>> rwanda? >> rwanda is. they are there.the government was going to be tried for genocide on the un .n. security council. michael barnett details this so nicely here, a political scientist. some of the most surreal moments in international diplomacy. so much of this has been declassified. george washington university's national security archives holds a bunch of these. here are examples of some of the conversations being had. go down. the note -- the security council is perplexed, also because the rwandan sits there, albeit usually silent. a clear genocide is taking place. let's pause here. april 25. we know the u.n. security council is saying clearly, a genocide is taking place. but they say it quietly. within themselves. no matter how one considers the numbers, it used to be some 1.2 million tutsi before the war, and certainly 100,000 of them have been killed off. going down. he talks about the rwandan ambassador. trying to make a compromise. i think this is such a compelling moment here, highlighted in yellow. "is this no

look at rwanda. it little tiny country. keep that in the back of your mind, because everyone here is familiar with rwanda. we all know the genocide that took place in 1994. we all have a sense of guilt, why didn't we do more? president clinton going to the airport and apologizing on behalf of the international community for not doing more. this is post some all yugoslavia is erecting of the time. capital. is the we are in particular going to pay a point of emphasis to something that is often overlooked. this area right here in the northwest part. is insight here or congo today. or congo today. there are a lot of things that go into this. leadership roles. , it wasost basic level a conflict that was reinforced by colonial role. -- rule. rwandagians were handed as a duty after world war i, writes? they did not really have any natural resources. what does rwanda produce? some tin? zinc? coffee? to my personal preference, it's not very good. pretty bitter. they do not have diamond exports, huge resources of oil. the belgians lo

the massive reversals in misfortune that rwanda knew only 15 years ago so rwanda, for example, is a countryhealth-care system. and although you couldn't-- you might not have a heart transplant there or have, you know, choose to have your malignancy treated there, if you are sick and or in a village, you can count on that system reaching you. and that's one of the reasons why reduction in early mortality has been more steeped in rwanda than anywhere else in the world. (cheers and applause) >> stephen: how long you have been doing this work? >> 30 plus years. >> stephen: and do you go yourself to some of these places around the world? >> i do. >> stephen: rough places, what are some of the most dangerous places you've been? is. >> well, i've been in very places that are unstable. and so-- . >> stephen: the house of representatives? >> i was there yesterday. >> stephen: were you really? >> yeah rz you got-- . >> stephen: you got out alive. >> i did. and they didn't get ebola. so-- i was there yesterday. (cheers and applause) >> stephen: dow ever-- okay, i understand, you know, i understand lik

rwanda's position on the conflict is well-known. our country, as well as all states of the african union has already -- always been in favor of a two state solution. despite efforts, there is yet to be a breakthrough in the peace process. for wanda -- rwanda, any final statement should be achieved through direct negotiations however painful they might be. we fully believe only a negotiated settlement will result in the emergence of an independent and viable palestinian state, living side by side with israel. the security council should step up efforts to ensure the resumption of direct negotiations for a list -- lasting solution to the conflict as on previous frameworks. parties should make serious statements to address the conflict and refrain from any provocative action that could undermine the prospect of durable peace in the region. or wanda -- rwanda doesn't believe any action by either side could bring peace to the region. on the contrary, unilateral solutions could jeopardize a situation that is always -- already fragile. pro

secretary did not pay much attention to the 1994 genocide in rwanda. 20 years later, rwanda is a member. we are ensured the international community is acting to protect and committed to hold people in account. it is stipulated in paragraph 138 -- 139 of the document of the 2005 summit. it provides of the state carries the responsibility from protecting populations from genocide, ethnic cleansing and crimes against humanity. we need to fill this responsibility as well as the response ability to use other means to protect people from these crimes. failing to protect the population, the international community must be prepared to take collective action in accordance with the u.n. charter. we believe the circular to counsel should engage the dprk on the basis of these. mr. president, we take great concern of the report of the commission of inquiry which was the human rights council in 2013. we need to investigate the important human rights violations in the dprk. we were alarmed by the findings of the commission which documented several crimes like extermination, murder, torture imprisonmen

