, and her daughter, shea moss. >> ruby freeman and shea freeman moss and one other gentleman quite obviously surreptitiously passing around. >> giuliani used this video to push a conspiracy theory that somehow with usb sticks and secret boxes of ballots, ruby freeman and shea moss helped to steal the election from donald trump in georgia. in trump's infamous call pressuring george raffensperger to find him nearly 12,000 votes, trump himself brought up ruby freeman and brought her up 18 times. he called her a professional scammer and a hustler. to this day you can still find that video pushing baseless conspiracies about freeman and moss, you can still find it on trump's official youtube page. none of the allegations against ruby freeman and shea moss are true. they were doing their jobs. they broke no laws. the illicit thing they passed each other was not a usb stick. it was a ginger mint. so when mr. giuliani made this major concession last night, no longer contesting he lied about moss and freeman in their defamation case against him, he did that, it was national news. and now today mr. gi

stopped contesting the claim that he made false statements about two georgia election workers, ruby freeman inter daughter. shea moss. >> ruby and for a shush -- and one other gentlemen -- usb ports in the vials of heroin or cocaine. >> after the 2020 election, rudy giuliani used this video to push a conspiracy theory that somehow with the usb sticks and secret boxes of balance, ruby freeman and shea moss had helped him to steal the election from donald trump in georgia. he infamous called pressuring georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger to find him nearly 12,000 votes, trump himself brought up ruby freeman. he brought her up 18 times. he called her a professional scammer and hustler. to this day, you can still find that video pushing baseless conspiracy theories about freeman and moss. you can still find it on trump's official youtube page. none of the allegations against ruby freeman and shaye moss are true. they were doing their jobs, they broke no laws and the illicit thing that they passed each other was not the usb stick. it was a ginger mint. when mr. giuliani made this major

ruby freeman. even the phony ballots of ruby freeman. known scammer.internet, you know what was trending on the internet? where's ruby? because they thought she'd be in jail. where's ruby? i'll take on anybody you want with regard to ruby freeman and her lovely daughter, very lovely young lady, i'm sure. r ruby freeman, every single ballot she did went to biden. did you ever check the ballots that were scammed by ruby freeman, a known political operative ballotier. >> and ruby freeman testified about these statements and the impact it's had on her life. >> there is no where i feel safe. nowhere. do you know how it feels to have the president of the united states target you? the president of the united states is supposed to represent every american, not to target one. but he targeted me, lady ruby, a small business owner, a mother, a proud american citizen who stands up to help fulton county run an election in the middle of the pandemic. >> yes, a lot of threats wishing death upon me, telling me that, you know, i'll be in jail with my mother and saying

ruby freeman, even the phony ballots of ruby freeman. known scammer. trending on the internet? where is ruby. because they thought you would be in jail. where is ruby? i will take on anybody that you want with regard to ruby freeman. and her lovely daughter, very lovely young woman, i am sure. ruby freeman, one thing i forgot to say, which is the most important. you know that every single about that she did went to biden. did you ever checked the ballots that were scammed by ruby freeman? a known political operative ballot here. >> ruby freeman and sheamus testified about the impact of these lives, and slurs had on their lives to the house like to be on generous cluster. >> there is no where i feel safe. nowhere. do you know how it feels to have the president of the united states target you? the president of the united states is supposed to represent every american. not to target one. but he targeted me. lady ruby. a small business owner, a mother, a proud american citizen. who's standing up to help fulton county run their election in the middle of the

joining me now is one of the attorneys representing ruby freedom freeman and shaye moss. so michael, let me start off by asking you how are ruby and shaye doing? they've had quite a rough pass two and a half years. >> hey, jan, thanks for the question, and thanks for having me on. they are, they are warriors and they are heroes. but this has been really tough. this has been devastating for both of them personally, and being as essentially a volunteer election official trying to do your job and your duty, i don't think anyone who goes into that position ever anticipates being made the subject of a campaign of harassment and defamation, and having your name mentioned on a phone call 18 times where the president of the united states. so the consequences have been severe for them in their lives, but they are absolutely committed to moving forward and taking what are really courageous actions to bring to light what has happened to them and to initiate a process that we have now had a significant milestone in to establish the truth about the jobs that they did, and that truth is

i think the woman in charge here is a ruby freeman. and it occurred authors name is shaye freeman moss. i was helping real helping earlier. earlier in the navy's tour engaged in another apparent voter fraud. in which they were passing out usb ports which were being used, apparently, to infiltrate the crooked dominion voting machines. >> there it is. there is a smoking gun that will determine where and how rudolph giuliani lives the rest of his life. you just heard rudolph giuliani committing the crime of making false statements to georgia officials. it is also the crime of improperly influencing government officials, which is a separate crime in georgia and because he was soliciting the georgia house of representatives to overturn the presidential election, what rudolph giuliani just said is the crime in georgia of, quote, solicitation to commit election fraud, which carries a mandatory minimum prison sentence of one year. some of the other crimes rudolph giuliani committed in that video carry a maximum sentence of five years in prison.

