to get vicious, hire roy cohn." >> roy m. esquire. he was out on the party circuit. he saw and knew a lot of things. >> he had dirt on a lot of people. he wanted to spread dirt on a lot of people. >> there were times when i actually saw him dictating copy for gossip columns, which i found really fascinating. >> roy cohn and murdoch became friendly. and in fact, cohn represented murdoch at some point. >> there isn't anything i would not do, because i believe there's only one answer in an adversary profession like law, and that is winning. >> cohn was easily, of all the people i've profiled or done interviews with, was the single worst human being i've ever encountered. cohn would boast about you never apologize. you never go on defense. you always go on offense. >> deny everything, admit nothing, launch counter attack. attack, attack, attack. >> attack, attack, attack, attack. >> don't accept it, don't compromise. kill them. >> do you have a very special wish? >> and hyperbole is not a lie. what trump said to me when i intervi

. >> roy cohn. >> if you need somebody to get riches, hire roy cohn. >> he was on the party circuit. had dirt on a lot of people. he wanted to spread dirt on a lot of people. i saw him dictating copy for gossip columns, which i found fascinating. >> rupert murdoch and cohn became friendly. cohn represented murdoch at some point. >> i believe there is one answer in an adversary profession like law, and that is winning. >> cohn was easily in all the people i have fprofiled, interviews with, the single worst human being i ever encountered. >> cohn would boast about you never apologize, you never go on defense, you always go on offense. deny everything, admit nothing, launch counterattack. attack, attack, attack. >> don't accept it. don't compromise. kill 'em. ♪ happy birthday to you ♪ >> a special wish. >> and hyperbole is not a lie. trump said to me when i interviewed him, cohn is my mentor. rupert knew if you get in the likes of roy cohn, you are getting in with this rising conservative power brokers of the united states. it's meant to be. toast y try all three flavors. only at ihop.

roy cohn, what did he learn from roy cohn? so roy cohn becomes trump's lawyer in 1973, when trump and his father and their business are being sued by the justice department for racially discriminatory housing practices. and cohn tells trump, fight like hell and trump learns a couple of things. one is that you can use the court system interchangeably with public relations. you can shout as loud as possible and try to keep whoever is challenging you at bay for a while. that way, you can threaten and intimidate and menace, even if you settle, you won't say you're settling. and most specifically, what he learned is that the role of a lawyer could be turned into something almost like a mafia don, like just something completely different than than what lawyers are supposed to do. a longtime trump friend has said to me on several occasions. trump likes lawyers who are willing to do anything. well, did he turned himself into a mafia don? i mean, he gave six apartments in trump tower to the mistress of a big mobster, and he flew john g

roy cohn, on behalf of murdoch, and murdoch himself, extend invitations to the reagan team.ow about an interview for one of our star correspondents? and the short of it is that the reagan staff either drops the ball or doesn't care and they rebuck him. at the time murdoch is furious. so roy cohn, in fact, writes a couple of letters to the very inner sanctum of the reagan administration and he writes, i had one interest when i first brought rupert murdoch and governor reagan together, that was at least one major publisher in this country would become and remain pro-reagan. the anger is dripping off the page. >> that's so good. >> and a deputy assistant to reagan himself writes back to say, i'm sure you are aware of our continued high regard for mr. murdoch personally and our appreciation of the importance of what he is doing. it's an incredible show of fealty. >> with every relationship with a politics there is a prid pro kwo and rupert expects some support in exchange for his support. >> and murdoch gets what he wants from reagan, which is basically an unwritten promise for

very impressive donald trump because his best friend was the notorious lawyer boy cohn and roy cohn said you got to you got to do something with this trump fellow because he's a cover he built the trump tower remember that this is in the 8687 period so psy took me along to meet with mr. trump. there was no agent and no lawyer. and trump was so flattered that mr. newhouse a very sort of eminent figure in the world of arts letters would come to his office. he agreed to immediately to a book contract. and the book became art of the deal. there was a writer named tony schwartz or had already pitched a book to trump. and that was the book. and when it came out in december of 87 it event immediately to the top of the best cellist stayed there for six months sold a million copies a million copies clean and of course everybody was already saying well trump bought the cops. i can tell you trump doesn't buy his own book. you know, it's just not made that way. so it was a huge triumph and it certainly launched donald trump as a national figure. and one story i always tell because it's really releva

>> it's a great question, but i think there's parts of he absorbed, before roy cohn, hi famous fixeris life. he absorb it i think from his father. he knew how to cut corners, knew how to handle things certain ways. trump takes everything to an extremely different level. why it is that he seems to have this need and get this charge out of saying something that isn't true, or other times convinces himself something is the case because it feels better, and other times it sounds better. it's all of the above. >> of course, we saw that play out in the oval office as well, as he struggled with the truth over and over again. now you have over 219 candidates. do you think even mr. trump understood he would have that impact on the party? >> i don't. i think he looks at everything in terms of what works for him in short ten-minute increments. the effect it could have on other people, i think he delights in it, feels like he's shaping the party, but i don't think that's the long-term strategy. >> you also talk about his relationship about race over time. it goes back to his father. you also hav

pantheon of illustrious lawyers hired by donald j trump, bearing the names of true luminaries like roy cohnin the 1950s, health senator joe mccarthy in his notorious hunt for communists in the u.s.. and as rudy giuliani did, the disgraceful mayor of new york city. and michael cohen who was, was disbarment in a three-year prison sentence. and then, there's this lawyer. christina bobb this, a former host on the far-right one america news network, who trump reported he hired after watching her on tv defend his stolen election line. yes, that's how he find people to work for him. was bobb at mar-a-lago on the day of the fbi search back in august. she went on tv afterwards refusing to shoot down the ridiculous conspiracy theories that the fbi have planted evidence. >> i don't think that there was actually anything there that's worthwhile. we'll see what they come up with. you know, if they did, it will be interesting, especially since they precluded me from actually watching what they did. but at this point, i don't necessarily think that they'd even go to the extent of trying to plant informati

one of his roy cohn characters. here is roger stone and how he reacted when he realized trump doesn't care about any of these people. he certainly doesn't care about roger stone who has a lot of exposure and he didn't get a pardon which he wanted and a lot of the pr members of congress wanted. here is roger stone melting down. >> jared kushner has an iq of 70. he's coming to miami. we will eject him from miami very quickly. he'll be leaving very quickly. very quickly. he has 100 security guards, i'll have 5,000 security guards. you want to fight? let's fight. [ bleep ] you. [ bleep ] you and your abortionist daughter. >> so that is supposed to be his friend, kurt. when i saw that, the first thing i thought is how long before we get a video like that of kevin mccarthy. on january 6th, kevin mccarthy was also melting down like that, screaming at donald trump. yet, he's back to being a sycophant. >> well, joy, just goes to show that donald trump surrounds himself with -- it's really this den of thieves, that they're al

>> he wants his -- roy cohn out there.ms of pushback. it's been hard to push back on what's been presented by the january 6th committee because it's coming from trump's own aides including some who still work for him. it's coming from a bunch of republicans and it's in some ways his own words and actions. it's been difficult for republicans to figure out how to launch a full-throated defense of trump in light of the way that the evidence has been presented. >> but the messaging -- >> they don't have a lot of oopgs. >> their messaging is so bizarre, though. it's not just a different message from the great communicator ronald reagan. it's a troll account. i mean, house republican conference. they post memes of johnny depp. they talk about -- they praise kanye west just a couple of days before kanye west went on a anti-semitic rant. they don't take it down. i don't know who it is for. >> it is for a whole segment. there is a whole segment of the republican base right now that is very, very online. they are all about just stic