i would like to thank the representative of rwanda for his statement. i am now going to give the floor to the representative of lithuania. president, i thank you for containing this open meeting at the request of member states. the secretaries general for their briefings. as other security council members have called for this meeting, we believe that there are violations of human rights as detailed in the report. the 370-page report is a profoundly disturbing read, as we have heard from others earlier in this meeting. hundreds of thousands perished. more were physiologically and psychologically maimed iv regime that seeks to dominate every aspect of its citizens lives and terrorizes them from within. the very idea of this contract between a state and it citizens -- it's citizens, -- its citizens. exterminate, enslavement, forced abortions, pray the nations -- note abuse is judged harsh.h -- too state gave presidents to military spending and a nuclear's program. provocative ballistic missile and rocket launches have been condemned by the security council

i would also like to thank secretary kerry for his visit to rwanda last may.nd after his visit, many things have in happening between our two countries. of course, after that, we have the summit of african heads of state here in the u.s. during that meeting. and goa and the u.s. signed the bank agreement, which will allow us to finance transportation projects, as well as energy projects also. with the ambassador in angola, we have been accelerating our cooperation, which has opened the way to meetings of the technical groups, preparing for the summit about security and energy at the gulf of guinea, which will take place at the beginning next year, probably during the first quarter. we observed that the level of the agreements, are witnessed of a corporation between and goa and the u.s. our conversation, today, was especially important, because we did not just talk about the bilateral issues, as secretary kerry mentioned. we talked about human rights. we talked about our agreement on human trafficking, and the corporation that we have among our institutions and

secretary did not pay much attention to the 1994 genocide in rwanda. 20 years later, rwanda is a member. we are ensured the international community is acting to protect and committed to hold people in account. it is stipulated in paragraph 138 -- 139 of the document of the 2005 summit. it provides of the state carries the responsibility from protecting populations from genocide, ethnic cleansing and crimes against humanity. we need to fill this responsibility as well as the response ability to use other means to protect people from these crimes. failing to protect the population, the international community must be prepared to take collective action in accordance with the u.n. charter. we believe the circular to counsel should engage the dprk on the basis of these. mr. president, we take great concern of the report of the commission of inquiry which was the human rights council in 2013. we need to investigate the important human rights violations in the dprk. by the findings of the commission which documented several crimes like extermination, murder, torture, imprisonment, forced abort

but we specifically talked about it in rwanda. what we once do is strengthen the bilateral relationship so we can make rugrats on all the but alsoral issues bilateral issues, which means education, exchange, infrastructure development. there are many things we think we can do on health and health care and other kinds of things. technology, technology transfer. we understand the challenge in infrastructure, one of the main challenges, i think. we feel there are many ways in which the united states could be helpful in that process, where we would like to be able to cooperate. we definitively, particularly in the age of climate change, and in an age where many people are looking for diversity with respect to energy sources, we want to have a diversified economic relationship with an goa, and that means broadening its base. to detract, as the minister knows better than anybody, attracting investment and attracting capital, it requires stability, certainty, clarity, and the rules of the road. it requires transparency, accountability, a

rightly talks about american involvement in late 20th century international crises like the genocide in rwanda and conflicts in somalia. he describes how well-intentioned international efforts can destabilize countries and create additional problems. he specifically lo

terms of security for them to do so. >> researcher in africa division of human rights joining us from rwandahank you for your time >> thanks for having me. >> we will have more on that story later in the program and speaking with the u.n. special representative and the central african republican, the general. let's move on now and five suspected of belonging to boko haram attacked a town in the northeast and a number of people said to be killed and wounded in the state and many people had already left for safer areas after neighboring towns were attacked. police officers and tribesmen in central iraq retaken the town located west of the ramadi city and had been under the control of the islamic state of iraq and lavant for a week and 22 i.s.i.l. fighters were killed in the operation. the president of iraq's kurdish region is promising to crush i.s.i.l. and made the comments as he met troops on mt. sinjar on sunday and they are facing the distance from sooil fighters in the town of sinjar and that it was far from cleared. to egypt with five members of the armed group have been killed by police

i visited the port of rwanda, i met with energy company executives, and i about the numbers of anbolans that are being mired and being trained in that industry. i also saw first has been how improvingments are the business climate and angola's economic integration into the region. oweally leveraging ang ways. sohip in many we need to make sure that this progress continues. we stand,r that when we stand together, and when we nations that are trying to make the kind of today,s that angola is success.are in the this is a moment great opportunity for the u.s. and angola partnership. it also a moment of decision. we would like to be angola's choice --of partner of choice. so we're making the right choices now i think on global and.ity and the u. n. so minister chikoti, thank you your visit. these are important days, as i've said, we need to work other, i rely on each know you do and we do. and we very much look forward to building the strength of the .artnership and i'm very happy to have you back here in washington. >> thank you. >> thank you, my friend. interpreter). >> first, to thank sec