what would ruby freeman and shaye moss say? then what happens in the situation where giuliani is facing disbarment in new york state and washington, d.c. as well as what happens with the special counsel investigators, what do they say his -- one of his political advisers is putting out a statement as well saying that he's not acknowledging that the statements were false, but he's not contesting them, that this is a legal issue, not a factual issue. rahel? >> katelyn polantz, great to have you sort of explain what he was conceding torques what he wasn't conceding to and certainly the implications of all of this. katelyn polantz live in washington. thank you. >>> just moments ago hunter biden did arrive at the courthouse in wilmington, delaware, at federal court. let's take a look at this video. we can see some people right there, somewhere in there there is hunter biden arriving at the courthouse in wilmington, delaware, where he will appear before a federal judge and enter this plea agreement pleading guilty to two misdemeanor

giuliani also repeated the lies when he answered questions by the january 6th committee. >> ruby freeman and freeman moss and one other gentleman passing around usb ports as if they're vials of heroin or cocaine. it's obvious to anyone who is a criminal investigator or prosecutor they are engaged in illegal testimony. >> the toll those statements, false statements he's now conceding, had on their lives. >> i've lost my name and i've lost my reputation. i've lost my sense of security all because a group of people starting with number 45 and his ally, rudy giuliani, decided to scapegoat me and my daughter. >> i don't want to go anywhere. i second get everything that i do. it's affected my life in a major way. in every way. all because of lies. >> cnn senior crime and justice reporter kaitlyn polantz, that was some of the most compelling, memorable testimony that entire committee heard and now rudy giuliani is conceding what he said wasn't true? >> yeah. poppy this is a really unusual and very really tricky move that giuliani is trying to make here in court. essentially he's trying to make

hey, brad, why wouldn't you want to check out ruby freeman? >> so, this is all about accountability. and it's also connected to the special counsel's probe into january 6th. jack smith's team subpoenaed that video wherein giuliani falsely claimed that the election workers were committing crimes. it's video from the state farm arena in atlanta, georgia, video which, thanks in part to giuliani, had become a favorite go-to example of alleged election fraud for election deniers and big lie peddlers. and the accountability doesn't stop here. giuliani's law license has already been suspended in new york, and he faces permanent disbarment in washington, d.c. as for trump's other lawyers, sidney powell was sanctioned for baseless voter fraud claims. jenna ellis was censured. john eastman is fighting to hold on to his law license. jeffrey clark faces a disciplinary hearing in washington, d.c., and lynn wood retired suddenly amid disciplinary hearings. joining me now, michael cohen, the host of the podcast mea culpa. michael, always so good to see you,

let's start by listening a little bit to what he was saying about them, ruby freeman and shayne mossho were in georgia working in the vote counting in atlanta. >> ruby freeman and shayne moss and another gentleman surreptitiously passing around usb ports as if they were vials of heroin or cocaine. i mean, it's obvious to anyone who is a criminal, investigator or prosecutor that they were engaged in surreptitious, illegal activity again that day. >> so rudy giuliani now is coming and saying that he does concede that he made those statements, that those statements are false and that they can be defamatory. now that they are suing, but he's trying to contain it to just this lawsuit. he obviously is facing a lot of different legal risk around the country in georgia, nationally with the federal criminal investigation and we don't know exactly how what he's saying in this lawsuit today is going to factor into that and also, rahel, he is trying to still find a way to eke out some sort of win or at least something that doesn't hurt him too badly in this lawsuit. one of the things that he wan

all these things turned out not to be true, but he really created a narrative about ruby freeman andss that really has, they say, followed them for months after the 2020 election. >> both said they were afraid to simply leave their house that they could be followed or threatened. pretty serious situation. alyssa, you're a former trump official who actually left during these efforts to try to overturn the 2020 presidential election. how were you processing giuliani's legal woes right now? >> well, it's remarkable that i guess he's telling the truth two years later. but at the same time, some of his other kind of compatriots in this moment, sidney powell has when she was challenged in court admitted that a lot of what she was pushed was, in fact, not based in fact. jenna ellis another attorney he appeared with a number of times herself admitted to ten misrepresentations related to the election lies. so i maneean, the chickens are coming home to roost. you can't look at ruby freeman and shae moss and be heartbroken over the personal peril this put them through. thunderstorm a bigger mor

