on in the white house hours after the attack on benghazi. where was hillary? was she working? >> so far she was in town and on duty when this happened. >> bill: we don't have any time line about what she did or what she said. >> we do not. guess to the fact that she wasn't closely questioned about that when she was before the committee on capitol hill which was a

organization whose activists appear tobin consistent with tax status is the group cofounded by karl rove. why single out crossroads when you did fault mention a single liberal group and there were a bunch applying for tax-exempt status at that point with the name "progress." >> guest: i can tell you flatout because that crossroads organization was boasted about how much money they were raiding as a 501c34. back to the basics, citizens united really unleashed hundreds if not thousands of organizations seeking tax-exempt status to play in political campaigns. the law we wrote as congress said that they had to exclusively be engauged in social welfare and not politics and campaigning. here is the i.r.s. troying to decide whether these organizations, really, come ploy with the law. crossroads was exhibits a, they were boastful. >>chris: briefly, senator, why not, because we are now in the mess we are in because of political targeting, why not send a letter that says go after any group of any political persuasion, why not refrain from singling out a conservative group and mentioning liberal g

karl rove was boasting and saying raise millions dollars. i knew that if they investigated this group, every other group would be on notice. i said from the beginning there's no basis for targeting within the irs, what w basically say is that all people need to have the law applied to them equally. karl rove is front and center and proud of it. >> let's talk about the president's big speech this week, in which he said that we are entering a new phase in the war on terror. >> beyond afghanistan. we must define our effort not as a boundless global war on terror. but rather as a series of persistent target d efforts to dismantle specific networks of violent extremists that threaten america. >> senator durbin, the president said that the wars must end, the cold war lasted for 40 years. isn't there a danger in declaring an end to this war too soon? >> james madison was quoted by the president and he said, if you want to preserve freedom, it's difficult to do with a continuous war. what the president is saying to us -- >> would you have said that

rove, i helped found providing over half. i don't mean to single him out as the only bad active because there are many representatives in the entire local spectrum but this is the nature of the beast it is a reason that you seek a 501(c)(4) status because you can hide, as your donors, and you also have a tax advantage otherwise you don't need to seek the 501(c)(4) advantage. so the reason that people -- i would like to see what does it cost the american taxpayers in the granting of all of these 501(c)(4) is when they're not being used for social welfare but they're being used in essence the political advocacy. final question to the ig. inspector general, did chairman i sent a letter on august 3 of 2012 to all of the inspector general's. reminded of the under the inspector general's that requires i just report particularly likely problems to congress to the agency had

karl rove was making boasts and saying he was going to raise so much money, millions of dollars. i knew if they went in to investigate this group every other group would be put on notice. i said from the beginning, chris there is no basis for targeting within the irs. what we need to say is all groups need have the law applied to them equally. and in this situation karl rove was front and center and proud of it and that is why i mentioned his organization. >> chris: all right. let's talk about the president's big speech this week in which he said that we are entering a new you phase in the war on terror. take a look at the president's comments. >> beyond afghanistan, we must define our effort not as a boundless global war on terror, but rather as a series of persistent targeted efforts to dismantle specific networks of violent extremists that threaten america. >> chris: senator durbin, the president said wars must end but the fact is the cold war lasted for 40 years. isn't there a danger of declaring an a end to this war too soon? >> you know, james madison was quoted by the pres

here to break it down, karl rove. how are you?ng doa, budget dead on arrival, the confessionatiosequestration faie immigration talks. on top of that, obamacare, even his own party says it's a disaster. >> yeah. not a good start to the year. look, the president has two problems. you've touched on one of them. that is that the agenda he's pursuing is not popular, even within members of his own party. guns, the sequester strategy, the budget -- do you realize we rated from february until april for the president to present his budget? he presented it three months late. there's no democrat who's rushing to have it voted on in either the house or the senate. so the issues he chose and the positions he took, and the substance of what he was advocating was simply not popular among even his own party. there's a separate problem, and that's the tone and approach. he kicked off the year by taking his campaign apparatus, obama for america, turning it into organizing for action, so he'll use his campaign as a pressure group, as a lobby group t