the security council, australia, chile, france, jordan, lithuania, luxembourg, republic of korea, rwanda, united kingdom, and the united states are deeply concerned about the situation in the democratic people's republic of korea. we are particularly concerned by the scale and gravity of human rights violations detailed in the comprehensive report undertaken by the u.n. human rights council commission of inquiry in the democratic people's republic of korea -- document a contained in document -- these violations threaten to have a destabilizing impact in the maintenance of international peace and security. , we would like to request the situation in the democratic people's republic of korea be formally placed on the council's agenda without prejudice to the item on nonproliferation in the dpr k. meeting of the security council on the situation in democratic people's republic of korea, pursuant tool number two of the council -- the councils provisional rules of procedure and request a senior official from the u.n. secretariat and a senior official from the u.n. office of the high commissio

he personally sponsors five children in rwanda, mongolia and other countries.also visited a school in ethiopia that was built from donations. >> translator: this girl wearing a pink shirt, i asked her what her dream was and she shyly told me she wanted to be a nurse. i realized by building schools, i'm giving her an opportunity to have a dream. that's what keeps me going. >> reporter: more and more people in wakao's community are joining his efforts. neighbors stop by to purchase treats and support his cause. >> translator: i feel very warmhearted if my purchase can give a little help to the children. >> reporter: i'm at a high school near the factory. students here are lending their support to wakao's project. recently, a student who found wakao's activity inspiring took the sweets to a school festival. the students sold more than 200 boxes. >> translator: i'm honored. students can only do little things, but those who bought the products leave with a big smile on their faces. i think that's wonderful. >> reporter: wakao is donating a part of the organization's

there are clearly real needs on the ground and we've seen as we just mentioned a kind of slow motion rwanda over the last three and a half years. and the important thing to keep in mind is that the refugees are actually lucky ones. the 6 million to 7 million inside syria are actually in worst shape -- worse shape, have little access and few stores to go to and under considerable danger. so being a refugee is actually a leg up on the others. the importance of course i think in your distinction between pallettes and cards is it's a little easier domestically to sell to iowa farmers the idea of getting rid of surplus the u.s. government particularly in this congress in ponying up additional resources to put on debit cards in the middle east. >> do the debit cards work better, more efficiently, with the native populations? you know these countries that we're talking about have had a rough 21st century. they took hundreds of thousands of iraqi refugees, now millions of syrian refugees, there must be some domestic disruption that comes from that kind of pace and that kind of burden. is someone wi

we've seen as we just mentioned a slow motion rwanda over the last three and a half years. the important thing to keep in mind that the refugees are actually the lucky ones. the $6 billion tthe 6 billion and 7 billion left in syria are under considerable danger. being a refugee is actually a leg up on the others. the importance, of course, in your distinction is that it's easier domestically to sell to iowa farmers, the idea of getting rid of surpluses versus the u.s. government, particularly with this congress ponying up additional resources to put on debit cards in the middle east. >> do the debit cards work better, more efficiently with the native population? >> these countries that we're talking about have had a rough 21st century. they've taken in hundreds of iraqi refugees, now syrian refugees. there has to be disruption that comes with that kind of pace and burden. is someone with a card more compatible with the local economy than someone who is getting free food from someone else that they may divert it to the local economy? >> absolutely. almost everyone in the hum

i think you. -- i thank you. >> i would like to thank the representative of rwanda for his statement and will now give the floor to the representative of lithuania. >> mr. president, i thank you for convening this meeting at the request of some member states. lithuania welcomes this public briefing on a situation in the democratic people's republic of korea as other security council members. we believe that the gravity of human rights violations from the democratic people's republic of korea detailed in the report threaten to have destabilizing impact on the region in the maintenance of international peace and security. the 370 page report based on extensive testimony is a profoundly disturbing read as we have heard earlier in this meeting. perished,f thousands and many more were psychologically main and their commission to dominate every aspect of their citizens lives. their ideal of a social contract's resumes -- contract is reduced to not, ruthlessly enforcing almost complete denial of their reno -- of their freedom. extermination, enslavement, torture, prolonged starvation -- end