to count the votes. >> ruby freeman and shaye freeman-moss and one other gentleman quite obviously passingund usb ports as if they're vials of heroin or cocaine. >> reporter: those women both suing giuliani for defamation. the court documents say he, for the purposes of this litigation only, does not contest the factual allegations. the mother and daughter told the january 6th committee how giuliani's comments devastated their lives. >> now, i won't even introduce myself by my name anymore. i get nervous when i bump into someone i know in the grocery store who says my name. i'm worried about who is listening. >> i no longer give out my business card. i don't transfer calls. i don't want anyone knowing my name. >> reporter: david, we have a statement from giuliani's attorney and i want to be precise. he said, giuliani was not acknowledging making false statements, only that he was not contesting these facts. regardless, david, what is clear is that the reputations of these women was unfairly tainted. >> david: but not contesting the facts. all right, pierre thomas, thank you. >>> in london

and -- ruby freeman. they accused giuliani of scapegoating them -- statements like this. >> ruby freeman and shoot for men -- and one other gentlemen quite obviously surreptitiously passing around usb ports, as if they are vials of heroin or cocaine. >> this is the type of thing he may be reaching a settlement with them over. with us now is sarah matthews, who was trump white house deputy press detectors terry, who also testified to the committee, like those two women did. thanks for being with us. what is your view on the settlements. the idea that giuliani might have to pay for them on what he might do for them? >> i'm happy to see accountability happen, because it is a shame for what ruby freeman and sheamus have been through. we should never have had to go through this in the first. plus the fact of the matter is that one man, donald trump cannot accept the verdict that he lost the 2020 election, and so he can contacted conspiracy theories with his associates like giuliani to try to overturn the elect

former personal attorney, rudy giuliani, has admitted he defamed to georgia election workers -- ruby freeman and her daughter shaye moss suffered with threats to their lives after -- we'll giuliani face consequences for the damage he's done? plus, a stunning day in court today for hunter biden. he thought he had a deal, and then it all fell apart. the judge -- whether a deal was constitutional. so, what is going on now? and, paging moulder and sculley, the x-files comes to congress. three retired military veterans testified today at house hearing on ufos. they say they are a national security problem, demanding the government stop keeping all this under wraps. i've personally spoken to a navy pilot who told me, for a while, he and other pilots -- see ufos on a daily basis. objects like this -- >> -- tango -- >> oh! got it -- >> roger -- shooting -- >> [bleep] -- >> -- >> no -- oh, my gosh, dude. >> -- [laughter] -- >> we hope you get that excited about this show. we've got a lot to talk about tonight. let's begin with a dramatic day in court for hunter biden. when the judge refused to accept

he has now said this. >> ruby freeman and shea moss and one other jenna meant quite obviously passing around usb ports as if they are vials of heroin or cocaine. it is obvious to anybody that is a prosecutor that they are engaged in criminal activity. >> i wanted to remind people that it is not true in these two women suffered because of it, he is saying he is protected by free speech, is he? >> this is about defamation. this is demonization and public scapegoating. what giuliani alleged today is baseless. i worked with him many years ago. there is very little to no resemblance to the person i worked for, he was one of the most respected prosecutors. he said this is about stopping discovery which would be a mess in the case of rudy giuliani but it is a concession in effect that all of those accusations made publicly were lies. >> what can they do about it? will he face some sort of punishment? >> i think he might. he is trying to minimize how much trouble he can get in by owning it. the problem is, that is potentially evidence and other lawsuits and he admitted to a central part of wh

ruby freeman and her daughter shea moss were anything but that. they were simply two dedicated election workers performing their civic duty in the 2020 presidential election. but because of giuliani and trump, they faced harassment and violent threats. ms. freeman had to temporarily abandon her own home for her own safety. and now they are suing rudy giuliani rudy giuliani over his baseless claims about them. perhaps rudy's actions should not be that surprising given that he admitted under oath in 2021 that he made no effort to verify some of the claims he was hawking. i should also note in the same court filing yesterday, giuliani doesn't concede to any damages based on his false claims, and his lawyer seemed to suggest that it was merely a legal maneuver to get beyond the fact-gathering stage and into the legal fight. it doesn't matter to trump or giuliani that using them as pawns would unleash maga cult members on them. >> i start my life upside down. i no longer give out my business card. i don't transfer calls. i don't want anyone knowing my