they ran hundreds of millions of ads across the country. >> carl rove can speak for himself. that has never been an issue. has never come up remotely as an issue. >> i think it is an issue. >> i'm not sure they were investigate. be i the way the liberal groups. >> they should be investigated as well. >> the naacp was a c 3. c 3s are not permitted to do -- what did the bush irs half-two years determine that naacp did? nothing wrong. >> all right. so they let them go. no one complained for two years when they were being vecked. >> listen, they didn't go after tea party group after tea party group. >> a black group vs. a tea party group, what itself difference? >> you have other stuff. go down the list. the irs first of all was targeting anti-abortion groups. they negotiated with unf them. please don't picket on the planned parenthood group. what is the irs group doing telling them that. that's crazy. a retired army officer the irs challenged his church tax exempt donations because they found out he was contributing to conservative causes. the irs challenged a group involved in

karl rove is still with us. karl, your thoughts about these numbers?ery curious and very suspicious. curious because that's an odd nues >> that's an odd number of times. i was in the white house nearly 7 years. mark iberson, once he went to the irs, i never saw him again. he's on record saying he came to the white house one time as irs commissioner. so the idea that the irs commissioner is coming to the white house every 9 days ought to raise warning flags right off the bat. this is an independent agency that needs to have distance from the white house. it shouldn't be part of the white house. it should be distant from the white house. we know what's happened when the white house has gotten to close to the irs and vice versa. we should be very dubious about this because of the way that mr. shulman handled it. when he was asked in front of congress, at that time they knew about 118 appearances at the white house. he responded -- they said what are you doing here? he said, it was an easter egg roll. that's not a very good way to explain why you were ther

rove. thanks and directly ahead. hillary clinton for president?l that scenario be affected by the benghazi hearings? brit hume has some thoughts. redneck day in arizona. those reports after these messages. the boys used double miles from their capital one venture card to fly home for the big family reunion. you must be garth's father? hello. mother. mother! traveling is easy with the venture card because you can fly airline anytime. two words. double miles! this guy can act. wanna play dodge rock? oh, you guys! and with double miles you can actuay use, you never miss the fun. beard growing conte and go! ♪ win! what's in your wallet? ♪ now you can give yourself a kick in the rear! v8 v-fusion plus energy. natural energy from green tea plus fruits and veggies. need a little kick? ooh! could've had a v8. in the juice aisle. if you're suffering from constipation, miralax or metamucil may take days to work. or faster relief, try dulcolax laxative tablets. dulcolax provides gentle relief overnight unlike miralax and metamucil that can take up to 3 days.

rove. thanks and directly ahead. hillary clinton for president? will that scenario be affected by the benghazi hearings? brit hume has some thoughts. redneck day in arizona. redneck day in arizona. those reps ] [ dennis ] allstate wants everyone to be protected on the road. whether you're an allstate customer or not. all you have to do is call. [ female announcer ] call and sign up for good hands roadside assistance today. [ dennis ] are you in good hands? i don'without goingcisions ato angie's list first. you'll find reviews on home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. with angie's list, i know who to call, and i know the results will be fantastic. angie's list -- reviews you can trust. are you still sleeping? just wanted to check and make sure that we were on schedule. the first technology of its kind... mom and dad, i have great news. is now providing answers families need. siemens. answers. tony used priceline to book this 4 star hfree breakfast why. with express deals, you can save big and find a hotel with free breakfast wit