and thanks to the united states and australian, and also special appear ration for the president of rwandahe president of nigeria. i spoke with both of them they told me and promised me personally that they would not support this resolution. they kept their word and that's what clenched this matter. >> let's go live to ramallah. i mentioned something about it an hour ago, a senior palestinian leader saying no more waiting. we will meet and make decisions. what kinds of decisions can be made? >> well, david this was supposed to be a day of major celebration, you might be able to hear sirens and drums behind me. there is a huge procession going on behind me. the reason for that is is today marks 50 years since the creation of the fattah party. i think in their calculus they would also be celebrating the passing of that u.n. resolution with the nine votes, but that wasn't the case and that has cast a shadow over these celebrations. whatever the case in an hour or two the palestinian leadership will be meeting, discussing how they can move this forward, and they seem to be determined to do jus

. >> genocide, you know, is adolf hitler, rwanda. >> reporter: which ended in an argument over how to bring police and the community together. >> you're saying diversification works -- >> i'm not one person -- >> it's policy. >> reporter: many passing by told us they think in some cases police are being unfairly targeted. the one thing everyone could agree on is that change is necessary. >> it's an important conversation that's way overdue. and black lives matter. latino lives matter. gay lives matter. cops' lives matter. >> reporter: in about an hour in berkeley, musicians are expected to gather to sing songs that call for social justice. it's going to be a fund-raiser to raise money for the family of michael brown, who was killed by a police officer in ferguson, missouri. all the proceeds will go to his family. >>> some bay area police officers left for the east coast to pay respects to the two nypd officers ambushed and killed in the line of duty. eight san francisco police officers flew to new york today. this as the wake for officer rafael ramos attracted a big crowd of mourners.

rwanda's position on the conflict is well-known. our country, as well as all states of the african union has already -- always been in favor of a two state solution. despite efforts, there is yet to be a breakthrough in the peace process. for wanda -- rwanda, any final statement should be achieved through direct negotiations, however painful they might be. we fully believe only a negotiated settlement will result in the emergence of an independent and viable palestinian state, living side by side with israel. the security council should step up efforts to ensure the resumption of direct negotiations for a list -- lasting solution to the conflict as on previous frameworks. parties should make serious statements to address the conflict and refrain from any provocative action that could undermine the prospect of durable peace in the region. rwanda doesn't believe any action by either side could bring peace to the region. on the contrary, unilateral solutions could jeopardize a situation that is always -- already fragile. provided the r

today, rwanda is thriving.the president credited with stoping the slaughter and putting the country back together, paul kagame is also accused of brutally suppressing dissent. so is kagame a savior or a dictator? we sent journalist sorious samura to find out. >> for centuries the tribes of this country lived together without tribal atrocities, and

thanks to the united states and australia and also special thank you for the president of nyjer and rwanda. rwanda.they kept their word and that's what clinched this matter. >> let's hear from imtiaz tyab. >> from the palestinian side disappointment that they did not secure the nine votes. we do know that the palestinian leadership will meet later on today. they may announce whatever future steps they may take. but as we hear from the israeli prime minister, benjamin netanyahu, israel is very pleased the palestinians did not secure the eight votes needed. he did go on to thank the nigerian leader goodluck jonathan. the palestinians are thinking what they will do next. we heard from the palestinian side he going as far as saying the u.n. security council isn't a place that they're going to give up on, that there's a reasonable chance that they could go back to the u.n. security council, as well as investigating other place he where they can pursue their cause as well. >> the questions first why palestinians would want to push that full so through so fast when they knew the united states cou

here's the president of rwanda. >> aid leads to more aid and more aid and more aid and less independence of people receiving aid. >> and we heard president clinton say this isn't working. and even obama said aid isn't as good as capitalism. >> what you're seeing hopefully is that people are starting to recognize that the current way of thinking is broken. let's rethink our assumptions and our beliefs about how we think about poor people and how we think about economics. john: thank you michael. we're out of time. coming up child labor. >> early in the morning, children board a school bus, but they're not headed to school they're going to work. john: going to work in north carolina. and my guest guests says good, let children work. debate about that next. >> oh, no that boy's hands are bleeding. child labor is evil. this is a video game made for a so-called educational tv channel. and what education do people get? some obvious truths sweatshops are cruel. workers are overworked in dangerous conditions. american companies ignore the abuses because they make money and that means child worke