. >> shaye moss and ruby freeman, i was going to ask you about them next. >> and we heard about whatd to them because they were simply doing their jobs as election workers, trying to ensure fair and free election. in that part of our country. so, you know, is it the person who was threatened, the voter whose vote was diluted, a member of congress who tried to cast an electoral vote, the electors from a particular state who were genuine, but who came from a state in which a fraudulent state of electors was submitted. i don't quite know who the victim will be. that's the detail we'll see in the indictment, when and if it comes. i think it's a very interesting issue. in the end, the government at trial would have to prove that somebody was injured, somebody was deprived of that right to vote or have their vote counted. >> on that subject, i was going to ask, what does it say to you that jack smith has seasoned the surveillance footage from the voting place that ruby freeman and shaye moss were working at, the state farm arena down there in fulton county. is that because he wants to revi

ruby freeman and her mother, they were both harassed basically. people coming to their homes. their jobs. they basically were at risk of losing their livelihoods all because of these lies, and then of course there's what happened on january 6th. a real direct line between what's being alleged here and what transpired on january 6th, which ultimately ended in death and destruction at the united states capitol and attempted insurrection on the united states. >> laura, what does this mean for giuliani's other legal peril in georgia, for example, and the special counsel election meddling probes that are going on? his potential for disbarment in washington, d.c., there are already recommendations that he lose his law license, right? >> yes, and all of the data that's accumulated and the evidence that is gathered in support of one person's claim could also be used actually foun foundationally in another. there are things that could be looked at in the civil context in particular to determine whether or not this person has some kind of liability. also, it becomes a blueprint of sorts

ruby freeman and shay moss are suing the form ser trump attorney.g for statements like this. >> how can they say there's no fraud? look at that woman, lookal them scurrying around with the battle. nobody in the room. they look like they're passing out dope, not just battle. it's quite clear they're staying votes. >> and like this. >> you can see them counting the ballots more than once. two, three, four, times. you would have tore a moron not to realize that's voter fraud. >> jugiuliani based it on this video. watch the whole thing. it shows what georgia's secretary of state and experts call normal vote tabulation. the fbi and georgia bureau of investigation found the fraud claims had no merit, but giuliani presented the actions as criminal. so did someone else. we had at least 18,000 that's on tape. we had them counted very painstakingly, 18,000 voters having to do with the ruby freeman. she's a vote scammer, a professional vote scammer and hustler. >> the former president mentioned ms. freema18 times in that infamous phone call with the georgia se

ruby freeman and shaye moss. >> there is no where i feel safe. nowhere. do you know how it feels to have the president of the united states targeting you? >> a lot of threats, wishing death upon me. telling me that i will be in jail with my mother, and saying things like be glad it is 2020 and not 1920. yeah. >> where a lot of these threats and vile comments racist in nature? >> a lot of them were racist. a lot of them were just hateful. but yes, sir. >> if donald trump is facing a conspiracy charge, we will not know until an indictment is made public who his coconspirators might have been. the atlanta journal-constitution is reporting that jackson with's prosecutors, quote, requested surveillance and other security footage recorded at atlanta's state farm arena, according to a subpoena obtained by the atlanta journal-constitution, and a grand jury subpoena dated may 31st. georgia secretary of state's office was directed to hand over any and all security video or security footage, or any other kind of video, any kind depicting or taken at or near state fa

host: you've got a question hereby taxed that says do you feel ruby freeman and shea maas, the georgiaworkers, can sue donald trump for slander? what do you think of that? guest: that's a little outside of my area of expertise. in the law, i think we just saw the lawsuit against donald trump for defamation. it is certainly an avenue that people can pursue against somebody like trump who has been -- who has had a difficult relationship with the truth for certainly his political career but arguably his entire life and certainly for those poll workers in georgia, the kinds of harassment and threats and disruptions to their lives that they have gone through just for trying to do their job and being civil servants is appalling. i certainly hope that they are able to resume their lives, to have their reputations restored. as to the prospect of a lawsuit, i am not steeped enough in specific facts of law there to have a clear opinion about that. host: jay in mississippi, independent, go ahead. caller: good morning. i hadn't seen you on in a while and i thought that western general was hitting