done to improve the social welfare -- >> well, this morning on fox news sunday, karl rove connected naacp about how they have used it for years as a political organization. i mean, they're running for cover anywhere they possibly can to put this on the president's desk that he knew everything and that he -- >> oh, he dictated it! >> he was using it to make sure he would get re-elected. >> there's a better thing that came out this weekend. they seem so uncertain that they can tie it to the president, that they've decided they don't have to. and peggy noonan said it today. she called it a dog whizstle. because the president campaigned against the tea party and against citizens united, that was as good as telling people in the irs that they should go after his enemiey becauses. because of course everybody knows. >> he hypnotizes people into voting for him. >> everybody who gets audited feels like they're being targeted. we're all human. that's our first basic reaction. why me? why my office? >> and we all know one group was denied their status. and it was a group of democratic women. s

now, jennifer may not like that karl rove and the -- >> i don't want to talk about karl rove, i wantabout the media. let me ask you -- >> they're not doing their job, david. because their job does entail giving treatment to americans. >> your guys are debating the irs and politics of it. my question for you now, david shuster. the trifecta of scandals. ap, benghazi talking points and irs. kicking into high gear, is everything for the next six months going to be media coverage and perhaps overcoverage of the obama administration on these questions? >> the way these scand ldz tend to work, if there is an ongoing criminal investigation, it goes to the fbi. the fbi tends to operate in secret or a special counsel and the best you can get is who is going to a grand jury. i think this disappears into 30 days. >> you have hearings by congress on a number of these topics. one of the things that broke these open were congressional hearings and that is not going to be disswayed by any irs investigation -- >> i'm giving jennifer the last word. i'm giving jennifer the last word. david. >> those o

karl rove is still with us. karl, your thoughts about these numbers?y curious and very suspicious. curious because that's an odd number of times. i was in the white house for nearly seven years. mark erey etson, he went to the j8-[ irs commissioner. it ought to raise warning flags off the bat. this is an independent agency that should have distance from the white house. it should be distant from the white house. we know what's happened before when the white house has gotten too close to the irs, and the irs has gotten too close to the white#fpn:u". house.ç when mr. shulman was asked in front of congress, at the time they knew about 118 appearances at the white house he respond e was there forç an easter egg roll. that's not a very good way to explain why you were there every nine days during your tenure as irs commissioner for nearly fouç years. i'm dubious about this. this is a question we need to have a lot of answers to. the answers are going to be difficult, because the point at which the white house is going to assert executive privilege and say

looking at carol rove's track record with success -- >> stephanie: i know i'm like oh, good.ans she is going to win by an even bigger landslide. the problem is they -- the problem is the explosion of 501 cgroups is really a problem, and they have exploded after citizens united. and the irs has been unwilling or unable to regulate them properly. perhaps thanks to the fact that they don't have a director, perhaps that would do their job better if they had someone in charge. and i love john boner screaming -- why can't i see that benghazi -- oh, i was invited to see them two weeks ago. oh, i look like a big orange boner. so the fact that some of the folks responsible were looking for a way to flag potential dubious groups was understandable, however they -- >> they did it in a clumsy way. >> but obama was too quick to take the blame for it. >> stephanie: my boyfriend michael tomasky says the opposite. it's because -- it's the main stream media. he was saying it is time that allows these things to become scandals because we have nothing else to cover. and i think he very strongly

>> well, first of all, i think karl rove has lost his mind.a little bit of him losing his mind on election night when he wanted to call for a recount in ohio. and for him to put out an ad attacking a potential candidate who may never run three years from now, karl, get a life, take up tennis or do something. that's number one. number two, hillary clinton's stint as secretary of state, she'll be like a pitcher who had 20 wins and 2 losses during her stint as secretary of state. you know, if this is a blot on her record, her record was almost perfect in the eyes of the american people, and this won't have any long-lasting effect. i guarantee you three years from now if hillary clinton is a candidate, less than 5% of the american people will remember this. look, this is all about spin. it's not about cover-up. it's about spin. if there was a cover-up, let me repeat, the president of the united states, whose administration is supposedly orchestrating this cover-up, wouldn't have admitted it was a terrorist attack. he wouldn't have used those words