as a foreign service officer for about 25 years and i served during that period of time in kosovo, rwanda, afghanistan, iraq and darfur. does fight wars over period of about 10 years committed to do a good job of taking care of myself between those times. so i developed a really series case of post-traumatic stress disorder and so myself one day out in the desert with a pistol in my hand ready to kill myself. serendipitously i was interrupted in the act, and the book is a story of how i got to the point and i got myself home. >> you wasn't hard as in the demand especially to write this book? >> i think being in a matter of having been in the to really made no difference. it was hard to write the book because it's difficult to stand in front of people and say, my mind was in such bad shape that is ready to kill myself. but the struggle is a story of hope that no matter how bad is good, there is a way home. that's what hope people take away from it that there is a better way. >> i was thinking more that with the military culture, the more, you know, you've got to be strong, you can show tha

i'm willing to say that rwanda is a case, syria, kosovo. and we could act not alone, but on behalf of the people, on behalf of the values we say we stand for. that is vital interest. it's just that you don't see it compromised in the same way you see someone inviting a boarder or killing a citizens. you don't see it. it's there, it's insidious, and it damages the united states in the eyes of the world, and the eyes of the people in a way that really is terribly dangerous. >> you were the first woman to head the office of policy planning at the state department. you were the first woman dean of the woodrow wilson school. you have degrees from harvard, princeton, oxford. you have written a bunch of books. two years ago you wrote an article that became a media sensation, turning you into a media sensation, entitled why women still can't have it all. what can we do so men and women have the ability to have their careers and be involved parents. >> three things, one is flexibility. when i'm the boss, i say if family comes first, work will not co

here's the president of rwanda. >> aid leads to more aid and more aid and more aid and less independencee receiving aid. john: and we heard president clinton say this isn't working, and even bono is saying aid isn't as good as capitalism. so things are changing. >> what you're seeing hopefully is people start to recognize that the current way of thinking is broken. let's rethink our assumptions and beliefs how we think about poor people and think about economics. john: thank you, michael, we're out of time. >>> coming up, child labor. >> early in the morning, children board a school bus, but they're not headed to school. they're going to work. john: going to work in north carolina. and next guest says good, let children work! debate about that next. ♪ (holiday music is playing) hey! i guess we're going to need a new santa ♪(the music builds to a climax.) more people are coming to audi than ever before. see why now is the best time. audi will cover your first month's payment on select models at the season of audi sales event. visit audioffers.com today. if every u.s. household with here's

in new jersey we had an issue with -- a lot of issues, but two schoolchildren from rwanda who were almost kicked out of school. there was a schoolteacher in kentucky who had visited africa and was almost forced to resign. why is the ebola crisis triggering such high levels of anxiety? is it a marker of racial tensions? is it something else going on? what do you guys think? >> i'm not an anthropologist, and so what i would say is i cannot really explain why the direction of ebola has been what it has been in america. what i can say is what we've been trying to address that. and so we have been working very hard to make sure that those who are involved in treating the disease, both overseas and her at home, are not subjected and their families are not subjected to stigmatization or ostracism, anything like that, but are celebrated for what they are, which is heroes. i think part of this is just a need to do more educating, more informing about the low-level risks that are involved here and getting to be more aware with that. we've seen this for health care workers in america. people at bell

many dpeem this well, but what the farmers did in haiti and rwanda, you don't go in and help people and get out, you go in and train people and you make a situation there where they will stay, they will teach others and it will become a self sustaining issue. you do it and you train someone and they do it and train someone. we had that experience in a positive way 30 years ago when i was director. we set up a unit of exchange back and forth in mali. we had trained people who were global health students who came in to the nih and we went there. that turned out to be interesting because it focused just on malaria. now the people who were trained there and who trained people who trained people and on and on, in that area, they have an infrastructure that made it easy. they never would have been able to do that if they didn't have that. we need to continue to make it sustainable in the countries that are involved. >> there is a bit of a mismatch, 17,000 cases in west africa and 11 in the u.s. yet the public discourse in the days before your appointment, what have we learned about how diffic

so i am willing to say that at some point rwanda is definitely a case, i think syria is a case and kosovo would have been a case where there was an action so horrific and we could agency not alone, but we could act on behalf of the people, on behalf of the values we say we stand for. i think that is a vital interest. it's just that you don't see it being compromised in the same way you see somebody you know invading a border or killing a citizen. you don't see it but it's there. it's insidious and it damages the united states in the eyes of the world. in the eyes of the people. in a way that really is terribly dangerous. >> you were the first woman to head the office of policy planning at the state department. you are the first woman dean of the woodrow wilson school of public affairs, you've got degrees from harvard from princeton from oxford. uh two years ago you wrote an article that became a media sensation, turned you into a media sensation, entitled, why women still can't have it all. why can't they? >> three things. one is much more flexibility at work. when i'm the boss i say, if