ruby freeman and her daughter shaye moss are suing giuliani over those false claims.january six hearings, they both testified on how those claims completely shattered their lives. >> i lost my reputation. i've lost my sense of security all because a group of people, starting with number 45, and his ally, rudy giuliani, decided to scapegoat me and my daughter, shaye, to push their own lies about how the presidential election was stolen. >> i don't do nothing anymore. i don't want to go anywhere. i second guess everything that i do. it's affected my life in a major way, in every way, all because of lies. >> with that, let's get smarter with the help of our leadoff panel tonight. nbc news investigations correspondent tom winter is here and he was in court today for hunter biden's plea. luke broadwater, pulitzer prize -winning congressional reporter for the new york times. and former u.s. attorney joyce vance who spent 25 years as a federal prosecutor. and, joyce, i have a feeling you are going to be spending the next few weeks on this air 24/7. i want to start, joyce, wi

for the folks at home, i want to remind them what we heard from ruby freeman and shea moss about howir lives were changed. take a listen. >> i have lost my name and i have lost my reputation. i have lost my sense of security. all because a group of people starting with number 45 and his ally, rudy giuliani, decided to scapegoat me and my daughter shea. >> i don't want to go anywhere. i second-guess everything that i do. it's affected my life in a major way. in every way. all because of lies. >> so giuliani is saying sure i made some statements, but, but, but, but i will not concede those statements, right, were defamatory, i won't concede that they really led to this horror that was detailed there. by the way, it was protected as free speech. does this work? >> so, first of all, this was some of the most memorable and searing testimony we saw during the january 6th committee hearings. these women were accused by rudy giuliani and others of committing election fraud crimes. they did nothing wrong. to the contrary, they did their jobs as civil servants. and their lives were torn apart.

and by making these concessions that the statements that he made about ruby freeman and her daughterwere false, he is conceding the most important elements and a defamation case. the reason for the pushback is that he will ultimately try to say, well, these weren't factual statements. they were hyperbole. i wasn't being defamatory. i was just speaking, by example, using colorful language. and so, he will try to have it both ways, avoiding additional discovery, avoiding litigation costs, while at the same time, sneaking by and not being responsible for the defamation charges that have been brought against him. >> wow. luke broadwater, tom winter, joyce vance,, we got a lot, and probably a lot more to cover tonight. when we come back -- with recent good news on the economy, are republicans gonna have to rethink their attacks on bidenomics? david blough and michael steele are here on that. and later, former trump white house aide miles taylor is here with a warning about what a possible second term for donald trump could look like. the 11th hour just getting underway on wednesday night.

trump actually mentioned ruby freeman in that infamous call with the georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger. >> she's a vote scammer, a professional vote scammer and hustler. ruby freeman. >> just to be very clear here, secretary raffensperger has made it clear that ruby and her daughter were cleared of any wrongdoing after a year's long investigation by the georgia state election board. trump's claim about her and what happened with her at that arena was all made up. prosecutors are going through that video evidence. as we await this possible criminal indictment against the former president, possibly hours away now. paula reid is "outfront" in washington. paula, you've been talking to your sources. what more are they telling you about the possible charges coming against trump? >> reporter: well, erin, a source familiar with the investigation tells me that if the former president is charged that, those charges would be filed here in washington d.c. there was a little bit of confusion over where this case would be filed after, of course, the mar-a-lago documents case was invest

giuliani is now being sued by ruby freeman and her daughter shea moss. during the january 6th hearings, they both testified that their lives were turned upside down by conspiracy theorists who believed false claims about them their lawyer says they look forward to presenting the rest of their case. and a lawyer for giuliani says the former new york mayor decided to concede in order to move on to the part of the case when they could possibly get a motion to dismiss. >>> senate minority leader mitch mcconnell caused a lot of concern when he suddenly stopped speaking during a news conference wednesday >> this week has been good bipartisan cooperation and a string of -- >> mcconnell appeared to freeze for 20 seconds before he was led away from the cameras. an aide said mcconnell felt light-headed and stepped away for a moment he did come back later and told reporters he was fine. two sources tell nbc news mcconnell fell at a d.c. airport earlier this month but was not seriously hurt it is unclear if that had anything to do with this the senator's office decl

