but nasir el—rufai, the governor of kaduna state, is refusing to pay ransoms, a policy which only seemsdnappers. they have decided that they have to bring this state government to its knees by concentrating their attacks in this state. so you think that one of the reasons why they may be targeting the states is because you've made it clear that you won't pay ransoms? yes. do you think then that by making that statement, you're putting your citizens, your residents of kaduna state, at greater risk? not necessarily. i think, in the long run, or even in the medium term, it actually makes the state safer. we still have kidnappers, we have individuals being kidnapped, we even have attempted kidnap of students, they have been successful in two cases, but not on the kind of scale you've seen in other states. here in kaduna just last week, three university students were kidnapped. yes. so how can you tell their parents that their children were safer? i commiserate with the parents, i sympathise with them, but that will not change our stand. the only way to end kidnapping is for societies to sta