when we begin to ask questions of people, we have problems like the ones we had in rwanda. it is extremely complicated and difficult. i don't know we are going to resolve that issue and bring extremely strong opinions that come from different parts of the world with different frames together. but that's the job, not just of me but of the board. so this is why multilateralism is so extremely difficult. you have powerful forces on our board that are arguing about these things all the time. i will do my best to come to an agreement that projects -- that protects people, the environment. we will do everything to get there. because we have 188-member countries and group of governors, we have to do it within the context and i hope others will be continued to be engaged in the discussion of this process as we go forward. >> i would like to ask particularly in the sustainment of development standards why the bank has not included in the draft documents that were discussed recently, mandatory gender standards? i think without the women of the world, the world is not going to move fo

. >> with the president in south america and rwanda, china, moscow, jim angle, fox news. >> and he waspool reporter on president bush's historic air force one trip into iraq. >> to get here, the president slipped out of his ranch in crawford in unmarked cars, leaving even some secret service agents there thinking he was still home. >> in recent months and years, jim has provided viewers a detailed look at a complex bill and then law. obamacare. >> the exchanges need far more than 25% of the young to keep rates from soaring. supplemental policies could also attract employers trying to avoid the 40% cadillac tax under obamacare. >> and he always did it with his texas straight talk and often a laugh. [ laughter ] >> he yes. beware, people holding plywood bears and creeping through the woods. >> we're going to miss jim angle. good luck, jim in he retirement. i'm told the red wine tastes even better in retirement. so from all of us here, cheers. thanks for inviting us into your home tonight. that's it for this "special report." fair, balanced and unafraid. greta goes "on the record" right n

but what they did in heat with being rwanda, you don't just go in, help people and get out, but you go in, you train people and you make a situation there where they will stay, they will teach others and it will become a self-sustaining issue where you do it, you train someone, they do it, they train someone. we had that experience in a very positive way 30 years ago when i first became director. we set up a unit of exchange back and forth in mali. we had trained people who were global health students who came from mali to the nih, and then we went there. that turned out to be an interesting model because it started is off focusing just on malaria. now the people who were trained there and who trained people who trained people, and on and on, that in that area, they have an infrastructure there that made it very easy when the case went to mali to all of a sudden contact trace 300, 400 people. they never would have been able to do that if they didn't have that. we need to continue to make it sustainable in the countries that are involved. >> there is a bit of a mismatch, 17,000 cases in

. >> genocide is adolf hitler, rwanda. >> reporter: which ended in an argument over how to bring police and the community together. >> you're putting it on an individual. >> it's policy that makes a difference. >> reporter: many of these passing by told us they think in some cases police are being unfairly targeted. the one thing everyone could agree on is that change is necessary. >> it's an important conversation that's way overdue. and black lives matter, latino lives matter, gay lives matter, cops' lives matter. >> reporter: organizers of today's protest say this isn't something that will end any time soon. they say they will continue to protest until they see change. >>> the market ended up slightly after a light day of trade iiniw closed at another record, staying above 18,000. >>> it's almost as much a tradition as last-minute shopping -- post-christmas shopping. consumers heading back to the mall for bargains. business and tech reporter scott budman was there to meet them, scott, what'd you get me? >> reporter: it's a surprise, terry, a post-christmas surprise, if you will. tell

president clinton said his biggest regret was not doing anything about rwanda, should we have? >> it should be part of the debate, but what can you actually do realistically and practically? what can be done? and that's one thing that strikes me. if you haven't read this week's new yorker there was a story about samantha power in there. i think in essence, it's because we could in libya. there seemed to be a pathway towards success and something could be done where our actions would actually lead to fewer lives being lost as opposed to more. and i think it's a serious analytical debate today and it's a reason why the obama administration is stuck, paralyzed. on the one hand he said assad must go, and there's a strand inside his own head and his administration that says we can't overlook sort of the stacks of tens of thousands of bodies and what he's done to his own people and work with him. and then there's also this strand of, if you want to call it realist, realism who say we want to end the conflict, we've got to work with him or his inner circle. so i think that ideal is al