years after rudy giuliani accused georgia election workers ruby freeman and shaye moss of fraud during the 2020 election, he is conceding his statements were false. this came in a court filing, part of a defamation lawsuit freeman and moss filed against giuliani in 2021 the case accuses giuliani, at the time you will remember was representing former president trump of publicizing a heavily edited video he falsely alleged, show the two workers somehow changing votes. >> taped earlier in the day of ruby freeman and shaye moss, and one of the gentleman passing around u.s. -- vials of heroin or cocaine. they are walking around georgia, lying. they should have been questioned already. their places of work, homes should have been searched. >> one of the videos we search, mr. giuliani accuses you and your mother of passing a usb drive to each other. what was your mom actually handing you on that video? >> a ginger mint. >> we had at least 18, 000, that's on tape, we had them counted very painstakingly, 18,000 voters having to do with ruby freeman. she's a vote scammer, a professional vote sca

years after rudy giuliani accused georgia election workers, ruby freeman and shaye moss of fraud duringrt filing, part of a defamation lawsuit freeman and moss filed against giuliani in 2021. the case accuses giuliani who at the time you'll remember was representing former president trump of publicizing a heavily edited video he falsely alleged showing the two workers somehow changing votes. >> taped earlier in the day of ruby freeman and shaye freeman moss and one other gentleman purr repetitiously passing around viles of heroin and cocaine. they're still walking around georgia lying. they should have been -- should have been questioned already in their places of work and their homes should have been search sgld in what we just watched, mr. giuliani accused you and your mother of passing some sort of usb driver to each other. what was your mom actually handling you on that video? >> a ginger mint. >> we had at least 18,000, that's on tape, we had them counted very painstakingly, 18,000 voters having to do with ruby freeman. that's -- she's a vote scammer, a professional vote scammer an

scapegoating them in a fabricated effort of how votes were counted with statements like this -- ruby freeman and shea freeman moss, and one other gentlemen, passing around usb ports as if i they are vials of heroin or cocaine. >> he may be reaching a settlement with them. >> with us is sara matthews, who testified to the january 6th committee like those women did. what's you're view on the etlement? >> i'm happy to see accountability happen. it's a shame what they have been put through. the fact of the matter is, one man, donald trump, could not accept the fact that he lost the 2020 election. so, h s, he concocted conspirac theories with his associates and tried to put the target and the blame on other folks. we saw that happen with mike sense and saying he could send electors back to the states. we saw it in this situation with these two women. it has real-world consequences, these election lies. these two women were the target of death threats. they were found to be on a kill list from an oath keeper. it is sat sad. i hope the settlement gives them peace of mind. >> how do you feel about t

filed last tuesday, night he says that claims he made about georgia election workers sheamus and ruby freemancompletely false. in an effort to resolve the defamation's that were brought against him by the two women, giuliani is arguing that the statements were protected speech under the first amendment. what do you make of giuliani's shift and his efforts to not be held liable? >> rev, we both know ready for a long time. i've worked in the administration in the 90s. i don't know anything. the one thing i do know, he's not going to jail for donald trump. he is petrified of going to jail. he has been for a couple of years. the fact that he's willing to go this far, i can't help but think that he is a potential flip. if he has been already for jack smith in either the january six case or the documents case. anywhere rudy has, been he's touched a lot of these issues. my, guess who is going to be a witness for the prosecution and one of these cases. >> for the prosecution of donald trump? >> yes. >> rudy giuliani, looking out for rudy giuliani, really? >> we both know tim along time. i wouldn't be

video was made public and misrepresented as evidence of fraud, two of the women counting ballots, ruby freemanghter, shay moss, were doxed. their faces, names, addresses, phone numbers shared online. a motley crew emerged phoning freeman and showing up at her home. steven lee, a pastor from suburban chicago, parked outside freeman's house until she dialed 911. >> my name's steve lee. >> yep. >> and i'm a pastor. and i'm also working with some folks who are trying to help ruby out. >> okay. >> okay? and also get some truth on what's going on. it would be nice if i could talk to her. >> i don't talk to nobody. >> okay. so you don't want to talk to him? no? okay. >> yeah, i'm not interested. itch a pastor. >> okay. yes, ma'am. >> reporter: almost three weeks later trevian kutee, a publicist who had previously done work for r. kelly and kanye west also showed up in georgia. freeman agreed to talk to kutee at a police precinct. according to court documents kutee allegedly pressured freeman. offering her protection if she would confess to engaging in election fraud, even though freeman had done noth

video was made public and misrepresented as evidence of fraud, two of the women counting ballots, ruby freemanone numbers shared online. they phoned freeman and showed up at her home. a pastor from chicago parked outside freeman's house until she dialed 911. >> my name is steve lee. i'm a pastor. i'm also working with folks who are trying to help ruby out. also get some truth of what's going on. it would be nice if i could talk to her. >> i don't talk to anybody. >> you don't want to talk to him? no? okay. >> i'm not interested. i have a pastor. >> yes, ma'am. >> almost three weeks later, a publicist who had previously done work for r. kelly and kanye west also showed up in georgia. freeman agreed to talk to him at a police precinct. he allegedly pressured freeman. offering her protection if she would confess to engaging in election fraud. even though freeman had done nothing wrong. >> i cannot say what specifically took place. i just know -- [ inaudible ] >> freeman and moss testified in front of the january 6th committee about vile, racist threats they received. >> it turned my life upside d

. >> if ruby freeman and shay moss, and one other gentleman surreptitiously passing arballo as if they'reaine. it's obvious they're engaged in surrepetitious, illegal activity that day. >> not so obvious now. paula reid joins us. there's a lot to parse through. notably while rudy giuliani is conceding to making defamatory statements, he doesn't acknowledge he caused these two women any harm. >> he's trying to contain the fallout. now, this is his effort to resolve a lawsuit and satisfy a judge who has threatened to sanctioned him. essentially what he's saying is yes, he smeared these two election workers, but he argues the claims are protected under the first amendment. he also insists the two women did not suffer any damages, but they see it quite different live. let's listen to their words. >> i've lost my name and i've lost my reputation. i've lost my sense of security, all because a group of people, starting with number 45, and his ally rudy giuliani, decided to scapegoat me and my daughter shay. >> i don't want to go anywhere. i second-guess everything that i do. it affected my life

giuliani, in a statement, giuliani said he, quote, does not contest that his statements about ruby freemanye moss were false and carry meaning that is defamatory. that's not quite an admission, but is it a shift? i want to bring in nbc news justice and intelligence correspondent, ken dilanian. what do we know about this white house meeting back in february of 2020 and why smith is now looking into it? >> reporter: this was a briefing for the president by senior intelligence officials and cyber security officials who explained to him that the u.s. elections system was really difficult to interfere with, difficult to hack. and that they had taken steps to protect it in the wake of attempts by foreign governments, china, russia and others to interfere with american elections. they shored up the system, made it impregnable to hacking and other kinds of interference. president trump, according to our sources appeared to be gratified by that. as you said, you know, cajoled them that maybe they should announce this in a news conference and crow about it, so his administration could get credit, an

ruby freeman was an election worker in georgia, who was forced to pack up and leave her home of 20 yearsn her life. both she and her daughter testified before the january six committee about the damage all of those lies caused them. >> i lost my reputation, i've lost my sense of security, all because a group of people starting with number 45, and his ally rudy giuliani, decided to scapegoat me. me and my daughter. to push their own lies about how the presidential election was stolen. >> i don't want to go anywhere, i second guess everything that i do. it's affected my life in a major way. in every way. all because of lies. >> all because of lives. all because of lies. you know, they were election workers who are just trying to do their jobs, and contribute to the political process. and it was all because of lies. and just this week, rudy giuliani himself was admitted that he himself was not telling the truth in this case. that he was not. as much as he tortured these two women for many years, that he was not being honest about what he stated about them. you could also argue that the repu

law license this week, admitted that he lied about the actions of two georgia election workers, ruby freemanhaye moss. what do you think is the importance of going after trump 's lawyers to get some accountability that way? >> yes. the lawyers are going to be some very important witnesses against donald trump. i hasten to add usually trump's lawyers don't testify against their own clients. except when the client in lists the lawyer to be part and parcel of a fraud. i think that it is interesting to me, mehdi, ordinarily when we're investigating these large scale and conspiracy cases, what we see and what i used to do as a prosecutor is tried to flip people over time. turn them into cooperating witnesses. have them entered guilty pleas, and cooperate. usually you see that pattern emerge publicly. i find it a curiosity that we have found -- we have seen no people of consequence charged and developed as cooperating witnesses. at least not publicly. it may very well be that mark meadows has entered into a contractual agreement with the government to become a co-operator. maybe he has not entered

you could be ruby freeman and shaye moss or you could be jack smith. he does the same thing to everybody. >> deranged is the adjective he uses for jack smith now. law enforcement in washington is preparing for any potential dangers, risks from a potential trump indictment here. you've got security barricades around the fulton county courthouse in georgia where the d.a. there may soon indict trump for his efforts to overturn georgia's election. just today, speaking of the kind of language the former president uses, he called for the special counsel, trump did, and attorney general to be thrown into jail. does this tense atmosphere concern you? this is something trump has done before. of course it's at the center of discussions about january 6th and whether the president's comments at the time helped lead to that violence on that day. >> absolutely. look, what we found out from january 6th is that words matter. the fbi's arrested over a thousand people that participated in that insurrection. many of those that have been charged have plead guilty. and the

bring in the false slates of electors, maybe the threats direct against shea moss and her mother, ruby freeman. it brings together the pieces in one cohesive whole so a jury gets the hear the crime in one scope of the case. i wouldn't be surprised to see a rico. it can take longer, be more complicated but it's an important way to make sure the jury understands the full breadth of all the crime that has occurred. >> the wheels of justice grind slowly. thanks for getting us started this evening. always appreciate the two of you immensely. thanks. >> thanks, katie. >>> coming up, how the january 6th committee paved the wear for what could be a historic indictment of the doj. we're going to talk to a member of that committee live. plus, a trump insider who saw his abuses of power firsthand, and how fox news is trying to prop up ron desantis over controversial history standards. all that and more when we're back in just 60 seconds. 60 sec. i'm a veteran of 23 years. i served three overseas tours. i love to give back to the community. i offer what i can when i can. i started noticing my memory was s

he's conceded that he made defamatory statements about georgia election workers ruby freeman and shay effort of their lawsuit against him. is this something that jack smith could be looking at as well potentially in this case. >> possibly. rudy giuliani has a lot of legal exposure. both criminal and civil following what he said after the 2020 election. this is a civil case but on the criminal side, we know that they are looking into the harassment of election workers and the impact of false claims of fraud and just on election workers trying to do their jobs so the sfeshler special counsel may look at the two election workers. we knew giuliani sat down with investigators over the course of two days. his lawyer insists that he was honest and he was cooperative. small "c", he hasn't flipped and they don't believe he is going to be criminally charged. but at this point it is unclear what will happen to him criminally. but if the civil case he's trying to handle this fallout and hoping that this really remarkable concession on his part will resolve that civil case and the judge in that ca

ruby freeman and shaye moss. >> i think it's fascinating because i don't understand, maybe he had no attorneys for those two women looking their chops because now -- there is an admission in court documents. they were materially damaged by this. the threats, they testified, at least one of them testified about what happened to them and the trauma that goes into that. that is digress for a civil suit. >> and, greg real quick, multiple republican lawmakers in georgia welcomed rudy giuliani spreading those false accusations. during numerous legislative hearings, in december 2020, how are the lawmakers reacting to giuliani's concession now? >> let's not, forget this was three different hearings in georgia in december 2020, which was a very fraught time. right now, rudy giuliani, he used those hearings as a platform to disseminate those lies and pro-election fraud conspiracy theories and fantasies. we're hearing silence from republicans who invited him to those hearings. and welcomed him. i reached out to a number of those, who would not comment. but it's interesting because governor bria

fulton county is where two election workers, ruby freeman and her daughter shaye moss were victimized. they became the victims of rudy giuliani's fake stories about election fraud. those stories were perpetuated by donald trump. we heard the powerful testimony from those two during the january 6th committee meetings. that shaye moss was afraid to do so much as go to the grocery store or speak her mother's name out loud. yes, fani willis is being smart and heads up to make sure there's no one in her county who is endangered because of whatever decisions she'll make in the next couple weeks. >> we don't want to get too far ahead of our skis. if there is an indictment, what are the most likely charges? >> i think we've long been working under the assumption, who is an expert in georgia's rico statute, is envisioning a widespread sort of indictment. we've also seen in the last couple weeks a michigan indictment by the state's attorney general where she charged only the inside folks in michigan, only the people involved in the fake electors scheme there leaving other charges related to the

election interference investigations other than giuliani's admission that that statement about ruby freeman daughter shae moss is false. it's just one more indicia of the ways in which those closest to donald trump knew the election wasn't fraudulent, particularly in georgia where the allegation is they were essentially handing between them a thumb drive of voting information which proved not to be true. in terms of this case, what it really does is it limits the dispute to liability. what is the amount of damages that rudy giuliani will be found liable for? he's admitting essentially that what he said constitutes defamation, that it inflicted emotional distress on them, but he still plans to contest liability either because they weren't damaged at all, seems improbable to me or because what he said about them are opinion statements not facts. >> giuliani is saying no, no, no, i'm not admitting to anything here. i'm not disputing it yet. i want the case to move forward. that's kind of where he is playing. he's saying i'm not fully admitting. but hannah, again, coming back to there were mult